Dorsey’s lack of adjustments in the second half; 12 second half points in the last 3 games

[Bangarang]

There’s nothing creative about the way Dorsey designs a game plan and calls a game. 
 

The offense falling apart in the second half is a concern. I don’t expect McD to make changes in season but if things continue the way they are then he should probably do something. 
 

I don’t want to hear all off-season about Dorsey is finding his way and figuring out ways to get the offense going. We can’t waste time hoping an OC figures things out. 

[Big Turk]

Just now, Bangarang said:

There’s nothing creative about the way Dorsey designs a game plan and calls a game. 
 

The offense falling apart in the second half is a concern. I don’t expect McD to make changes in season but if things continue the way they are then he should probably do something. 
 

I don’t want to hear all off-season about Dorsey is finding his way and figuring out ways to get the offense going. We can’t waste time hoping an OC figures things out. 

 

He is learning on the job. Same way as most people do. I think he will figure things out, might take him a little while. 

 

It's hard to complain about Dorsey when Allen has THREE!! great layup options to take on the final play and takes the one option that is a high risk, high reward play to try and end the game. There was no need for it.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

8 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

There’s nothing creative about the way Dorsey designs a game plan and calls a game. 
 

The offense falling apart in the second half is a concern. I don’t expect McD to make changes in season but if things continue the way they are then he should probably do something. 
 

I don’t want to hear all off-season about Dorsey is finding his way and figuring out ways to get the offense going. We can’t waste time hoping an OC figures things out. 

I don’t think it’s all on Dorsey…the execution has just been horrible at times.  The singletary fumble was maddening…and that final int maddening as well.  We were quick to blame Dorsey for not providing more underneath routes but I have watched that play 50 times now talking about the game with some friends and it honestly worked to perfection.  
 

josh could’ve either waited and hit singletary sneaking out after the block for a 5 yard gain…or thrown a not terrible ball to Davis and most likely had a td but it should’ve been at worst an incompletion.  The stacked crossing routes worked as intended as the middle safety followed the inside crosser leaving Davis in single coverage with Peterson with a step.  Josh threw such a bad ball that it looked like Peterson jumped the route but it was a very routine play against man coverage for josh.  The back middle of the end zone was open and he missed it by a mile.  If we don’t have confidence in him to make that throw then he shouldn’t be starting honestly. 
 

heck even the sneak wasn’t a bad call…what are the odds your 6’5” wrecking ball qb is gonna lose more than a half yard on a sneak with the new rules where he can get pushed from behind.  Slim to none 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Big Turk]

1 minute ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

I don’t think it’s all on Dorsey…the execution has just been horrible at times.  The singletary fumble was maddening…and that final int maddening as well.  We were quick to blame Dorsey for not providing more underneath routes but I have watched that play 50 times now talking about the game with some friends and it honestly worked to perfection.  
 

josh could’ve either waited and hit singletary sneaking out after the block for a 5 yard gain…or thrown a not terrible ball to Davis and most likely had a td but it should’ve been at worst an incompletion.  The stacked crossing routes worked as intended as the middle safety followed the inside crosser leaving Davis in single coverage with Peterson with a step.  Josh threw such a bad ball that it looked like Peterson jumped the route but it was a very routine play against man coverage for josh.  If we don’t have confidence in him to make that throw then he shouldn’t be starting 

 

Allen had 3 easy options. Singletary, running up the middle for an easy FD or Morris crossing wide open at the 10.

[Meatloaf63]

2 hours ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Haven’t we never been stopped on a qb sneak in Josh’s career up to that point?  

Tennessee last year, cost us the game.

[Brand J]

I haven’t read everything in this thread, but Dorsey only calls the plays, it’s on Allen and the rest of the offense to execute. Dorsey has to be better, no doubt, I’m not arguing that - and my main issue is with the lack of a running game - but if Patrick Mahomes was QB of the Bills, with Dorsey as the play caller, how would that offense look? And what would the Bills record be? Players play and coaches coach, Allen has to be better.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

6 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Allen had 3 easy options. Singletary, running up the middle for an easy FD or Morris crossing wide open at the 10.

