Thoughts on the pass defense?

[Billsfan1972]

50 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

No, because that isn't true either. I know nuance isn't your thing but maybe give it a go. 

Trust me I get it.  It was a tough week too.  The issue is the defence to me has been meh.  Miami was the last decent Offensive team we played and they carved up the Bills defence. 

 

Bend don't break is fine if the offence is humming, but not so sure they are either.  Seems too many long drives are required to score points. 

 

Let's all agree we're still talking about the Bills next playoff game in 4 weeks (and not 2024)!!!! 

[newcam2012]

On 1/9/2023 at 10:55 AM, section122 said:

The Bills are down to their 3rd string FS.  That alone can cause some problems.  

 

They are missing their best pass rusher that contributes to longer times to cover.

 

All that and the Bills have still won 7 in a row.

 

The Bills finished with the 5th lowest ypa against which is a strong indicator imo of pass defense.

 

They were 14th against completion % so they are allowing short passes to be completed then rallying to the tackle.

 

They gave up the 9th least td passes and tied for the 4th most interceptions.

 

They aren't as bad as people think they are, it is just an emotional reaction as they are invested in the Bills success.

I think this is fools gold here. We said this previously when the Bills had the #1 ranked defense. We all knew the defense was vastly overrated then and couldn't be trusted. They failed to make the stops when they had to. 

 

Fast forward to now. No way do I trust this defense in the playoffs vs KC, Cinci, and LA. They are just too young, injuried, inconsistent, and predictable. I hope I'm wrong but no way would I be confident that this defense in its current can make a big stop to win the game. 

 

Don't get caught up in the stats. They don't paint an accurate picture especially when it comes to playing quality playoff offenses. 

Edited January 10, 2023 by newcam2012

[BobbyC81]

1 hour ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Actually I do that a lot too, because the defense is hard to watch.  The Bills were lucky when you look at the QB's they faced during the year.  They played a lot of bad ones. 

 

Yes there are injuries, but schemes and play calling to has not been great on the defensive side.     

If you guys change the channel when the Bills are on defense, how do you know when the offense is back on the field?

[newcam2012]

14 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

I think everyone is obviously excited for the playoffs coming up and the recovery of Damar Hamlin, but the elephant in the room (thank you for bringing it up) is the pass defense for sure. Mac Jones was looking like Drew Brees out there hitting everything for most of the game. Without Hines returning those TDs, the game could’ve ended up different. But to answer your question I am very concerned. 

I agree. I will add on to your post. Burrow and the Bengals offense was shredding, gashing, and ripping apart the Bills secondary at will. Granted it was a 5 minute sample. Nevertheless, it has to raise some eyebrows. 

[Billsfan1972]

5 minutes ago, BobbyC81 said:

If you guys change the channel when the Bills are on defense, how do you know when the offense is back on the field?

PVR the games, so I go back to where I left off.  When the Defence has third & 8, I often turn the channel as I am just too nervous watching them. 

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

25 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Frazier and McDermott do make very good adjustments. They are the best 2nd half defense in the entire NFL in points given up in 2022 and they were second best in 2021. That is not coincidence. They adjust to what they see. 

 

On your last point I will repeat again, for about the 10th time, that the 49ers and the Chargers did NOT adopt the same game plans vs Miami. They defended them quite differently. 

When we play Cincy in Buffalo the following week that tells me if we can stay close early then we have a chance.

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Teams have managed an 80.1 passer rating against our defense this year. That's 4th best in the league.

 

Considering the injuries of Von Miller, Hyde and several CBs, they're playing exceptionally well. Hell, they're playing well even if you leave the injuries out of it.

 

The ship doesn't need to be righted, but adjusting the set of the sails just a bit is a good idea for nearly every team.

I think we need to look at the QBs the Bills have faced. Since week 8; Rodgers, Zach Wilson, Kousins, Brisett, Geoff, Jones, White, Tua, and Fields. None of those QBs are elite passers who scare a defense. No way this defense stops Burrows or Mahomes. They are on a different planet just like Allen is. No way their defenses stop Allen. 

