Week 12: Bills at Lions on Thanksgiving

[Warcodered]

3 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

and the lack of use will continue

 

 

Even if it actually was the plan he's hardly going to admit to it.

[SCBills]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

and the lack of use will continue

 

 

It does seem like they are constantly finding reasons to not play guys.  It’s weird. 
 

Although, I’m sure he’s not going to come out and say “yes, he’s going to be more involved” so the Lions can prepare for that. 

[atlbillsfan1975]

1 hour ago, Negan said:

I forgot about the horrendous missed facemask by clowney, right in front of the refs, reminded me of the tripping non call right in front of the refs in KC.  Almost seems like WWE refs have more integrity than NFL refs.

 

Compound it with the fact that the ref’s later called a face mask Against the Bills. That call involved a Brown player who wasn’t even the ball carrier. 

[HappyDays]

This is crazy.

 

 

[Logic]

My main critique of Dorsey so far is that he doesn't seem to know how to get the most out of the Bills' complementary pieces.

With Daboll, I felt like he used every single tool in the tool chest. He had plays for Diggs, plays for Beasley, plays for McKenzie...we even had third string tight ends and swing tackles catching touchdowns.

 

With Dorsey...I don't get that feeling. 

My concern started with the lack of usage of James Cook in the passing game. Rookie or not, he was brought in to be an explosive addition as a pass catcher. Even now that he's finally starting to get some usage, it looks like he just runs the same plays as Singletary. The lack of creativity in the usage of Cook, which has now extended to the lack of creativity so far in the usage of Hines, is confounding. 

 

In Cook, Hines, and McKenzie, the Bills have quite a bit of speed and explosiveness. For an offense that has lacked punch the past several weeks, speed and explosiveness seem like much needed commodities. And yet, week after week, I don't see many/any manufactured touches for these guys. It's not rocket surgery. As others have said, the McDaniels and Shanahans and Reids of the world don't seem to have an issue getting the ball into the fast guys' hands.

I'll give Dorsey credit for one thing that he's better at than Daboll, seemingly: Getting the ball to Stefon Diggs no matter what the defense is doing. Too often under Daboll, Diggs would all but disappear for whole games. That doesn't seem to happen any more. The way that Diggs is moved around the formation and seems all but immune to being erased now is awesome. It's the usage of the REST of the offensive skill weapons that has been lacking.

[Warriorspikes51]

2 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

This is crazy.

 

 

0 Turnovers = Victory 

[Big Turk]

Bills are still #1 in DVOA.

 

#6 on Offense

#3 on Defense

#3 on ST

 

Bills are the ONLY team in the NFL in the top 10 in all 3.

 

Lions:

#10 on Offense

#25 on Defense

#12 on ST

Edited November 22, 2022 by Big Turk

[Low Positive]

2 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

This is crazy.

 

 

It just means that when the Bills are clicking on offense, it is a high-risk/high-reward style. Josh tries to force the ball into tight windows. It was working before the bye week. I mean, how many times did the media say "no one else could make that throw?" The game winner to Knox in KC or that one where Davis ripped it out of Fitzpatrick's hands against PIT come to mind. If you attempt those throws, some will get picked off. This week, he didn't try to make those throws. Josh had Diggs open in tight(ish) windows and chose to check down instead. We didn't turn the ball over, but there were no wow plays. I'm not sure what I prefer. 

[finn]

37 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

 

Yeah, and what I heard in Dorsey's press conference, he's talking about not upsetting the balance by "forcing" it to guys. 

 

What balance? Diggs has more than twice as many catches as any other receiver. Dorsey is going to lose the Bills more games if he wants to continue this "balance." 

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Big Turk]

9 minutes ago, Logic said:

My main critique of Dorsey so far is that he doesn't seem to know how to get the most out of the Bills' complementary pieces.

With Daboll, I felt like he used every single tool in the tool chest. He had plays for Diggs, plays for Beasley, plays for McKenzie...we even had third string tight ends and swing tackles catching touchdowns.

 

With Dorsey...I don't get that feeling. 

My concern started with the lack of usage of James Cook in the passing game. Rookie or not, he was brought in to be an explosive addition as a pass catcher. Even now that he's finally starting to get some usage, it looks like he just runs the same plays as Singletary. The lack of creativity in the usage of Cook, which has now extended to the lack of creativity so far in the usage of Hines, is confounding. 

 

In Cook, Hines, and McKenzie, the Bills have quite a bit of speed and explosiveness. For an offense that has lacked punch the past several weeks, speed and explosiveness seem like much needed commodities. And yet, week after week, I don't see many/any manufactured touches for these guys. It's not rocket surgery. As others have said, the McDaniels and Shanahans and Reids of the world don't seem to have an issue getting the ball into the fast guys' hands.

I'll give Dorsey credit for one thing that he's better at than Daboll, seemingly: Getting the ball to Stefon Diggs no matter what the defense is doing. Too often under Daboll, Diggs would all but disappear for whole games. That doesn't seem to happen any more. The way that Diggs is moved around the formation and seems all but immune to being erased now is awesome. It's the usage of the REST of the offensive skill weapons that has been lacking.

