Chargers @ Jaguars Playoff Game Thread (i.e. NOT a Bills thread;-)

[JGMcD2]

Just now, dma0034 said:

 

 

I mean if you want to mention his weapons but ignore the Bills have had a top defense the last 3 years and an All-Pro WR themselves so be it.

I didn’t say ANYTHING about the Bills. 
 

I just commented on a very specific point… “It’s all on Mahomes” 

[dma0034]

Just now, JGMcD2 said:

I didn’t say ANYTHING about the Bills. 
 

I just commented on a very specific point… “It’s all on Mahomes” 

 

 

It is... just like it's all on Allen. Neither team has a rushing attack so they are forced to pass. 

[billybob71]

was exciting 2nd half comeback and Al Michaels sounded like he was ready to fall asleep

[AlfaBill]

4 minutes ago, dma0034 said:

 

Well that's not true. They do have a better OLine. See you are arguing talent and I'm arguing with achievements. Without the accomplishments I personally will not put Allen above Mahomes even if Allen is probably the more physically gifted player. 

The problem is accomplishments are team achievements. Unless we speak of MVP or pro bowls. IMO Josh has less to work with and does a heck of lot. With a good OL and a quality WR2 he would be unstoppable. 

[Governor]

The Jags scored 31 points and nearly shutout their opponent in 1 half of football.

[Motorin']

3 minutes ago, billybob71 said:

was exciting 2nd half comeback and Al Michaels sounded like he was ready to fall asleep

 

Absolutely, he should hang it up. 

[newcam2012]

4 minutes ago, AlfaBill said:

The problem is accomplishments are team achievements. Unless we speak of MVP or pro bowls. IMO Josh has less to work with and does a heck of lot. With a good OL and a quality WR2 he would be unstoppable. 

I agree but accomplishments matter too. The QB always gets the glory and vice versa. Until Allen gets a ring he will always be Mahomes understudy. 

[dma0034]

1 minute ago, AlfaBill said:

The problem is accomplishments are team achievements. Unless we speak of MVP or pro bowls. IMO Josh has less to work with and does a heck of lot. With a good OL and a quality WR2 he would be unstoppable. 

 

I don't disagree with that... but Allen has also had a top 3? defense the last three years too. So the Bills invest their draft capitol into Defense and the Chiefs use theirs on Offense. The idea is that the Chiefs want to outscore you. They want to put up 30 points a game. Bills are more balanced; which means even when Allen has a bad game the Defense is normally good enough to bail him out. In order to beat the Bills you have to be A. lucky B. limit the Offense and C. make enough plays against the Defense. Guess it's just one of those opinions thing

[RocCityRoller]

24 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

Didn’t answer the question? So I will for you. He got those numbers in year 4 a seasoned vet.. not Year 2. He also did it with a heck of a lot more talent around him.  Meanwhile a fairer comparison would be in his first playoff game the Bills choked away a big lead and lost in OT. The Bills were not ready Yet. Allan wasn’t ready yet! It took him another year and season be ready.  
 

I don’t understand why some bills fans feel

so threatened when you say another QB looks damn good and may be special.. like we spit in your soup or something.  Both QBs can be special! Doesn’t make Allen worse or. Anything. 

 

This is an apples and oranges comparison. I am enjoying the AFC QB bonanza because we have one of the top 5.

 

Allen was a physical freak, but raw and needed development. He also landed on a team with a defensive head coach. He became Josh Allen.

 

Lawrence was considered pro-ready day 1. He landed with one of the worst HC ever in his rookie year and it showed. With a former NFL QB as coach he started to show being an excellent NFL QB in the second half of his second season. Now this. Amazing!

 

Not sure Allen has had a half of football as bad as Lawrence had today. It was Peterman bad. This is why you are getting grief. Fans can point to halves of games where Allen and Lawrence helped put up 30 points.

 

I've been on the 'Jags are dangerous' beat for a while. Plenty of posts where I said 'Jags are coming' or such. There are literally half a dozen very good to great young QBs in the league. They just happen to be in the AFC. We are happy to finally have one of them. Look at the stretch of QBs from Kelly to Allen. It should be easy to understand the homerism. Pats fans keep thinking the next QB will be Brady, they won't. Also as Bills fans we have seen a comeback like this, in the playoffs, from our back up QB (Reich vs Oilers). Still great to see.

 

Mahomes and Burrow have led their teams to Super Bowls. I put Allen in the top 3 of AFC QBs. I think there are fair reasons to go Mahomes and even Burrow at or above Allen. But I like my guy. Allen does things those guys can't. Mahomes and Burrow have gone to the Super Bowl, Allen hasn't.

 

Lawrence, Herbert and Jackson are a tier below IMO. Still a loaded conference of terrific QBs. One of those QBs will rise to Mahomes/Burrow/Allen level soon. My bet would be Lawrence too. Will be tough sledding in the AFC for a long time. Tua/ Wilson/ Jones won't get it done vs Mahomes/ Burrow/ Allen/ Lawrence.

