MVP; Hurts / Allen / Mahomes by the numbers...

[Utah John]

6 hours ago, pennstate10 said:

Am I crazy for saying that the media seems to like Allen, and rather than give it to Mahomes a second time, a tie goes to Allen or Hurts?

And if Hurts is hurt, then maybe Josh is favorite, so long as he wins out and plays well the rest of the way.

 

I think Allen is clearly "more valuable" than Hurts.  Hurts has a stronger supporting cast (OL, RB, WR).  Look at it this way.  If Allen was on Eagles, whats their record?  14-0 maybe?  If Hurts is on Bills, whats Bills reccord?  8-6/9-5?  Who led more comebacks?

 

Mahomes is a different story.  He's every bit as valuable as Allen, maybe more so.  But Allen is a likable guy, so it wouldnt surprise me if Meida decided to give him a win in a close race.

The thing is, after Allen was injured (maybe because of the injury, maybe not) he had a string of non-MVP-type games.  Defenses figured out route trees the Bills' WRs were running, and Allen tried to play hero ball too much.  The fumble at the end of the Vikings game, which denied the Bills a stone-cold win, was a bad look too.  I just don't think he wins it this year.  And besides the only MVP award I really care about is Super Bowl MVP.

[Mr. WEO]

Hurts is a bum

[Billsfan1972]

The Vikings game will cost Allen the MVP.  Three big errors that are hard to forget (Int in the endzone, fumble at goal line and the game ending int, that I still have no idea what he was thinking). 

 

Add to that not a dominating performance since the Steelers game(?).

 

Yes victories over Balt & KC (1-1 vs. Mia & NYJ), but funny looking at their opponents records everyone seems to be around .500 except the Rams(!).   

Edited December 21, 2022 by Billsfan1972

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

Mahomes can get MVP every year for the rest of his career for all I care.  I just want one Lombardi. That's it.  IMO, I really don't think Allen, Mahomes or Hurts care about MVP.  They probably don't even think about it. 

[Iverwig]

If Minshew starts against Dallas that can help or hurt the case for Hurts as MVP. If Minshew happens to have a good-great game and Josh balls out the rest of the season especially in the Cincinnati game, then that will take votes away from Hurts and give more votes to Josh. As of now Mahomes is the front runner. While we would all love Josh to win the regular season MVP I think we would rather him win the Super Bowl MVP. 

[BananaB]

I get why Hurts is in the running but he should not be at the top with what he has surrounding him. Cupcake schedule too, so you can’t just say he has the best record. If the league wants a true MVP voters gotta take that ***** in to account when  making their decision. 

Edited December 21, 2022 by BananaB

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

5 minutes ago, BananaB said:

I get why Hurts is in the running but he should not be at the top with what he has surrounding him. Cupcake schedule too, so you can’t just say he has the best record. If the league wants a true MVP voters gotta take that ***** in to account when  making their decision. 

 

They don't though.  It's strictly a "Who has the biggest stats" award.

 

For me, Allen and Mahomes are such a large portion of why the Bills and Chiefs are so successful, they are really the only candidates for me.  If anything, Allen should be the front runner based on what he means to the offense.  Out of the Bills, Chiefs and Eagles.....Bills suffer extraordinarily if Allen is out.  Which is case enough for me for Allen to win MVP.  But I don't vote so, moot point. 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

11 hours ago, Ya Digg? said:

Let’s be honest this award has become a who puts up the best stats as a QB award, it’s no longer MVP. To think that it’s not is naive. When you look at the stats Mahomes has a sizable advantage over the other 2, it’s his award to lose and I’m not sure there’s enough time for either guy to catch him

This is true and it’s stupid haha if josh had mahomes’ offensive line he’d win mvp easily.  It’s honestly pretty crazy he has been 95% as effective as mahomes with an exponentially worse offensive line. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

59 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

The Vikings game will cost Allen the MVP.  Three big errors that are hard to forget (Int in the endzone, fumble at goal line and the game ending int, that I still have no idea what he was thinking). 

 

I think that is only the case if the Bills don't secure the #1 seed. Which seems likely since it will be tough beating the Bengals on the road and the Chiefs probably don't have another loss on the schedule.

 

But...Why should Mahomes win it if the Chiefs don't secure the #1 seed due to his failures against the Bills and Bengals?

[thenorthremembers]

Its Mahomes' to lose.  He is the best QB in football right now.   

[Mango]

11 hours ago, NewEra said:

As of now, I’d give it to Hurts due to his low turnovers- but I think Josh can steal it with an epic showing vs the bengals on MNF and if we win out

 

I think Josh will need a few epic showings to end the year to win it. Something like the Dolphins game but with a much higher completion percentage every week for the next 3 in a row. That includes a frigid and windy Chicago game.

I think Josh is certainly worth more wins for the Bills than Hurts is worth for the Eagles and is a toss up for KC. I won't argue Mahomes one way or the other. The Eagles 13-1 and low turn overs along with Mahomes passing numbers will be difficult to overcome. 

 

I am not saying what "should happen", just what I think it would take for the AP to vote JA17 for MVP with 3 weeks to go. 

