Slot receiver?

[hemma]

McKenzie had 26 snaps, Shakir had 16.

The time is long since past that this needs to be, at a minimum, flipped.

McKenzie has reached the very end of a too long rope.  

He has no value and it has been obvious for a long time.

[whorlnut]

5 minutes ago, hemma said:

McKenzie had 26 snaps, Shakir had 16.

The time is long since past that this needs to be, at a minimum, flipped.

McKenzie has reached the very end of a too long rope.  

He has no value and it has been obvious for a long time.

Yep. I can’t understand how McKenzie keeps hanging on with this team.

[MAJBobby]

1 hour ago, Donuts and Doritos said:

 

Shakir &/or Hines may need to fill in there. Hines moved out to slot in 9 of 10 plays he was in for per Joe Bascaglia of the Athletic. 

 

Greg Cosell pointed out last Friday (on 1 Bills Live) that Dorsey doesn't help his WRs, he puts them out on an island & expects them to win 1 on 1 every time, there's no stacked or bunched formations, no picks & rub routes, no quick slants. He said Daboll mixed those things in. I watched this last game & sure enough Greg was right. Hopefully Dorsey is learning & starts scheming the slit guys open more.

Agree.

 

Diggs gets bracketed and the answer has been keep putting Diggs in his spot and make him with with routes.

 

I finally saw two plays yesterday were Diggs was put in motion to get better matchups and take teams off that bracket.  Dorsey needs to learn the nuances of scheming players open.  Floods, Stacks, Motions etc etc, Daboll vs Dorsey's route concepts and how Daboll used to attack in levels is non existence in this offense at this point.  

[Motorin']

1 hour ago, whorlnut said:

McKenzie is a decent gadget guy, that’s it. He’s not a good slot. 

 

I think he's a good option in the slot against the rate team that plays nearly 100% man to man. 

 

Really have to question his football iq and situational awareness need to play against complex defenses that switch and disguise coverage. 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

13 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

Yep. I can’t understand how McKenzie keeps hanging on with this team.

 

Because shakir has been worse when targeted.  

[The Firebaugh Kid]

I'd be on the phone with Cole unless Shakir can step up. Dirty is a total non-factor despite his "expanded role" in the offense. 

That safety valve is missed, badly. 

PS: Is Crowder eligible to return? 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

14 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

I think he's a good option in the slot against the rate team that plays nearly 100% man to man. 

 

Really have to question his football iq and situational awareness need to play against complex defenses that switch and disguise coverage. 

 

No idea whats going on there.  He's been one of our better red zone contributors, so i wouldn't eliminate him from the game plan in the area we struggle the most.  

[SCBills]

21 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

Because shakir has been worse when targeted.  

 

Whether this is true or not, I have no clue, but at least he has the potential of getting better.  

 

McKenzie is what he is, and that's quite clearly not a starting slot WR in this league.   He's a WR5/Gadget and he's occupying a space previously held by Cole Beasley aka the second most important offensive skill player of Josh Allen's career thus far. 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

4 minutes ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

I'd be on the phone with Cole unless Shakir can step up. Dirty is a total non-factor despite his "expanded role" in the offense. 

That safety valve is missed, badly. 

PS: Is Crowder eligible to return? 

 

The running backs are safety valves, they have been fine in that role for the most part.  The key is throwing to them - and throwing it faster than he has the past month.

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

 

Whether this is true or not, I have no clue, but at least he has the potential of getting better.  

 

McKenzie is what he is, and that's quite clearly not a starting slot WR in this league.   He's a WR5/Gadget and he's occupying a space previously held by Cole Beasley aka the second most important offensive skill player of Josh Allen's career thus far. 

 

Statistically Shakir has secured fewer than 50% of his 15 targets with 2 drops.  

[GolfandBills]

The passing offense looks stale.  Zero creativity 

[clayboy54]

2 hours ago, NewEra said:

Sure….Daboll had his drawbacks.  No doubt.  But he used the slot….and that’s why this thread is about.  2 years ago, our slot WR was 2nd team all pro-  while our WR1 first team all pro. Dorsey has turned our slot position into an abyss of irrelevance.  
 