 

Yeah Lawrence just elevated a level. Maybe not Mahomes/Burrows/Allen level yet, but he is knocking on the door and just passed Herbert and Jackson.

 

 

[newcam2012]

4 minutes ago, Governor said:

The Jags scored 31 points and nearly shutout their opponent in 1 half of football.

The Jags are a nice feel good story. However, they won't come close to winning in Arrowhead. Their path to the AFC championship game is ridiculously easy. 

[ArtVandalay]

1 minute ago, newcam2012 said:

The Jags are a nice feel good story. However, they won't come close to winning in Arrowhead. Their path to the AFC championship game is ridiculously easy. 

Could have been the Bills that's why #1 seed is so important. 

[dma0034]

3 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

The Jags are a nice feel good story. However, they won't come close to winning in Arrowhead. Their path to the AFC championship game is ridiculously easy. 

 

 

Hey a lot of people said that about the Bengals last year. The Jags will be fired up next week after this win. I would have given them 0% chance before this game.... now I can see it at like 10%. If Mahomes throws a couple timely INTs who knows what happens. Jags can control the clock with their rushing attack too. 

[newcam2012]

2 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

 

This is an apples and oranges comparison. I am enjoying the AFC QB bonanza because we have one of the top 5.

 

Allen was a physical freak, but raw and needed development. He also landed on a team with a defensive head coach. He became Josh Allen.

 

Lawrence was considered pro-ready day 1. He landed with one of the worst HC ever in his rookie year and it showed. With a former NFL QB as coach he started to show being an excellent NFL QB in the second half of his second season. Now this. Amazing!

 

Not sure Allen has had a half of football as bad as Lawrence had today. It was Peterman bad. This is why you are getting grief. Fans can point to halves of games where Allen and Lawrence helped put up 30 points.

 

I've been on the 'Jags are dangerous' beat for a while. Plenty of posts where I said 'Jags are coming' or such. There are literally half a dozen very good to great young QBs in the league. They just happen to be in the AFC. We are happy to finally have one of them. Look at the stretch of QBs from Kelly to Allen. It should be easy to understand the homerism. Pats fans keep thinking the next QB will be Brady, they won't. Also as Bills fans we have seen a comeback like this, in the playoffs, from our back up QB (Reich vs Oilers). Still great to see.

 

Mahomes and Burrow have led their teams to Super Bowls. I put Allen in the top 3 of AFC QBs. I think there are fair reasons to go Mahomes and even Burrow at or above Allen. But I like my guy. Allen does things those guys can't. Mahomes and Burrow have gone to the Super Bowl, Allen hasn't.

 

Lawrence, Herbert and Jackson are a tier below IMO. Still a loaded conference of terrific QBs. One of those QBs will rise to Mahomes/Burrow/Allen level soon. My bet would be Lawrence too. Will be tough sledding in the AFC for a long time. Tua/ Wilson/ Jones won't get it done vs Mahomes/ Burrow/ Allen/ Lawrence.

 

Yeah Lawrence just elevated a level. Maybe not Mahomes/Burrows/Allen level yet, but he is knocking on the door and just passed Herbert and Jackson.

 

 

Lawrence was terrible in the first half. That's being nice. 

 

In the second half he wasn't anything special. He threw short passes that his WR made lots of YAC. Of course, he made a few good plays and led his team to a win. He gets some credit there. However, I didn't see anything special out of him even in the second half. I thought it was more of a team wib than him carrying the team. 

[Beck Water]

24 minutes ago, dma0034 said:

He is the MVP this year (1st team All-Pro) and did it with only Kelce and a bunch of scrub WRs. Bills have yet to beat him in the playoffs

 

"A bunch of scrub WR?"  ROTFL. 

 

Juju Smith Schuster is far from a "scrub WR".  He came close to 1000 yds as a rookie and was pro-bowl with 111 receptions and >1400 yds his 2nd year.  He fell off in 2019 with the likes of Mason Rudolph and Duck Hodges throwing to him, and in 2021 when he was injured and only played 5 games, but other than that, he's been what he's been for the Chiefs this year - a 58 yd per game, 77% catch guy.  If he's a scrub and never had it, why did the Chiefs pay him $3.8M on a 1 year "prove you still got it after your injuries" deal?

 

And if Marquez Valdes-Scantling is such a scrub, why did KC offer him 3 years, $30M guaranteed?

 

These guys aren't Davonte Adams or Tyreek Hill, but they're at worst, proven good quality NFL receivers.

 

If he's a scrub, why did KC draft Skyy Moore in the 2nd round?  Kadarius Toney cost next year's 3rd round pick, and of course Mecole Hardmen is a former 2nd round Chiefs pick.  That's a goodly draft pick investment for "a bunch of scrubs.