Geez I didn’t even see Morris haha I’ve gotta watch again. I was focused on Davis.  Davis had a step that whole play and the throw was godawful.  If you freeze it just as the ball is released and showed it to 100 people that missed the game I don’t think one of them would guess interception knowing he’s going to Davis lol probably one of the worst throws of his career…he missed his window by about 12 yards 

 

the absolute worst result that should’ve been possible on that play was an incompletion out the back of the end zone but we are clearly masters of the impossible 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Big Turk]

1 minute ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Geez I didn’t even see Morris haha I’ve gotta watch again. I was focused on Davis.  Davis had a step that whole play and the throw was godawful.  If you freeze it just as the ball is released and showed it to 100 people that missed the game I don’t think one of them would guess interception knowing he’s going to Davis lol probably one of the worst throws of his career…he missed his window by about 12 yards 

 

Davis should have crossed the face of the defender not sink deeper. It was the wrong decision but Davis didn't help either.

Edited November 14, 2022 by Big Turk

[Bangarang]

3 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

He is learning on the job. Same way as most people do. I think he will figure things out, might take him a little while. 

 

It's hard to complain about Dorsey when Allen has THREE!! great layup options to take on the final play and takes the one option that is a high risk, high reward play to try and end the game. There was no need for it.

Is he actually learning if the offense is regressing and we keep seeing the same issues?

 

The complete inability to get Hines the ball is puzzling. 
 

The fact that we were even in that situation is part of the problem with Dorsey. The play calling, especially in the second half yesterday was atrocious. 

[Big Turk]

Just now, Bangarang said:

Is he actually learning if the offense is regressing and we keep seeing the same issues?

 

The complete inability to get Hines the ball is puzzling. 
 

The fact that we were even in that situation is part of the problem with Dorsey. The play calling, especially in the second half yesterday was atrocious. 

 

Are we really regressing when we are the #1 offense in the NFL at over 424 yards per game?

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

2 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Davis should have crossed the face of the defender not sink deeper. It was the wrong decision but Davis didn't help either.

I feel like there was a game losing play like that a couple years back with Davis too against the ravens…very similar route where he didn’t run at the appropriate angle and just kind of drifted 

 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

2 minutes ago, Process said:

Toney 90 yards and a TD acquired same time as Hines. 

 

I'm sure Hines lack of involvement is because we have such a complicated offense. Sure. Even though it appears to be one of the least creative ive seen. 

 

Yes Allen has been bad but this team has a coaching problem.

Toney did virtually nothing against Tennessee  and the vast majority of that came against jax so I’d take those results with a grain of salt lol

 

hines made a couple huge plays in the return game that will fly way under the radar for most.  I’d give him some time 

[BBills_88]

We kind of went through a 3rd quarter slump when Dabol was OC for most of the year.   Dorsey will be fine learning on the job.  JA will be fine. The team will be fine. 

 

[Best Williams Available]

42 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

But...on the bright side. How good does a team have to be to have their entire starting secondary out, a starting LB out, make numerous mind numbing mistakes, turn the ball over at an NFL high rate and STILL require miraculous things for good teams with a combined record of 23-7 to win on the final possession of the game by 3 points or less?

 

Most teams get blown out if even one of those things happen against them.

True true

[Ralonzo]

10 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Another point, I’ve seen a lot of headscratching calls over the years, but doing a QB sneak on the half yard line (by which Morse/Allen fumbled) has to be up there with amongst the dumbest calls I ever seen.

 

Really? Then tell me which play which starts with a fumbled C-QB exchange actually works.

 

The play call is not the problem here.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

9 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

At the half yard line, you think a QB sneak is the safest play? I can see a few yards out trying the QB sneak, but at the half yard line, there is zero room for error. I would have rather seen them intentionally take a safety in that position, then what they actually called. 

I think we have a bunch of captain hindsight’s here 😂. Now that I slept on it and have a clear head a sneak is far and away the safest play and it’s not particularly close.  
 

