I thought 10-3 would feel better...

[GunnerBill]

Just now, Billsfan1972 said:

Again did he play well yesterday?  Is he really that bad a QB and only KC's defense is to blame for him playing well?

 

Based on his entire career? You'd say no. But based on the last couple of years, yes. There is simply no argument that he hasn't been atrocious this year. He made a couple of nice throws yesterday to a wide open Jerry Jeudy. But Jeudy has been open a LOT this year and Russ has been taking sacks from holding the ball instead. I'm not giving the Chiefs defense credit for allowing Wilson to go over his season average. They played bad defense. 

[Inigo Montoya]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Definitely not exactly killing it lately but man, how much have expectations changed? We used to pray for being listen in the hunt at like 6-7. Now we aren’t happy with 10-3 and a number 1 set. You do what you need to do to make the dance. So many ebbs and flows in a season. Enjoy the ride and be happy we have a Chance to play for a SB with a top qb and a good defense. We have plenty of time to complain if they lose in the off-season. 🤗

 

Hey Biscuit, appreciate your post. 

 

I though I'd repost my original below, because I think like a game of telephone, what my post was about has morphed a bit in the last 14 pages of responses.  I'm not upset we're 10-3, I'm happy were 10-3, I think it's a hell of an accomplishment that we are 10-3 and the #1 seed with everything this team has had to overcome.  And despite a dozen+ posts to the contrary by different people here, I'm not upset with how the Bills are playing. 

 

My post was about how it has been a rough slog and I always thought that the Bills sitting at 10-3 would make me feel on top of the world, but the road to get there has been so difficult that I haven't enjoyed it as much as I thought I would.  I didn't think that would be a controversial opinion.  Silly me.  

 

🍻

 

Original post:

 

"After beating the Jets today the Bills are 10-3 and in the lead in the AFCE and sitting as the #1 seed in the AFC.  If you had taken a poll here at the start of the season and asked if we would take those stats heading into week 15 of the season, I think it would be 80/20 in favor of it.

 

Recognizing the Bills are sitting in a very good position right now, why does it feel like this has been a really rough season?

 

Maybe it's the constant parade of injuries?  The bad loses to the Phins, Jets, and Vikings?  Maybe the fact that we haven't seen the Bills' offense find that gear that they ended the season in last season?  Or maybe it's because the Bills have left themselves no room for error going forward if they want to win the division and the #1 seed?

 

I'm not complaining about where the Bills are sitting at right now, I just imagined 10-3 would feel a whole lot better than it does."

 

 

 

[Billsfan1972]

7 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Based on his entire career? You'd say no. But based on the last couple of years, yes. There is simply no argument that he hasn't been atrocious this year. He made a couple of nice throws yesterday to a wide open Jerry Jeudy. But Jeudy has been open a LOT this year and Russ has been taking sacks from holding the ball instead. I'm not giving the Chiefs defense credit for allowing Wilson to go over his season average. They played bad defense. 

How about we get back to responding to the thread and not whether my throw away comment including KC taking care of business?🤣

 

I didn't post that line to start a 5 page back & forth as to whether Denver is good or not.

 

Just in case you're wondering KC put up more yards vs. them then anyone this year.  The first 300 yard passing game they've allowed.

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/den/2022.htm

 

Juxtaposed this was the most points Denver scored, but only the 6th most yards they've gained.

 

Want more stats (or explain how I'm wrong here)?

Edited December 12, 2022 by Billsfan1972

[Gugny]

Just now, Billsfan1972 said:

How about we get back to responding to the thread and not whether my throw away comment including KC taking care of business?🤣

 

I didn't past that line to start a 5 page back & forth as to whether Denver is good or not.

 

Just in case you're wondering KC put up more yards vs. them then anyone this year.  The first 300 yard passing game they've allowed.

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/den/2022.htm

 

Juxtaposed this was the most points Denver scored, but only the 6th most yards they've gained.

 

Want more stats (or explain how I'm wrong here)?

 

[Royale with Cheese]

4 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

He's been horrible this year, but over his career has not been.  Is it declining skills or games plans & the OC?  I don't watch them every week, but know they have been terrible in the red zone.