 

Bills are better in pretty much every offensive category under Dorsey than under Daboll from last year, and especially on the Offensive Drive stat numbers. Average over 7 yards per drive more in terms of yards. Doesn't seem like much but it's a LOT considering the number of drives per game.

Edited November 22, 2022 by Big Turk

[Warriorspikes51]

1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Lions should wear their throwback blues, 90's Lion helmet with shiny silver pants. 

Not a fan of their grey jerseys 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

Silver vs white?  Bills need to be in blue I feel.

[Big Turk]

6 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

It just means that when the Bills are clicking on offense, it is a high-risk/high-reward style. Josh tries to force the ball into tight windows. It was working before the bye week. I mean, how many times did the media say "no one else could make that throw?" The game winner to Knox in KC or that one where Davis ripped it out of Fitzpatrick's hands against PIT come to mind. If you attempt those throws, some will get picked off. This week, he didn't try to make those throws. Josh had Diggs open in tight(ish) windows and chose to check down instead. We didn't turn the ball over, but there were no wow plays. I'm not sure what I prefer. 

 

Scoring 31 points on 7 consecutive drives is pretty awesome for a "boring" offense.

[HappyDays]

10 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

We didn't turn the ball over, but there were no wow plays. I'm not sure what I prefer. 

 

Scoring 30+ points without gifting the other team short fields is what I prefer. The offense had become too much feast or famine over the first half of the season. Against the Browns we got back to fundamentals which is ultimately what wins championships.

 

Edited November 22, 2022 by HappyDays

[Low Positive]

Just now, Big Turk said:

 

Scoring 31 points on 7 consecutive drives is pretty awesome for a "boring" offense.

I agree. I also credit Dorsey/McDermott for recognizing that the Browns have a terrible run D and actually running the ball. Detroit is bad at both run and pass D, so we'll see what the game plan is for this week.

[Son of a K-Gun]

38 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Cook and Hines (on return) have shown real speed and explosiveness. 

Get them the ball. 
 

5 Spread with Diggs Davis Shakir Cook Hines 
2 WR Diggs Davis, 1 TE Knox, 2 RB  Cook Hines 

I really like the idea of showing 21 with Hines and Cook in the backfield and then motioning one or both out wide to create coverage mismatches.  Then we can see something like this...

 

 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

4 hours ago, CNYfan said:

I think the Bills pass defense has been poor the past two contests and the Lions are prolific at scoring points.    The Bills will, again, probably need north of 30 points to win on Thursday.  

The 8 yard loss was the facemask tackle by Clowney.  

I don’t think it’s been as poor as it appears though.  The coverage was actually surprisingly good the last two weeks considering how many yards were allowed.  We just ran into Jefferson having the game of his life then jacoby brissett having the game of his life.  I’ve never seen him thread passes into tight coverage like that.  I don’t even think Goff is capable of that but we’ll see lol

 

i have admittedly not seen many lions games this year but I’d assume it’s more the lions scheming receivers open than Goff dropping dimes into tight coverage and his receivers making contested catches

 

If edmunds plays the game won’t even be remotely close but it sounds like he won’t be playing. That means the lions can be pretty effective by just picking on Dodson/Bernard all day 

Edited November 22, 2022 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Logic]

10 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Bills are better in pretty much every offensive category under Dorsey than under Daboll from last year, and especially on the Offensive Drive stat numbers. Average over 7 yards per drive more in terms of yards. Doesn't seem like much but it's a LOT considering the number of drives per game.

Thanks for the numbers.

It doesn't change my opinion of the things lacking in Dorsey's playcalling, though.

Numbers don't always tell the whole story.

In this case, I concede that the Bills offense, as a whole, is very productive, and its rankings and statistics prove it. Nevertheless, I feel they can be MORE productive. I feel like they could be 9-1 right now. I feel like they can re-establish their grip on the AFC if they can find ways to get more productivity out of their complementary pieces. This isn't a controversial opinion. Everyone from Bills fans to national analysts to the play-by-play guys for Bills games have been saying the same.

Hines, Cook, McKenzie. Lot of speed and explosiveness there. Find a way to use it!

[SCBills]

17 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

It just means that when the Bills are clicking on offense, it is a high-risk/high-reward style. Josh tries to force the ball into tight windows. It was working before the bye week. I mean, how many times did the media say "no one else could make that throw?" The game winner to Knox in KC or that one where Davis ripped it out of Fitzpatrick's hands against PIT come to mind. If you attempt those throws, some will get picked off. This week, he didn't try to make those throws. Josh had Diggs open in tight(ish) windows and chose to check down instead. We didn't turn the ball over, but there were no wow plays. I'm not sure what I prefer. 

Given teams are playing us to take away wow plays, if we stop turning it over and get better in the red zone … this offense will methodically score 40 ppg.   
 

*If Allen is willing to patient. 
 

Then, at some point, teams will come out of that defense.  Then… fireworks.  
 

It’s up to Allen really.  For the issues we may have, if the main pieces stay healthy (knock on wood), Allen’s physical traits are the only thing in the NFL on par with Reid/Mahomes genius. 
 

Edited November 22, 2022 by SCBills