Panthers request to interview Dorsey for HC

[Mrbojanglezs]

McDermott is a great leader but we should have hired an offensive coach. This will be an issue almost every year 

[Process]

2 minutes ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

McDermott is a great leader but we should have hired an offensive coach. This will be an issue almost every year 

Mahomes has it so good

[C.Biscuit97]

I would hate that hire as a Panthers fan (all 12 of them). I think he has done some good things and is growing in the job. But it’s one to inherit raw Allen like Daboll did and help him become the player he is. It’s another to inherit this version of Allen.

 

it’s like Nate Hackett. Dude kinda has sucked as an OC everywhere (EJ’s rookie OC (and his first nfl OC job), EJ never had a chance!).  But he worked with Rodgers and gets a head coaching job. Who won’t be good in that situation?

[GunnerBill]

4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I would hate that hire as a Panthers fan (all 12 of them). I think he has done some good things and is growing in the job. But it’s one to inherit raw Allen like Daboll did and help him become the player he is. It’s another to inherit this version of Allen.

 

it’s like Nate Hackett. Dude kinda has sucked as an OC everywhere (EJ’s rookie OC (and his first nfl OC job), EJ never had a chance!).  But he worked with Rodgers and gets a head coaching job. Who won’t be good in that situation?

 

Nate didn't even call plays in Green Bay. He made the coffee in the offensive meeting rooms real well though. 

1 hour ago, What a Tuel said:

 

I'm pretty sure he did have an offer from an undesirable team. 

 

Not sure about that but he did turn down interviews. Certainly with Philly. Not sure he turned down a job offer though. I find that hard to believe. 

[gjv]

44 minutes ago, JayBaller10 said:

It’s McD’s system, if Frazier leaves someone else will adequately fill in. Actually, some here want McD to take control of the reins now, especially for the playoffs. The talent on the field matters more and I’d happily take the TWO 3rd round draft choices in a heartbeat if Frazier were to leave. It’s my hope.
 

You say there’s not a single 3rd round draft pick that comes close in value to Leslie Frazier. Not a single one? What about a young Russell Wilson on a cost controlled contract? No? Well how about Tyrann Matheiu? Ty Hilton, Navarro Bowman, Justin Houston, Alvin Kamara, Frank Gore, Marshall Yanda, Jason Witten, Steve Smith Sr., none of those 3rd round draft choices are close in value to coach Leslie Frazier? Sure, the pick could be another Zack Moss, but there are most certainly gems in the 3rd round whose value exceeds a coordinator. 

Not so sure it's McD's system;https://www.buffalobills.com/news/a-defensive-mind-how-bills-dc-leslie-frazier-crafted-a-modern-nfl-defense-while- Sure some want him to leave but  that's an opinion that lacks a basis from a performace standpoint . Cheery picking 3rd round pick pro bowlers is cute, but it doesn't change the fact that most 3rd round players do not become pro bowlers. Most, unfortunately follow in career path of Moss. Frazier, this season, has had on average 5 starters out most games and his defense ranks in the top 10. Not to mention that since he's been DC, the Bills have been a top 10 defense in the NFL. But I guess outstanding DC are just hanging around so we can get one to adequately fill in.

[ColoradoBills]

Dorsey aside I'm just going to comment on the rules for acquiring a new HC.

 

An NFL OC is the 2nd highest coaching position in football.  A good/smart team develops their own if at all possible.

When a team promoted a new OC and after the contract is signed, I think having that coach eligible to get selected by

another team is a disservice to the NFL as a whole.

 

These new OCs need to develop just like any other player or coach.  Too many of these young guys get these jobs too quick

and it's a negative for both teams.  The team that spends all that time developing the coaching talent gets the shaft and the

acquiring team gets a coach that is not seasoned enough to have a fair chance of actually performing well.

There should be a minimum time (at least 2 or 3 years) before that should be allowed.  An exception could be made if the team

wants to trade for the talent.

 

As to the "only 32 jobs" thing that gets constantly brought up I see no problem, as every season there is a number of HC open positions.