 

Answer the question.  Yes I would have been pissed as I was about Minny (a worse screw up and a loss).  

 

This was not about Denver.  I made a comment in a post about teams taking care of business and yes in the end KC did on the road against a division rival who had a great comeback but fell short.

 

Other teams I mentioned were Philly & SF.  Dallas struggled, I will give you that.  Baltimore won with their third stringer and Cincy avenged their loss to Cleveland.  

 

Those are the teams the Bills may need to beat to win the SB.

 

His career doesn't matter.  We are talking about 2022 Russ because we are talking about the game yesterday.  He's awful.  So KC allowed the worst QB in the league to come back from 27-0.  

 

Minnesota was 8-1 and in 1st place in their division.  What was the Broncos record?

 

Guess what we did?  We avenged our loss to NYJ just like the Bengals did with Cleveland.  But you aren't going to say that, you're going to say the Bills struggled.

 

I know you would have been pissed if the Bills allowed a last place team to come back from 27-0.  Trust me, we know you.

But you would never say "the Bills took care of business".  You would find a negative and run with it.

[Billsfan1972]

5 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

His career doesn't matter.  We are talking about 2022 Russ because we are talking about the game yesterday.  He's awful.  So KC allowed the worst QB in the league to come back from 27-0.  

 

Minnesota was 8-1 and in 1st place in their division.  What was the Broncos record?

 

Guess what we did?  We avenged our loss to NYJ just like the Bengals did with Cleveland.  But you aren't going to say that, you're going to say the Bills struggled.

 

I know you would have been pissed if the Bills allowed a last place team to come back from 27-0.  Trust me, we know you.

But you would never say "the Bills took care of business".  You would find a negative and run with it.

Fine the Bills have taken care of business the last 4 weeks.  Happy?????😝

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

How about we get back to responding to the thread and not whether my throw away comment including KC taking care of business?🤣

 

I didn't post that line to start a 5 page back & forth as to whether Denver is good or not.

 

Just in case you're wondering KC put up more yards vs. them then anyone this year.  The first 300 yard passing game they've allowed.

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/den/2022.htm

 

Juxtaposed this was the most points Denver scored, but only the 6th most yards they've gained.

 

Want more stats (or explain how I'm wrong here)?

 

Again, nobody is saying the factual points you are making are wrong.... but you have just done the exact thing you always do in this very post. You admitted KC just let Denver score their highest points of the season and then immediately followed with "but only the 6ht most gained." 

 

When you provide a factual stat and someone caveats that stat you call it excuses. When someone else gives a stat you caveat it and say it is just context. Your approach to every element of the discussion is about trying to make the facts fit your narrative. The Bills got it done against a 7-6 Jets team yesterday. But you criticise the offense. They scored 20 points against a defense that averages giving up 18.7 ppg. The Kansas City Chiefs also got it done against a 3-10 Broncos team. People criticise their defense. They gave up 28 points to an offense average 14.9 ppg and you say "yea but Russ is actually good."

 

You only like the pure numbers when they support your narrative. When they don't you prefer to add context to the numbers. This is what I keep saying to you. You have to treat both things the same. 

Edited December 12, 2022 by GunnerBill

[Royale with Cheese]

3 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Fine the Bills have taken care of business the last 4 weeks.  Happy?????😝

 

Since the the Chiefs "took care of business" because they won, then yes, the Bills have taken care of business.  

 

But that's not the case with you because you move criteria with every argument.  

 

What I find funny is you criticize Bills fans for making excuses when the Bills don't dominate.  But you make excuses for other teams when they don't dominate.  

You have made excuses for the Chiefs (Wilson is a good QB/Chiefs closed the game out) and the Bengals (avenged an earlier division loss).  Both teams struggled but not to you.  

 

[Billsfan1972]

7 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Again, nobody is saying the factual points you are making are wrong.... but you have just done the exact thing you always do in this very post. You admitted KC just let Denver score their highest points of the season and then immediately followed with "but only the 6ht most gained." 