[GunnerBill]

11 hours ago, pennstate10 said:

Am I crazy for saying that the media seems to like Allen, and rather than give it to Mahomes a second time, a tie goes to Allen or Hurts?

And if Hurts is hurt, then maybe Josh is favorite, so long as he wins out and plays well the rest of the way.

 

I think Allen is clearly "more valuable" than Hurts.  Hurts has a stronger supporting cast (OL, RB, WR).  Look at it this way.  If Allen was on Eagles, whats their record?  14-0 maybe?  If Hurts is on Bills, whats Bills reccord?  8-6/9-5?  Who led more comebacks?

 

Mahomes is a different story.  He's every bit as valuable as Allen, maybe more so.  But Allen is a likable guy, so it wouldnt surprise me if Meida decided to give him a win in a close race.

 

Depends. Has he played an absolute stinker like he did at the Meadlowlands? I don't say that as a knock, these guys are all humans, they are allowed a stinker now and again.  But when people start doing the "what is X's record on Y team?" they do so presuming that you never get a stinker. The way Allen played at the Jets he would have been capable of going 10-7 or something even on a weaker schedule with the Eagles. If you get the Allen from this past Saturday evening however? Well I think that guy is probably capable of getting the freaking Texans to the playoffs.

 

You see my point? Allen might well be 14-0 on the Eagles. He might have been 14-0 on the Bills, he arguably should have been at worst 12-2 right now. But then at the same token he has been the main reason we have won more than the main reason we lost. Just think it is a bit of a pointless comparison. 

 

Josh is right now the outside of the 3, but if he goes off against the Bengals on national tv, seals the #1 seed, as the Bills win out and Hurts misses multiple games or struggles then he can still steal it. 

[Mango]

39 minutes ago, BIGFOOTspaceman said:

 

They don't though.  It's strictly a "Who has the biggest stats" award.

 

For me, Allen and Mahomes are such a large portion of why the Bills and Chiefs are so successful, they are really the only candidates for me.  If anything, Allen should be the front runner based on what he means to the offense.  Out of the Bills, Chiefs and Eagles.....Bills suffer extraordinarily if Allen is out.  Which is case enough for me for Allen to win MVP.  But I don't vote so, moot point. 

 

I legitimately thought that Manning should have won it in 2011 when he missed the season with his neck injury. I still do. I will die on that hill. They went from 13-3 to 2-14 and a total punchline across the NFL. 

[H2o]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

 

I legitimately thought that Manning should have won it in 2011 when he missed the season with his neck injury. I still do. I will die on that hill. They went from 13-3 to 2-14 and a total punchline across the NFL. 

Yeah, but that was also known as the "Suck for Luck" campaign. 

[jethro_tull]

But who means more to their team?  

Hurts has the most balanced roster IMHO of the three. 

It comes down to Mahomes and Allen.    I pick Josh because of the head to head victory.  

[Mango]

6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Depends. Has he played an absolute stinker like he did at the Meadlowlands? I don't say that as a knock, these guys are all humans, they are allowed a stinker now and again.  But when people start doing the "what is X's record on Y team?" they do so presuming that you never get a stinker. The way Allen played at the Jets he would have been capable of going 10-7 or something even on a weaker schedule with the Eagles. If you get the Allen from this past Saturday evening however? Well I think that guy is probably capable of getting the freaking Texans to the playoffs.

 

You see my point? Allen might well be 14-0 on the Eagles. He might have been 14-0 on the Bills, he arguably should have been at worst 12-2 right now. But then at the same token he has been the main reason we have won more than the main reason we lost. Just think it is a bit of a pointless comparison. 

 

Josh is right now the outside of the 3, but if he goes off against the Bengals on national tv, seals the #1 seed, as the Bills win out and Hurts misses multiple games or struggles then he can still steal it. 

 

And this will be our frustration for the eternity of the JA17 era. I certainly wouldn't trade it. But that is the Josh Allen rollercoaster we ride on. Luckily for @SDS it will keep the board pretty healthy.

 

The peak and valley is likely what is keeping Josh from being at the top of MVP odds. 

1 minute ago, H2o said:

Yeah, but that was also known as the "Suck for Luck" campaign. 

 

They legitimately sucked though.

[Chicken Boo]

If I were given a vote to cast, it would go to Hurts.  Aside from his outstanding play, a large part of the reason the Eagles only have 1 loss is because he takes care of the football.  

Edited December 21, 2022 by Chicken Boo

[jackspike]

Offensive line rankings per PFF after 14 weeks of the season:

Eagles 1

Chiefs 3

Bills 26

 

Strength of schedule Per Power Ranking Guru for games played so far:

Bills 3

Chiefs 22

Eagles 29

 

Bills lead league in dropped passes

 

Bills beat Chiefs ar Arrowhead

 

If Bills hold onto number 1 seed, id vote for Allen

[Heavy Kevi]

Josh won't win MVP. I just don't see a course for it this late in the season.

 

But I'm sure he'd prefer Super Bowl MVP anyway, and that's still very much on the table.

[TheBrownBear]

If Josh has three more games like last weekend and we finish 14-3, there's a really good chance he wins it.  Gotta think the voters will take our SOV and SOS into account and then look at the fact that he beat Mahomes, Lamar, Burrow, Tua, etc head to head.