Maybe dirty, shakir and crowders injury are partly to blame, but I don’t think this is what Dorsey and McD had in mind with slot production.  1 target- 0 catches

Beasley was a special talent. He ran great routes and always found the seam. He wasn’t afraid to take the hits, although that clearly shortened his career as we all saw. Maybe Shakir has a career like that but he clearly isn’t there this season. Despite the injury woes, Crowder was good at it as well. McKenzie… not in the same conversation by any measure.

 

How can you fault a coordinator’s use of a position where you had your best guy leave, the next guy broke his leg, and the new hire hasn’t figured any of it out yet? Do you still tell Josh to throw the ball to a guy who can’t get open or any separation? Do you still game plan around guys who can’t catch? I dunno, but my guess is you don’t. That right there is what is happening.

[Success]

I'm not as down on McKenzie as some here.  He has made some big plays for us.  He is very quick, but not overpowering - there was literally nothing he could have done on that 2-point conversion yesterday.  He accelerated to the outside and that should have been enough, but a block was missed on that one & he got stuffed. He wasn't going to overpower that defender, and that's not his role or skillset.

 

I hope Crowder can come back by the end of the season. I haven't seen anything on that, but initial reports were that he wasn't done for the year.

 

[NewEra]

9 minutes ago, clayboy54 said:

Beasley was a special talent. He ran great routes and always found the seam. He wasn’t afraid to take the hits, although that clearly shortened his career as we all saw. Maybe Shakir has a career like that but he clearly isn’t there this season. Despite the injury woes, Crowder was good at it as well. McKenzie… not in the same conversation by any measure.

 

How can you fault a coordinator’s use of a position where you had your best guy leave, the next guy broke his leg, and the new hire hasn’t figured any of it out yet? Do you still tell Josh to throw the ball to a guy who can’t get open or any separation? Do you still game plan around guys who can’t catch? I dunno, but my guess is you don’t. That right there is what is happening.

He’s the OC.  He’s in charge of the offense.  He’s in charge of moving the chains.  It’s his job, not  Not yours.  He needs to fix it.

 

iv’e already stated that dirty, shakir and the crowder injury are partly to blame.  I didn’t put it all on him……but he’s the coach and teams have obstacles to overcome.  Overcome it Ken.  Start by playing shakir and sitting dirty down.  Put cook or Hines in the slot more often.  So far, the results have been pitiful and it’s hurting out offense

[clayboy54]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

He’s the OC.  He’s in charge of the offense.  He’s in charge of moving the chains.  It’s his job, not  Not yours.  He needs to fix it.

 

iv’e already stated that dirty, shakir and the crowder injury are partly to blame.  I didn’t put it all on him……but he’s the coach and teams have obstacles to overcome.  Overcome it Ken.  Start by playing shakir and sitting dirty down.  Put cook or Hines in the slot more often.  So far, the results have been pitiful and it’s hurting out offense

I guess at some point you start to throw crap at the wall and hope something sticks.

[NewEra]

Just now, clayboy54 said:

I guess at some point you start to throw crap at the wall and hope something sticks.

That’s what I’d hope we do….which is to give more reps to shakir or even cook/Hines.  This last game he wasn’t throwing anything at the wall.  He just avoided it

[jkeerie]

I think they may have kept yesterday's offense a bit vanilla due to the lack of practice this week and the extra stress put on the team with the snow, travel, etc.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

22 minutes ago, jkeerie said:

I think they may have kept yesterday's offense a bit vanilla due to the lack of practice this week and the extra stress put on the team with the snow, travel, etc.

 

I probably would have too.  They still looked totally out of sorts in the first half too and allen looked a lot better once he was hitting hitches and comebacks.  

[jkeerie]

6 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

I probably would have too.  They still looked totally out of sorts in the first half too and allen looked a lot better once he was hitting hitches and comebacks.  

Totally agree.

[Warriorspikes51]

Shakir when called upon has looked very good.

Why is he not getting any looks.  5 targets a game seems more than reasonable.  

[Big Blitz]

This is the position that has this offense looking very different from the last 3 years.  
 

Well it’s lack of production from the position anyway.  
 

Staggering.  Beasley had over 100 targets last year and was hobbled.  
 

What are we doing?  We keeping Shakir secret until RD 2 vs the division teams?

Edited November 21, 2022 by Big Blitz