TBN's Jim Kubiak has been abducted by aliens and replaced by a replicant. Prove me wrong.

[Beck Water]

Always enjoy Kubiak's analysis and his grading system, which is based on "do your job on each play" and doesn't get swayed by the ooohs and aaaahs.

He started out a critic of Josh, then started seeing more and more good plays.  I think he's been a fan for a while now.

 

Writes a great piece where he breaks down plays and explains why it works and such - always a good read, especially online where the film clips and diagrams show up well.  But he's usually critical of Josh not getting down when he runs, taking unnecessary hits, etc.

 

Now, I think he's been abducted by aliens and replaced by a replicant.  Prove Me Wrong @JoshBarnett

 

Quote

on this second-and-8 play, Dorsey called Allen’s number on a quarterback counter.....

Here, Dorsey uses a sweep left action with Hines to make the Patriots’ defense think the ball was going outside to the left. With both defenders to that side, defensive end Deatrich Wise (No. 91) and nickelback Myles Bryant (No. 27) were not accounted for with the anticipation that the play-action fake would take them out of the play, which it did. The Bills had everyone blocked to the side Allen was running to, which allowed him to surge and eventually jump into a pile of defenders on the 4-yard line.

This was an excellent way to get Allen, the leading rusher for the Bills, a great opportunity to score, as this essentially was a “wildcat” style of play, whereby the offense has one more player at the point of attack. Running the quarterback also minimizes potential quarterback mistakes that could arise from throwing the football in this situation. This was a well-designed play by Dorsey called at exactly the right time.

 

I don't have a problem with the run play call per-se.  But Allen doesn't just "jump into a pile of defenders", he goes up as though he's trying to hurdle Devin McCourty and friends in a QB sneak type play.  And in slow mo it doesn't look so bad, but Allen gets hit hard in the head by defenders running to the pile, hard enough that I thought he might get pulled and sent to the "blue tent of doom" by the INC. 

 

It was 2nd and 8.  If Josh didn't go up over the defenders, he wouldn't have gotten the first down, but he would have made it 3rd and short, 3rd and 2 maybe if he trucks McCourty a little.  And he wouldn't have gotten a "line drive up the middle" from Devin McCourty's helmet or his head snapped forward by Myles Bryant.

 

 

OK, it's still a fine analysis, worth reading IMO.  But that play makes me wince every time I see it, so while I agree it was a well designed play called at a good time, I can't believe Kubiak didn't have anything critical to say about Josh choosing to go up in the air like that.  Even Allen said "he's got to make better decisions than that, that one hurt" in the post-game show.

 

PS for those who don't think it's fair to criticize Davis for not running the same route as well as Diggs did, there's a good explanation why this is a route that really has to be "sold" to the DB and that makes all the difference.  Davis is capable of making that sale - differently than Diggs, but same result - but for whatever reason he didn't/couldn't.

Quote

Diggs did an amazing job of making his outside release on Jones, and then selling a move to the inside. This inside move by Diggs made Jones bite hard to the middle of the field, which was Dorsey’s design. Once Jones bit, Diggs was wide open as he worked back to the outside. This route looks like a snake as it winds around from the inside to the outside. Diggs ran a magnificent snake-route with his lightning quickness and Allen just had to get him the football on time. 

This Dorsey design came from film study of Jones and his over-reaction to inside routes. The touchdown put the Bills up 10-7.

 

Edited December 6, 2022 by Beck Water

[Coach Tuesday]

Is it replicant week at TSW?

[White Linen]

4 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Is it replicant week at TSW?

 

Every Tuesday, Tuesday.  

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

4 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Is it replicant week at TSW?

[Utah John]

The article said the Bills approach led to "boring football" and the announcers made it sound like they thought so too.  Well tough noogies.  These are professional doing what is best to win the game.  I'll take a W any day and any way, compared to an exciting L.

[LeGOATski]

2 hours ago, Utah John said:

The article said the Bills approach led to "boring football" and the announcers made it sound like they thought so too.  Well tough noogies.  These are professional doing what is best to win the game.  I'll take a W any day and any way, compared to an exciting L.

At no point during the game did I get the impression the announcers were bored. Maybe bored by the realization that the Pats were never coming back...

[Don Otreply]

7 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Is it replicant week at TSW?

Well, we did a DR Who reference the other day so…,

[4merper4mer]

Aliens don’t exist.

[Thurman#1]

I don't see exactly what you're talking about there. 

 

You say, "But Allen doesn't just 'jump into a pile of defenders.'" But that's not what Kubiak said. The "just" there is yours, not his. Yeah, he didn't just jump into a pile of defenders. But he did jump into a pile of defenders, which is what Kubiak said. Nor was he being the slightest bit insulting about Allen's performance on the play. Complimentary if anything, except perhaps implying worry about Allen's injury risk on the play with his word choice. I worried about it too at that time. He absolutely did jump up over McCourty who then had an opportunity to bring him down with some real impact.