[Billsfan1972]

20 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I think we need to look at the QBs the Bills have faced. Since week 8; Rodgers, Zach Wilson, Kousins, Brisett, Geoff, Jones, White, Tua, and Fields. None of those QBs are elite passers who scare a defense. No way this defense stops Burrows or Mahomes. They are on a different planet just like Allen is. No way their defenses stop Allen. 

A few spelling mistakes, but exactly what I keep saying.

 

My concern is the Bills offence too has been a little clunky at times and not running on all cylinders, which they need to be come the playoffs.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

I know. Mac Jones carved us up like a knife through butter.

 

You know how those knives are always throwing 3 INTS as they cut through butter. 243 yards!!! WOW!! Joe Montana-esque!!! I thought he was Dan Marino and Pat Mahomes combined out there!!! 5.85 Yards per attempt in the passing game.

 

75.3 passer rating. That's how the passer ratings look when knives carve through butter, isn't it?

 

And 23 points scored!!!!!!!!! He was downright Peyton Manning-esque out there!!! It almost looked like they'd sneaked Brady into Mac's jersey!!!

 

 

 

You are delusional. Seriously.

I don't agree with this post at all. In fact, I think it's pretty disingenuous. I don't care what the stats say. Jones played well, looked good, and was exploiting the Bills secondary. Don't forget to look at the stats of the Pats offense. They are arguably one of the worst offenses in the league. Not a small point to neglect. 

[GunnerBill]

4 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I don't agree with this post at all. In fact, I think it's pretty disingenuous. I don't care what the stats say. Jones played well, looked good, and was exploiting the Bills secondary. Don't forget to look at the stats of the Pats offense. They are arguably one of the worst offenses in the league. Not a small point to neglect. 

 

First half, yep. they had a good plan and he executed. The Pats average 21.5 points per game and they scored 23 on Sunday. It was a rare occasion when a team out performed their normal offense against the Bills. The second half though the Bills caught up to them. 

[Billsfan1972]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

First half, yep. they had a good plan and he executed. The Pats average 21.5 points per game and they scored 23 on Sunday. It was a rare occasion when a team out performed their normal offense against the Bills. The second half though the Bills caught up to them. 

And two Ints that were the result of fortuitous bounces (easily could have been incompletions).  They had a 60 & 85 yard drive in the second half.  Jones threw 3 Ints too (Bills fumbled twice).  

 

You really are a glass half full guy (admittedely I'm half empty).

[GunnerBill]

Just now, Billsfan1972 said:

And two Ints that were the result of fortuitous bounces (easily could have been incompletions).  They had a 60 & 85 yard drive in the second half.  Jones threw 3 Ints too (Bills fumbled twice).  

 

You really are a glass half full guy (admittedely I'm half empty).

 

He had a worse completion percentage and his one TD was just a 50/50 ball into good coverage. The Bills didn't fortuitously have players in position to pick off those bounces though. Second half they had a beat on where Jones was going with the football whereas first half they were confused and having to react late. I am not glass half anything. I don't project my thoughts about the team onto what I see. I see what is there.  

[Billsfan1972]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He had a worse completion percentage and his one TD was just a 50/50 ball into good coverage. The Bills didn't fortuitously have players in position to pick off those bounces though. Second half they had a beat on where Jones was going with the football whereas first half they were confused and having to react late. I am not glass half anything. I don't project my thoughts about the team onto what I see. I see what is there.  

Geez seem to be saying that every week.  

 

Oh another QB completing a 50/50 throw (could say the same thing about the first int.  BTW would be nice to see a Bills receiver catch a 50/50 ball.....😉)

 

So again Bills fans are excited about how they played vs. Mac Jones?  

 

Well NE should be even more excited they held Allen to 21 points (and lamenting two long completions) and outscored the Bills offence 23-21. 

Edited January 10, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[Drew21PA]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Frazier and McDermott do make very good adjustments. They are the best 2nd half defense in the entire NFL in points given up in 2022 and they were second best in 2021. That is not coincidence. They adjust to what they see. 

