Anybody see replay of Dion's holding penalty

[LABILLBACKER]

Such a huge play and call. 1:43 left and Diggsy makes an amazing catch. Instantly put us at NYJ49. Was it an egregious flag by Land Shark? If that flag isn't thrown, Josh does get hurt.  Anyone see it on tape or all22?

[newcam2012]

I haven't seen it. Joe Marino on his YouTube Locked on Bills commented it was a horrible call. He's a very good source of reliable information. 

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

Wasn't it the only holding call on either offensive line all game?  

[Orlando Buffalo]

I have seen it and based on what was called, or rather not called, consistently up to that point it was a bad call. It would have been ticky tack at the best of times.

[LABILLBACKER]

3 minutes ago, HereComesTheReignAgain said:

Wasn't it the only holding call on either offensive line all game?  

Yes it was.

[Gugny]

It's a shame, because the refs did a nice job of letting them play all game.  Unfortunate that they decided to get ticky tacky at that point in the game.  But let's be honest ... that ain't why the Bills lost.

[NewEra]

Bad call imo.  I thought what got him into trouble was the slight whipping motion he made when he threw him down. He had his arms around him. I can see why they called it, but I don’t think they should’ve.  Especially for that moment….. sigh.  Very disheartening to lose that great play Diggs made due to some Bs that they let go the entire game.  It’s not like dion was getting beat and held to save his QB.   He crushed dude. 

2 minutes ago, Gugny said:

It's a shame, because the refs did a nice job of letting them play all game.  Unfortunate that they decided to get ticky tacky at that point in the game.  But let's be honest ... that ain't why the Bills lost.

But we may have won if that didn’t happen. Josh may not have been injured either.  😞 

[What a Tuel]

The fact that they didn't replay it on TV was a huge indication on how bad of a call it was.

[strive_for_five_guy]

5 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

The fact that they didn't replay it on TV was a huge indication on how bad of a call it was.

Does anyone know whether the television crews are being instructed to not show as many replays of questionable calls?  Maybe I’m just making it up in my mind, but I feel like fewer are being shown this year.

[Turbo44]

I saw the replay of it and it was a really bad call.  The DE went inside of Dawkins who pushed him further inside, pancaked him and fell on him. He didn't appear to use his hands at all but perhaps he blocked him too well.  Compared to some of the holding I witnessed elsewhere - like to holding on Phillips on one of the Jets long runs, it was a ridiculously terrible call.  Diggs apparently didn't get both feet in but i'd prefer 2nd and 10 to 1st and 20.   

[Airseven]

Diggsy?

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

14 minutes ago, Gugny said:

It's a shame, because the refs did a nice job of letting them play all game.  Unfortunate that they decided to get ticky tacky at that point in the game.  But let's be honest ... that ain't why the Bills lost.

Idk. Allen played horribly for sure, but in the end he put us in position to win. It was a BS call, let’s call a spade a spade. I hate when people say a team “deserves” to lose. What happened before shouldn’t matter. Plenty of QBs have had sloppy games and end up winning. That flag never should’ve been thrown. Refs should never dictate the outcome of a game unless the penalty is blatant. 

[Big Turk]

29 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Such a huge play and call. 1:43 left and Diggsy makes an amazing catch. Instantly put us at NYJ49. Was it an egregious flag by Land Shark? If that flag isn't thrown, Josh does get hurt.  Anyone see it on tape or all22?

 

Yeah I have watched it many times...my thoughts:

 

It isn't a hold, it's a dominant finish, but the kind that is going to get called as a hold every time in the NFL unfortunately.

[Zag20]

It seemed like the defender tripped on Saffold’s feet and went down on account of that possibly

[folz]

Just watched the All-22 of the play a bunch of times.

 

It was a bad call, but I can see how/why the ref made the call. The defender sets up outside Dion's left shoulder, then rushes inside. Dion does a good job of engaging and sliding to keep the man in front of him. From the ref's perspective, he sees the defender's head poke out around Dion and then all of a sudden the defender is falling sideways to the ground and Dion has one hand on his shoulder and another around his waist. So, from the ref's vantage point it probably looked like the defender was starting to win and Dion tackled him.

 

In reality, as the defender moved to his left, engaged with Dion, Saffold (I believe) pulls off his initial double team block with Morse to help Dion (but gets there late and is behind the defender). At the same time, Morse is being pushed back by his defender. The outcome is a lot of moving feet in the same area and the defender trips. You can clearly see one of the defender's feet get hooked behind the other and he trips. The defender starts falling down to the left and since Dion is still engaged with him, he starts going down too and rides the defender to the ground. Good play by Dion, just unfortunate that from the ref's vantage point, he couldn't see the trip and assumed it was a tackle. There is a possibility that Dion had a good hold on the defender's right shoulder pad, but that would have been a ticky-tack call and in the category of let them play...but the ref thought it was a tackle.

 

I understand let them play at that point, especially since the refs kept their flags in their pockets a lot that game. But, if it was an actual tackle (from the ref's perspective), then that is egregious enough to call even at that point in the game. 

 

The call definitely went the wrong way, but I don't think there was any bias, or the refs helping the Jets out...just bad luck how everything unfolded and the ref's view of it.

Edited November 9, 2022 by folz

[RobbRiddick]

Did Diggs have both feet down? From my elderly memory it looked on the replay like one of them was just above the turf when he went out

[Gugny]

6 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Idk. Allen played horribly for sure, but in the end he put us in position to win. It was a BS call, let’s call a spade a spade. I hate when people say a team “deserves” to lose. What happened before shouldn’t matter. Plenty of QBs have had sloppy games and end up winning. That flag never should’ve been thrown. Refs should never dictate the outcome of a game unless the penalty is blatant. 

 

I've never been one to point to one play that decides a game.  Take away the two bone-headed INTs and the Bills aren't worrying about a 4th Quarter comeback.

 

[LABILLBACKER]

25 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Bad call imo.  I thought what got him into trouble was the slight whipping motion he made when he threw him down. He had his arms around him. I can see why they called it, but I don’t think they should’ve.  Especially for that moment….. sigh.  Very disheartening to lose that great play Diggs made due to some Bs that they let go the entire game.  It’s not like dion was getting beat and held to save his QB.   He crushed dude. 

But we may have won if that didn’t happen. Josh may not have been injured either.  😞 

That's what is so frustrating on that call. Definitely cost us a chance to tie at the very least. And we lose Josh on the very next play.

[Beast]

11 minutes ago, Airseven said:

Diggsy?

You should see what we call you when you’re not around.

[LABILLBACKER]

2 minutes ago, RobbRiddick said:

Did Diggs have both feet down? From my elderly memory it looked on the replay like one of them was just above the turf when he went out

Yup, toe tapped right foot bringing up pellots.