Of course, this should apply to the DC too.

The current NFL HC carousel is starting to get a little foolish IMO.

[Low Positive]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Nate didn't even call plays in Green Bay. He made the coffee in the offensive meeting rooms real well though. 

More like Nate brews a mean pot of ayahuasca tea. All organic, of course. Nate's primary qualification in getting hired in Denver was "Aaron Rodgers homeboy." Once Rodgers decided to take the bag in GB, the Broncos were hosed.

[Just in Atlanta]

They were inspired by Jeff Saturday. 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, gjv said:

Not so sure it's McD's system;https://www.buffalobills.com/news/a-defensive-mind-how-bills-dc-leslie-frazier-crafted-a-modern-nfl-defense-while- Sure some want him to leave but  that's an opinion that lacks a basis from a performace standpoint . Cheery picking 3rd round pick pro bowlers is cute, but it doesn't change the fact that most 3rd round players do not become pro bowlers. Most, unfortunately follow in career path of Moss. Frazier, this season, has had on average 5 starters out most games and his defense ranks in the top 10. Not to mention that since he's been DC, the Bills have been a top 10 defense in the NFL. But I guess outstanding DC are just hanging around so we can get one to adequately fill in.

 

Agree with this although it is still, at its core, McDermott's system. I think he trusts Leslie totally, they have known each other for a long time... but if Leslie turned up tomorrow and said I wanna run a 3-4, heavy blitz defense with lots of man coverage Sean would tell him where he could go..... they both learnt under Jim Johnson and are at heart cover 3 guys. Leslie then spent time under Dungy in the Tampa 2 as well and the Bills are a bit of a hybrid between the two so there is some Leslie fingerprints on the scheme. And I'm sure a new DC would be allowed to do the same too once Sean trusted him. But at it is core this defense is Sean McDermott's scheme and his principles. 

[Brand J]

46 minutes ago, gjv said:

Not so sure it's McD's system;https://www.buffalobills.com/news/a-defensive-mind-how-bills-dc-leslie-frazier-crafted-a-modern-nfl-defense-while- Sure some want him to leave but  that's an opinion that lacks a basis from a performace standpoint . Cheery picking 3rd round pick pro bowlers is cute, but it doesn't change the fact that most 3rd round players do not become pro bowlers. Most, unfortunately follow in career path of Moss. Frazier, this season, has had on average 5 starters out most games and his defense ranks in the top 10. Not to mention that since he's been DC, the Bills have been a top 10 defense in the NFL. But I guess outstanding DC are just hanging around so we can get one to adequately fill in.

Never did I suggest that most 3rd rounders become pro bowl or Hall of Fame type players. I even suggested it’s more likely they’d become Zack Moss than Frank Gore/Jamal Charles/Alvin Kamara, etc., but you said there’s no 3rd rounders who would have value that exceeds Leslie Frazier, so I then pulled those 3rd rounders to refute your argument. It wasn’t “cute,” you gave me that latitude with your statement of absolutes.
 

Frazier has done okay considering the amount of players that have been injured, but to suggest he’s irreplaceable when he’s running the head coach’s defensive system is crazy. Yes, I would take the two 3rd rounders if it means Frazier is picked by some other team to become their head coach. I’d welcome it. Does he do more with less? That’s the mark of a great coordinator and when the Bills have been at nearly 100% health they’ve still come up short on defense in the playoffs when it matters. You can cling onto that top 10 ranking, but it means nothing if we can’t slow down the better offenses. Already we’re talking about how the offense will have to score at least 30 pts every game this post season for a chance to win the Lombardi. But if Frazier is as irreplaceable as you seem to think he is, this shouldn’t be the case.

[UKBillFan]

Dorsey isn't ready yet. Just one example is the final offensive series before the half on Sunday - we blitzed them on the run, made the red zone and then threw three times rather than continuing what worked. ending in an interception. It's those kinds of calls which we've seen all season and shows he still has much to learn. He'd be better off staying at Orchard Park with the likes of Brady and Kromer, learning on the job.