 

On your last point I will repeat again, for about the 10th time, that the 49ers and the Chargers did NOT adopt the same game plans vs Miami. They defended them quite differently. 

Ok didn’t they use the same concept though to push the plays outside?

[GunnerBill]

46 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Geez seem to be saying that every week.  

 

Oh another QB completing a 50/50 throw (could say the same thing about the first int.  BTW would be nice to see a Bills receiver catch a 50/50 ball.....😉

 

So again Bills fans are excited about how they played vs. Mac Jones?  

 

Well NE should be even more excited they held Allen to 21 points (and lamenting two long completions) and outscored the Bills offence 23-21. 

 

You absolutely could say the same about the first INT. If you are forcing QBs to throw 50/50 balls that is a good thing. The Bills did that much more 2nd half. 1st half there were guys open because of miscommunications in the secondary that the Pats exploited (intentionally). 

 

I am not "excited" about how they played Mac Jones. I am just correcting the incorrect statements. 

1 minute ago, Drew21PA said:

Ok didn’t they use the same concept though to push the plays outside?

 

Not any more than is the standard. They used a very similar plan to the Bills, they ran a lot of cover 2 shell with zone coverage on the backend and some Tampa 2 looks where Fred Warner dropped early the way the Bills tried to do with Edmunds. The Chargers ran much more of a bespoke scheme that was very specific to that game. The 49ers basically ran their normal defense. 

[Billsfan1972]

14 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

You absolutely could say the same about the first INT. If you are forcing QBs to throw 50/50 balls that is a good thing. The Bills did that much more 2nd half. 1st half there were guys open because of miscommunications in the secondary that the Pats exploited (intentionally). 

 

I am not "excited" about how they played Mac Jones. I am just correcting the incorrect statements. 

 

Not any more than is the standard. They used a very similar plan to the Bills, they ran a lot of cover 2 shell with zone coverage on the backend and some Tampa 2 looks where Fred Warner dropped early the way the Bills tried to do with Edmunds. The Chargers ran much more of a bespoke scheme that was very specific to that game. The 49ers basically ran their normal defense. 

How many 50/50 balls does Allen throw hoping the receiver makes the play?  Very few from what I see (and when he does the Bill doesn't make the catch).

[newcam2012]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He had a worse completion percentage and his one TD was just a 50/50 ball into good coverage. The Bills didn't fortuitously have players in position to pick off those bounces though. Second half they had a beat on where Jones was going with the football whereas first half they were confused and having to react late. I am not glass half anything. I don't project my thoughts about the team onto what I see. I see what is there.  

Do you think that Tre's int was pretty much a 50 50 pass?

2 hours ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Geez seem to be saying that every week.  

 

Oh another QB completing a 50/50 throw (could say the same thing about the first int.  BTW would be nice to see a Bills receiver catch a 50/50 ball.....😉

 

So again Bills fans are excited about how they played vs. Mac Jones?  

 

Well NE should be even more excited they held Allen to 21 points (and lamenting two long completions) and outscored the Bills offence 23-21. 

BINGO!

[Billsfan1972]

6 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Do you think that Tre's int was pretty much a 50 50 pass?

BINGO!

GunnerBill knows more than us, just ask him.

 

Actually he probably does, but the eye test is pretty clear too.

 

Tre's Int was a bad read and Tre had position and was a pretty easy int (though a Bills wideout probably drops it as it was into coverage🤣).

 

NFL Live yesterday said that the Bills are going nowhere with the Defense playing like this and pointed out Mac was 17-17 in their scoring drives.  

 

So the question is does GunnerBill know more than those on NFL Live?😉

[K-9]

I only have one thought and that is our pass defense really misses Miller and Hyde.

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, Billsfan1972 said:

How many 50/50 balls does Allen throw hoping the receiver makes the play?  Very few from what I see (and when he does the Bill doesn't make the catch).

 

What does this have to do with the price of milk? Talk about being off topic....

40 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Do you think that Tre's int was pretty much a 50 50 pass?

 

 

Yep.