 

When you provide a factual stat and someone caveats that stat you call it excuses. When someone else gives a stat you caveat it and say it is just context. Your approach to every element of the discussion is about trying to make the facts fit your narrative. The Bills got it done against a 7-6 Jets team yesterday. But you criticise the offense. They scored 20 points against a defense that averages giving up 18.7 ppg. The Kansas City Chiefs also got it done against a 3-10 Broncos team. People criticise their defense. They gave up 28 points to an offense average 14.9 ppg and you say "yea but Russ is actually good."

 

You only like the pure numbers when they support your narrative. When they don't you prefer to add context to the numbers. This is what I keep saying to you. You have to treat both things the same. 

Talk about hiding the facts.  We can argue about the conditions, but I expect the Bills to be able to put up points.  When they need one-two first downs to ice a game, I expect them to get it.

 

I will use the KC game as an example of how the season has changed.  They were at the 2 yard line and hadn't played great to that point, but I had no doubt they'd go 98 and score a TD (they did).  That was how good I felt about their offence in October. 

 

I expect way more then 20 points a game (especially at home).  I do not expect 5 straight punts to start the game.  Sorry my expectations are higher.

 

I really am not invested in Denver, but know their Defense has been very good all year and KC put up more yards and points then anyone else this year.

 

Denver did score 28 points, but on only 320 yards total offense.  Again facts.  

 

 

[CincyBillsFan]

53 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Again, KC certainly let them back in (remember Bills were up 27-10 vs. Minny midway through the third?).  

 

But what did KC do at the end of the game? They stopped Denver and then when needed ran out the clock and got first downs at the end. 

Talk about twisting the facts........  Wilson played well and is a very good qb.  I may even go as far as to say KC got lucky he was concussed.😉

 

KC benefited greatly from Wilson going down to injury and being unavailable after the 3rd Mahomes INT gave the Bronco's the ball at midfield late in the 4th quarter only down by 6.  Had Cousins gone out in the 4th quarter I'm very positive the Bills would be 11 - 2 right now.

 

 

[Billsfan1972]

3 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Since the the Chiefs "took care of business" because they won, then yes, the Bills have taken care of business.  

 

But that's not the case with you because you move criteria with every argument.  

 

What I find funny is you criticize Bills fans for making excuses when the Bills don't dominate.  But you make excuses for other teams when they don't dominate.  

You have made excuses for the Chiefs (Wilson is a good QB/Chiefs closed the game out) and the Bengals (avenged an earlier division loss).  Both teams struggled but not to you.  

 

Cincy was not a one score game with the opposition having the ball with a chance to tie at the end of the game.

Just now, CincyBillsFan said:

KC benefited greatly from Wilson going down to injury and being unavailable after the 3rd Mahomes INT gave the Bronco's the ball at midfield late in the 4th quarter only down by 6.  Had Cousins gone out in the 4th quarter I'm very positive the Bills would be 11 - 2 right now.

 

 

I noted that too.....  But thanks for the reminder.

[Royale with Cheese]

2 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Cincy was not a one score game with the opposition having the ball with a chance to tie at the end of the game.

I noted that too.....  But thanks for the reminder.

 

What about KC? 

 

When Mahomes had the ball at the 25 with under 5 minutes in the game and a chance to close the game out....what happened? Did Mahomes close the game out?

[TheFunPolice]

Jauron was right... It is hard to win in the NFL

 

10-3 feels great! Stack the wins and we'll see where things end up

[CincyBillsFan]

4 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Talk about hiding the facts.  We can argue about the conditions, but I expect the Bills to be able to put up points.  When they need one-two first downs to ice a game, I expect them to get it.

 

I will use the KC game as an example of how the season has changed.  They were at the 2 yard line and hadn't played great to that point, but I had no doubt they'd go 98 and score a TD (they did).  That was how good I felt about their offence in October. 

 

I expect way more then 20 points a game (especially at home).  I do not expect 5 straight punts to start the game.  Sorry my expectations are higher.

 

I really am not invested in Denver, but know their Defense has been very good all year and KC put up more yards and points then anyone else this year.

 

Denver did score 28 points, but on only 320 yards total offense.  Again facts.  