[Peter]

Wait a minute.

 

I remember people on this board claiming with 100% certainty that Dorsey's reaction after the first Dolphins game would ruin his chances of becoming a head coach.

 

 

[DCofNC]

20 hours ago, TheBrownBear said:

This is beyond nonsensical.

No, it’s fact.  Look at the teams with sustained success, they score points.  Their system doesn’t change, it doesn’t change because the head coach is an offensive coach so the system doesn’t leave with a coordinator.  If Bienemy finally lands a HC job, will KC suffer? Nope, Reid is the mastermind.  Look at what happened every time a coordinator left in Pittsburgh all the years of Big Ben, the Packers with Rodgers, etc.  Now what happens when a coordinator leaves the Rams, the Chiefs, the Payton era Saints etc?  Nothing, it doesn’t matter because the O runs through the stable link.

[quinnearlysghost88]

10 hours ago, Captain Hindsight said:

GMFB this morning was joking about how you won't see or hear from Kingsbury for a long time. He's going on a vacation for a loonnnnnng time. 

 

He may coach again, but to me it sounds like he is quite comfortable laying low for a while 

I believe it. I was listening to his interview on pardon my take and he just seems like the anti coach. In a good way. But definitely a guy that’s not afraid to walk away. 

[Kiva]

We should hire someone from the Chiefs/Reid tree. 

[RocCityRoller]

On 1/9/2023 at 11:33 PM, LeGOATski said:

If Dorsey leaves, Brady probably steps in and another will come up in the pipeline behind him. I'd be surprised if they brought in an outsider.

Why is everyone forgetting Mike Shula???

1 hour ago, Kiva said:

We should hire someone from the Chiefs/Reid tree. 

 

McDermott is from the Reid/ Eagles tree

[OZBILLS]

7 hours ago, UKBillFan said:

Dorsey isn't ready yet.

 

He most certainly is ready, and I will not hear otherwise!

[HappyDays]

3 hours ago, DCofNC said:

No, it’s fact.  Look at the teams with sustained success, they score points.  Their system doesn’t change, it doesn’t change because the head coach is an offensive coach so the system doesn’t leave with a coordinator.  If Bienemy finally lands a HC job, will KC suffer? Nope, Reid is the mastermind.  Look at what happened every time a coordinator left in Pittsburgh all the years of Big Ben, the Packers with Rodgers, etc.  Now what happens when a coordinator leaves the Rams, the Chiefs, the Payton era Saints etc?  Nothing, it doesn’t matter because the O runs through the stable link.

 

The Bills will never have an issue attracting top OC talent as long as Josh Allen is here. And we aren't ever going to radically change the type of offense we run. If we have to replace our OC every 2-3 years the next OC will know Allen's strengths and will basically just work with him to run the same type of offense. Case in point we went from Daboll to Dorsey and really didn't miss a beat on offense. By some metrics our offense is actually much better than last year.

[LeGOATski]

17 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

Can't forget they have Mike Shula too, the elder statesman.

 

2 hours ago, RocCityRoller said:

Why is everyone forgetting Mike Shula???

You're talking to the guy who mentioned Shula in this very thread!

[TheBrownBear]

6 hours ago, DCofNC said:

No, it’s fact.  Look at the teams with sustained success, they score points.  Their system doesn’t change, it doesn’t change because the head coach is an offensive coach so the system doesn’t leave with a coordinator.  If Bienemy finally lands a HC job, will KC suffer? Nope, Reid is the mastermind.  Look at what happened every time a coordinator left in Pittsburgh all the years of Big Ben, the Packers with Rodgers, etc.  Now what happens when a coordinator leaves the Rams, the Chiefs, the Payton era Saints etc?  Nothing, it doesn’t matter because the O runs through the stable link.

More nonsense.  

 

Also, the "stable link" is called the franchise quarterback.  It's why defensive head coaches like Belichick, Tomlin and Tony Dungy routinely fielded top-5 offenses on their way to multiple Super Bowl appearances and the Hall of Fame (eventually).