[SydneyBillsFan]

1 hour ago, chongli said:

 

Here ya go:

 

https://www.thepowderblues.com/forum/forum/los-angeles-chargers-forum-nfl-forum-padres-forum/the-los-angeles-chargers-forum/1453682-disaster-post-game-meltdown-thread

 

[also the end of their game day thread a little below]

 

From the bolts board:

Why bother making the playoffs if you're going to play like that and fluck up your draft position?

Just give Peyton whatever he wants and let someone competent run this team. If they still stumble at least I'll be content that it was done in the hands of professionals and not these clowns.

Even better would be the NFL stepping in and declaring that the Chargers are hurting the NFL brand and orders them immediately disbanded and erased from all record books. A fitting end to a schittty franchise.

Edited January 15, 2023 by SydneyBillsFan

[newcam2012]

1 minute ago, dma0034 said:

 

 

Hey a lot of people said that about the Bengals last year. The Jags will be fired up next week after this win. I would have given them 0% chance before this game.... now I can see it at like 10%. If Mahomes throws a couple timely INTs who knows what happens. Jags can control the clock with their rushing attack too. 

Why would you have given them a zero percent chance prior to the game? That's way out of line with almost every football expert or fan I know. The Vegas line was -2.5 only. 

 

I give them about a 5% chance to win in Arrowhead. That might even be a little high. 

8 minutes ago, ArtVandalay said:

Could have been the Bills that's why #1 seed is so important. 

Yep. 

[LABILLBACKER]

18 minutes ago, AlfaBill said:

The problem is accomplishments are team achievements. Unless we speak of MVP or pro bowls. IMO Josh has less to work with and does a heck of lot. With a good OL and a quality WR2 he would be unstoppable. 

Our OL this season ranked 27th.  And our WR2 was underwhelming.  And this doesn't even include our reluctance to establish a more consistent run attack.  

[Beck Water]

26 minutes ago, dma0034 said:

It is... just like it's all on Allen. Neither team has a rushing attack so they are forced to pass. 

 

Hi.  KC doesn't rush often, but they have quite a competent rushing attack that doesn't heavily depend upon Mahomes.  4.7 ypa, 8 th in the league.  Mahomes contributes 20 ypg to the 116 ypg total.  Which is, just a bit below league average of 120 ypg.

 

So yeah, the Chiefs do have a rushing attack. 

 

If you gonna shill for your team, do so from a position of facts, not this "oh poor woe is Chiefs all we have is scrub wide receivers like former probowler Juju SS and the former Packer we're paying $10M/yr" and "oh poor woe is Chiefs we can't run even though when we try we chop off 4.7 ypa which is top-10 in the league"

Edited January 15, 2023 by Beck Water

[dma0034]

5 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

"A bunch of scrub WR?"  ROTFL. 

 

Juju Smith Schuster is far from a "scrub WR".  He came close to 1000 yds as a rookie and was pro-bowl with 111 receptions and >1400 yds his 2nd year.  He fell off in 2019 with the likes of Mason Rudolph and Duck Hodges throwing to him, and in 2021 when he was injured and only played 5 games, but other than that, he's been what he's been for the Chiefs this year - a 58 yd per game, 77% catch guy.  If he's a scrub and never had it, why did the Chiefs pay him $3.8M on a 1 year "prove you still got it after your injuries" deal?

 

And if Marquez Valdes-Scantling is such a scrub, why did KC offer him 3 years, $30M guaranteed?

 

These guys aren't Davonte Adams or Tyreek Hill, but they're at worst, proven good quality NFL receivers.

 

If he's a scrub, why did KC draft Skyy Moore in the 2nd round?  Kadarius Toney cost next year's 3rd round pick, and of course Mecole Hardmen is a former 2nd round Chiefs pick.  That's a goodly draft pick investment for "a bunch of scrubs.

 

 

Really!?! Juju averaged: under 4 catches a game and 32 yards a game in his last year with Pitt. 6 catches and 52 yards a game and 3.5 catches and 46 yards a game the 2 years before. That would be: 544, 884 and 782 over a full season..... MVS is a deep threat with a career high of under 700 yards. Moore did very little as did Toney.... but they drafted those WRs because they realized their WRs weren't very good. 

[RocCityRoller]

9 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Lawrence was terrible in the first half. That's being nice. 

 

In the second half he wasn't anything special. He threw short passes that his WR made lots of YAC. Of course, he made a few good plays and led his team to a win. He gets some credit there. However, I didn't see anything special out of him even in the second half. I thought it was more of a team wib than him carrying the team. 

 

Sleeping on Lawrence is silly. The Jags lack speed to be quick striking. Lawrence did exactly what he needed to, within his own offense to get the job done. Allen and Lawrence have played in the same number of Super Bowls, 0. Lawrence controlled a game that could have gotten away from him. Kirk/ Z Jones/ M Jones/ Engram are not exactly a quick strike offense. Yet those guys erased a 27 point difference.

 

It is ok to admit other players in the league do amazing things, and other coaches rally their teams without disliking your own team.