 

 

I had higher expectations from our offense to. But the fact that the game didn't play out the way I thought it might is the way football works.  If you're going to site facts:

 

*  The weather did impact both teams offensive production. The Bills pass drops, which screwed up at least 3 drives forcing punts, were clearly impacted by the weather.

 

*  Both teams play very good defense which limited both teams offensive production.

 

*  The Bills low offensive output was in part by design.  McD determined that the defense would limit the Jet's scoring and only short fields brought about by turnovers would allow the Jets to score a lot of points.  You know like what happened in the KC/Denver game where the Mahomes INT's resulted in the Broncos scoring 28 points with only 320 yards of total offense.

 

*  The Bills held a two score lead from late in the 3rd period to late in the 4th period. Rather then try to stretch the lead to 3 scores, which is what we fans want, the Bills played the odds and protected a two score lead. The end result was a win.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Billsfan1972]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

What about KC? 

 

When Mahomes had the ball at the 25 with under 5 minutes in the game and a chance to close the game out....what happened? Did Mahomes close the game out?

He ran out the last 4:21......  Absolutely right about the int too.

 

What did Buffalo do their last 3 possessions (3 & out + a safety).  

 

But again stop with the KC/Denver.....  How about my other examples Philly & SF?  Oh yea.......  Crickets.....

 

  

[FilthyBeast]

I certainly understand where these feelings of unease and doubt come from despite currently sitting with the #1 seed in the AFC and tied for best record in conference. But like I've said before, watching this team ever since the KC game you just get the feeling that something is missing despite grinding out 4 straight wins after 2 tough losses.

 

Yes this team is playing a more gritty style of football this year and winning close games, but it doesn't hide the fact this offensive line is among the worst in the league and with teams keying in on Diggs it's become increasingly clear we have no other real options that are going to scare defenses especially come January and time is running out with each passing game heading into the playoffs.

 

At the end of the day this just feels like a one and done type of team, almost similar to the Titans last year in that everyone knew they weren't a true contender or team to be feared despite finishing with the #1 seed.

[Jauronimo]

Feels pretty good to me.  Just win.

 

This is the NFL.  Nobody goes wire to wire and does so with style points.  We all want to see 20 games that look like Bills v Pats in the wild card round.  That is simply not possible.  We are beating divisional opponents that have serious playoff chances and doing it when it matters.  

[HOUSE]

All this talk of extending Trumaine Edmunds ruined my season

[GoBills808]

5 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

I certainly understand where these feelings of unease and doubt come from despite currently sitting with the #1 seed in the AFC and tied for best record in conference. But like I've said before, watching this team ever since the KC game you just get the feeling that something is missing despite grinding out 4 straight wins after 2 tough losses.

 

Yes this team is playing a more gritty style of football this year and winning close games, but it doesn't hide the fact this offensive line is among the worst in the league and with teams keying in on Diggs it's become increasingly clear we have no other real options that are going to scare defenses especially come January and time is running out with each passing game heading into the playoffs.

 

At the end of the day this just feels like a one and done type of team, almost similar to the Titans last year in that everyone knew they weren't a true contender or team to be feared despite finishing with the #1 seed.

Sorry about the Dolphins

[Royale with Cheese]

10 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

He ran out the last 4:21......  Absolutely right about the int too.

 

What did Buffalo do their last 3 possessions (3 & out + a safety).  

 

But again stop with the KC/Denver.....  How about my other examples Philly & SF?  Oh yea.......  Crickets.....

 

  

 

Do you think Philly and SF dominating yesterday strengthens your argument?

 

SF two weeks ago won 13-0 at home against a 4-8 Saints team.  If the Bills only scored 13 points, at home against the Saints....what would your reaction be?

 

The Eagles needed a last second TD to beat the Colts...a Colts team coached by Jeff Saturday who has never coached.  The Colts are obviously tanking and were close to beating the Eagles.  Eagles lost the Commanders and struggled against the Texans lol. 

If the Bills struggled against the Saints, lost to the Commanders and struggled against the Texans....what would your reaction be? 

 

Edited December 12, 2022 by Royale with Cheese