I can’t recall if the titans game was officially a called qb sneak but it should still be safe to say that sneaks are successful for us well over 90% of the time when we have to GAIN yards.  And now you can have a player behind the qb pushing so it should work at an even higher percentage and we didn’t even have to gain yards.  We just had to not lose more than a half yard on two consecutive plays.  Heck even a safety on the second sneak attempt likely would’ve been fine.   An intentional safety on the first play though would’ve preserved a timeout for them so I don’t think that was really an option.
 

 The odds of us losing the game the way we did were astronomically small which is a fact I think people just haven’t really wrapped their heads around yet 

 

the play I would absolutely flame the coaching staff for is not taking that fg earlier in the second half 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Haslett_Stomp]

1 hour ago, Utah John said:

So there are two main points from the OP.  Was the QB sneak the right call?  Yes I think it was.  It's the safest play there is, and I don't ever remember a fumble happening on the center-QB exchange.  The only other option was an intentional safety, but that would have given the Vikings a 2 point deficit and the ball and an opportunity for another Jefferson catch to get into FG range.  So no.

 

The other was about Dorsey not keeping the offense working well in the second half, and I think that criticism is spot on.  Also, all these red zone interceptions seem to be coming from defenders lurking and waiting to undercut our receiver routes.  Wake up, Ken and Josh.  The league knows what you like to do.  

 

I don't remember where I read it earlier this morning but I saw a quote from Peterson where he basically said they knew what Allen likes to do in the red zone and were ready for it (something about trusting his arm).

Edited November 14, 2022 by Haslett_Stomp

[starrymessenger]

3 hours ago, gjv said:

From my perspective, I think Josh came to the line and saw that the Vikings had stacked the middle. It appeared to me Josh was going to run to the gap on his right. He was so anxious to get there that he didn't secure the snap.

I think that's exactly what happened.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

14 minutes ago, Haslett_Stomp said:

 

I don't remember where I read it earlier this morning but I saw a quote from Peterson where he basically said they knew what Allen likes to do in the red zone and were ready for it (something about trusting his arm).

They were not ready for it lol he’s full of sh*t. the Vikings were outschemed badly on that play even if the ball was required to go to Davis.  Peterson was likely beat for the game winner but the throw was horrendous.  If Davis runs a better route he’s wide open for the game winner 

 

leaving the two first reads on the play more or less open on back to back plays for tds after allowing 60 josh Allen rushing yards certainly shows no evidence that they have some secret recipe for stopping josh Allen lol

 

the Vikings are gonna watch the film and know they got away with one with that final play 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Jerry Jabber]

21 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

I think we have a bunch of captain hindsight’s here 😂. Now that I slept on it and have a clear head a sneak is far and away the safest play and it’s not particularly close.  
 

I can’t recall if the titans game was officially a called qb sneak but it should still be safe to say that sneaks are successful for us well over 90% of the time when we have to GAIN yards.  And now you can have a player behind the qb pushing so it should work at an even higher percentage and we didn’t even have to gain yards.  We just had to not lose more than a half yard on two consecutive plays.  Heck even a safety on the second sneak attempt likely would’ve been fine.   An intentional safety on the first play though would’ve preserved a timeout for them so I don’t think that was really an option.
 

 The odds of us losing the game the way we did were astronomically small which is a fact I think people just haven’t really wrapped their heads around yet 

 

the play I would absolutely flame the coaching staff for is not taking that fg earlier in the second half 

With the Vikings knowing the Bills were going to do a QB sneak, they stacked the line and prepared for what was coming. All the Vikings had to do was make the Bills lose more than a half of yard and they would have gotten a safety at minimum. 
 

Against Dallas (I think on Thanksgiving), Allen/Morse botched the snap on the QB sneak, but the Bills got lucky, Allen recovered the fumble and outmuscled the opposition. The QB sneak failed last year against the Titans and it cost us the game. So, safest play at the half yard line?! Give me a break!