 

I'm with you about the injury risk. I wish he'd stop, but he just keeps doing these things.

 

Kubiak was complimentary from the beginning about Allen, with good reason of course.

 

I always enjoy his articles. He breaks things down very well.

 

And you're right that was an interesting note about the route coming from film study. I wish he'd been a bit more detailed about what he's seen, but even so it was good stuff.

 

Thanks.

[Beck Water]

58 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

I don't see exactly what you're talking about there. 

 

You say, "But Allen doesn't just 'jump into a pile of defenders.'" But that's not what Kubiak said. The "just" there is yours, not his. Yeah, he didn't just jump into a pile of defenders. But he did jump into a pile of defenders, which is what Kubiak said. Nor was he being the slightest bit insulting about Allen's performance on the play. Complimentary if anything, except perhaps implying worry about Allen's injury risk on the play with his word choice. I worried about it too at that time. He absolutely did jump up over McCourty who then had an opportunity to bring him down with some real impact.

 

You’re missing my point to fixate on an adverb.  

 

Kubiak normally is critical of Allen putting himself (and the Bills season) at unnecessary risk with physical punishment.

 

You’re exactly correct, he’s complimentary here, and does not comment on the injury risk.

 

The point of the adverb is if you look at the play closely, 1) Allen appears to try to hurdle McCourty with 2 other defenders very close 2) in fighting for extra yards by trying to hurdle or jump over the defenders, he exposes his head to punishment from a defender.

 

Kubiak would normally critique that

 

That’s why I believe he’s been abducted by aliens and replaced by a replicant. 😃

 

Prove me wrong

 

58 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

I'm with you about the injury risk. I wish he'd stop, but he just keeps doing these things.

 

Yes.  That play made me shudder.  I really thought he was going to be sent to the tent and taken out of the game the way his head took a blow.  His groin must also be one big bruise.

 

58 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

Kubiak was complimentary from the beginning about Allen, with good reason of course.

 

Actually, Allen’s first couple years here he would nitpick his throwing technique (he pretty much stopped that after 2020) and critique a number of his decisions - for example, he still points out that QB are normally taught not to throw from the sideline back across the middle of the field,  In Allen’s first few years he would have criticized that decision, now he accepts that Allen can make it work.

 

So Allen has earned his respect and the benefit of the doubt there

[AlfaBill]

6 hours ago, Utah John said:

The article said the Bills approach led to "boring football" and the announcers made it sound like they thought so too.  Well tough noogies.  These are professional doing what is best to win the game.  I'll take a W any day and any way, compared to an exciting L.

I’m gagging as I type this but very Pats like 🤮 

[Utah John]

6 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

At no point during the game did I get the impression the announcers were bored. Maybe bored by the realization that the Pats were never coming back...

Near the end of the game, Al Michaels and Kirk Herbstreit were joking with each other about the quality of the game.  And all through the game they were really working hard to spice things up.  

[LeGOATski]

2 hours ago, Utah John said:

Near the end of the game, Al Michaels and Kirk Herbstreit were joking with each other about the quality of the game.  And all through the game they were really working hard to spice things up.  

How exactly?

6 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

Aliens don’t exist.

[RunTheBall]

Josh said it himself, he’s a football player. He always plays better after he get that first hit, you can see it easily.

 

Josh dishes out more punishment on his runs than he takes. It’s been 5 years now, he hasn’t gotten hurt on a run. His injuries to his elbow were both in the pocket. Lamar got hurt running from the pocket.

 

This part of his game is integral to who he is as a QB right now and we don’t want to change that. As he matures I bet you’ll see fewer scrambles because he has the head for the game already has been successful throwing from the pocket.

 

When you have a horse, you have to let him run

 

 

[eball]

Have you actually read Kubiak’s articles over the past couple of years?  He LOVES Josh Allen.

 

[Beck Water]

4 hours ago, RunTheBall said:

Josh said it himself, he’s a football player. He always plays better after he get that first hit, you can see it easily.

 

This isn't about Josh running and taking a hit, even a hard hit.  This is about Josh trying to jump over a guy who is not going low, and is accompanied by 2 teammates making it a "pile of defenders".  He took a hard helmet to his privates and, while 3 defenders were tackling him, had another come up and slam him in the head.

 

Postgame, when talking to the Thursday Night crew, Josh admitted it wasn't a good decision:

Fitz: "He (Gonzalez) didn't like the hurdle in the first half either"

Josh: "I didn't like it either.  That one hurt a little bit.  We'll be smarter on that one"

 

4 hours ago, RunTheBall said:

Josh dishes out more punishment on his runs than he takes. It’s been 5 years now, he hasn’t gotten hurt on a run.

 

It's been discussed in detail elsewhere.  Neither of those statements are true.  While it happened that all of Josh's injuries while trying to run have proven relatively minor and have not kept him out of the following game, that's largely a matter of luck.  It's rationalization.

 

4 hours ago, RunTheBall said:

When you have a horse, you have to let him run

 

Again, this isn't about Josh running.  It's about Josh making stupid decisions and taking unnecessary punishment while running, instead of minimizing that.

[Beck Water]

4 hours ago, eball said:

Have you actually read Kubiak’s articles over the past couple of years?  He LOVES Josh Allen.

 

 

Every one, starting from 2019 or whenever he began.  LIke @Thurman#1, my point escaped you.

 

Yes, he loves Josh Allen, but he's previously been objective and able to be critical of bad decisions Josh makes.  Slowly, the bars have shifted for him as he's seen Josh able to get away with canonical "bad QB decisions/throws" that other QB can't make, but Josh has proven he can make. (Warner has undergone a similar process)

 

But here we have a play that makes my stomach churn every time I see a replay, that Josh himself said "That one hurt a little bit, we've got to be smarter", and he's lauding it.

 

Replicant, I tell you.  Alien abduction.

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

23 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Is it replicant week at TSW?

 

 

[RunTheBall]

4 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

This isn't about Josh running and taking a hit, even a hard hit.  This is about Josh trying to jump over a guy who is not going low, and is accompanied by 2 teammates making it a "pile of defenders".  He took a hard helmet to his privates and, while 3 defenders were tackling him, had another come up and slam him in the head.

 

Postgame, when talking to the Thursday Night crew, Josh admitted it wasn't a good decision:

Fitz: "He (Gonzalez) didn't like the hurdle in the first half either"

Josh: "I didn't like it either.  That one hurt a little bit.  We'll be smarter on that one"

 

 

It's been discussed in detail elsewhere.  Neither of those statements are true.  While it happened that all of Josh's injuries while trying to run have proven relatively minor and have not kept him out of the following game, that's largely a matter of luck.  It's rationalization.

 

 

Again, this isn't about Josh running.  It's about Josh making stupid decisions and taking unnecessary punishment while running, instead of minimizing that.

 

Yes Beck, we all get it. Your sphincter got real tight when Josh jumped in the air. You’d prefer he didn’t do it. Got it.

 

Every year Josh says about some run he makes “Gotta be a little smarter” and guess what, the next year he leaps for a first down, doesn’t get hurt despite your frame by frame analysis.

 

As I said, as time goes on and he matures I think we will see less and less of that. But for now, gotta take the good with the scary. Personally I’d rather he lowered a shoulder in that situation or even slid, but that’s not how Josh is. Hopefully he’ll get smarter about when he takes the risks as he gains experience, but he’s always going to take them.

 

 

[JoshBarnett]

On 12/6/2022 at 11:03 AM, Beck Water said:

Always enjoy Kubiak's analysis and his grading system, which is based on "do your job on each play" and doesn't get swayed by the ooohs and aaaahs.

He started out a critic of Josh, then started seeing more and more good plays.  I think he's been a fan for a while now.

 

Writes a great piece where he breaks down plays and explains why it works and such - always a good read, especially online where the film clips and diagrams show up well.  But he's usually critical of Josh not getting down when he runs, taking unnecessary hits, etc.

 

Now, I think he's been abducted by aliens and replaced by a replicant.  Prove Me Wrong @JoshBarnett

 

 

I don't have a problem with the run play call per-se.  But Allen doesn't just "jump into a pile of defenders", he goes up as though he's trying to hurdle Devin McCourty and friends in a QB sneak type play.  And in slow mo it doesn't look so bad, but Allen gets hit hard in the head by defenders running to the pile, hard enough that I thought he might get pulled and sent to the "blue tent of doom" by the INC. 

 

It was 2nd and 8.  If Josh didn't go up over the defenders, he wouldn't have gotten the first down, but he would have made it 3rd and short, 3rd and 2 maybe if he trucks McCourty a little.  And he wouldn't have gotten a "line drive up the middle" from Devin McCourty's helmet or his head snapped forward by Myles Bryant.

 

 

OK, it's still a fine analysis, worth reading IMO.  But that play makes me wince every time I see it, so while I agree it was a well designed play called at a good time, I can't believe Kubiak didn't have anything critical to say about Josh choosing to go up in the air like that.  Even Allen said "he's got to make better decisions than that, that one hurt" in the post-game show.

 

PS for those who don't think it's fair to criticize Davis for not running the same route as well as Diggs did, there's a good explanation why this is a route that really has to be "sold" to the DB and that makes all the difference.  Davis is capable of making that sale - differently than Diggs, but same result - but for whatever reason he didn't/couldn't.

 

Can confirm that Jim is still Jim, at least when I talked to him Saturday! No aliens detected.