Bills need to learn how to “win ugly”

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I said this coming into the Jets game, but the thing that this team needs is to

learn how to “win ugly.” 
 

there is a little Clip I post below, where the commenters made this same point about the patriots. Brady would be off, or guys would be injured, or they just wouldn’t play their best. In those games, they still knew how to win. Key ST play, decent game from a RB, not turning the ball over, etc. 

 

For us, that means not turning the ball over, taking the check downs, making some FG’s, hitting good punts, playing field position, letting the other inferior teams make mistakes. If we had done that yesterday, it would have been an easy but maybe ugly 20-10 win.

 

I think a lot of this comes down to coaching and offensive playcalling

and decision-making. The Bills really need to play cleaner games. This is a long season— can’t always play your best football or be fully healthy. But you still have to gut out wins.

 

https://www.espn.com/espnplus/player?id=27820471

 

 

[WyoAZBillfan]

I Agree with all of that!!

We have won ugly sometimes, I mean we turned the ball over vs the Rams and GB. Not that we really were ever losing those contests.  Just feels as though somebody other than JA has to step up in games, take some of the pressure off him. The Brady reference is true, heck the 90’s Bills teams also held true to a point as well. 
 

The team we’ll be fine, earlier this season it was lack of ability to win close games, this is still a young team and feels like coaches need to learn how to be flexible more often, or just more frequently. Be fluid.

 

Go Bills!!

[BigBuff423]

I'd agree in general...they lacked the ability to finish close games last year and the year before, and they've been improving that this year - now, they need to learn how to win when it all seems to be "off"...how struggle and fight through it to get the "W" in the midst of all of that...as for the *Pats reference, it's a valid and salient one. How many times did the Bills lose to the Pats despite Brady getting pressured and throwing it away, or their running game being "juuuuust enough" but fumbles or their receivers dropping balls or falling down, etc.? There were a number of them when the individual pieces looked like they were falling apart but the whole was good enough, and gritty enough to overcome and hit a late FG or get a late stop to secure the win....Bills need that too if they're going to be better than just "good", which they have been for the last three years.

[pocoboy]

Another part of winning ugly - look at the way they treated Milano, Poyer, and White this week.

 

1) Teams shouldn't need extra motivation to beat you, but clearly that kind of thing happens in the NFL - and if they had given any indication that those guys would be in there in a big game, it's just the kind of disrespect a coach like Saleh is going to pump his team with.

2) You're also without those guys, which puts your team at some level of disadvantage

3) It also COULD signal to your own guys - who each may be fighting their own level of pain/injury - that "man maybe if I were more important they'd look to give me the week off" & bag it.

 

Of course it would mean risking each of those guys getting injured worse (Poyer may be an outlier, he seemed to be the worst of the bunch not practicing at all last week). But if I'm evaluating my coach/GM, they'd better be considering a division opponent an important game - especially when you're already 0-1 in the division.

 

Again, the loss is the generator of every overreaction in the book - but I believe it all adds up to the team not putting much importance on @NYJ, and while there's a good chance it won't impact the playoff hunt, you never know.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

I’m frustrated with this constant Buffalo media narrative that you can’t run the ball, should never look to run the ball, not running it is no problem, etc.

 

Singletary has been fine for us this season.

 

The offense felt discombobulated yesterday, and we could have used some 3-4 yard gains to settle out.

 

Cook has no role in this offense. Hines is going to see the ball 1-2 times a week. Sal C is out of his mind if he thinks Hines is going to play slot for us, he’s an ok receiving type back. 
 

The coaches are doing this to themselves.

 

It’s a 1-score game and Singletary gets what, one carry in the second half? 

Just a thought, if Singletary got 30 carries against the Vikings, he’d be fine and have 120-150 yards rushing.

 

I actually agree with McDermott here. We need to stick with the run a bit more in these games. You don’t need Dalvin Cook, or Nick Chubb to be effective. 
 

n We overthink ourselves and limit ourselves by saying we can’t, we can’t, we can’t. 

Edited November 7, 2022 by Straight Hucklebuck

[Jauronimo]

Ugly is the new close games.  I thought Baltimore was plenty ugly.

[pocoboy]

I'm also going to add this - being at the game yesterday, the general sentiment being spewed by the Jets' faithful is that Allen is a paper tiger MVP candidate - that he can't make the big throws, and will look to run as soon as the situation turns dark.

 

I don't think that's true, but I do believe that - generally speaking - this team is generally viewed outside WNY as majorly overrated. Some of it for sure is jealousy, but these players have to learn that they have a target on their backs every single week.

7 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

The offense felt discombobulated yesterday, and we could have used some 3-4 yard gains to settle out.

 

Cook has no role in this offense. Hines is going to see the ball 1-2 times a week. 
 

The coaches are doing this to themselves.

 

Coaches, or QB. Who knows? What one can say is that they've spent considerable resources towards RB, and to not be effectively using that position group is some kind of knock against the OC. On the other hand - JA17 is often checking at the line, and if he checks into a run when it's ill-advised, it'll likely fail.

Edited November 7, 2022 by pocoboy

[Greg S]

2 minutes ago, pocoboy said:

I'm also going to add this - being at the game yesterday, the general sentiment being spewed by the Jets' faithful is that Allen is a paper tiger MVP candidate - that he can't make the big throws, and will look to run as soon as the situation turns dark.

 

I don't think that's true, but I do believe that - generally speaking - this team is generally viewed outside WNY as majorly overrated. Some of it for sure is jealousy, but these players have to learn that they have a target on their backs every single week.

 

Well Jets fans are experts on top notch QB play. Wilson, Darnold, Sanchez etc etc. Probably not too many left who were around to see #12

Edited November 7, 2022 by Greg S

[LabattBlue]

Winning ugly is exactly what KC did last night, and I hope this past weekend isn’t looked back at, as the weekend that determined the #1 seed in the AFC. 

[FilthyBeast]

100% true and why I mentioned in another thread why KC/Mahomes is still the gold standard.

 

JA17 has to learn to play with a more steady hand and control his emotions on the field. Until then he'll never be in Mahomes class no matter how much some Bills mafia wants to argue otherwise.

 

At the end of the day though the bigger issue IMO is still McDermott, especially the defensive scheme that seems to play conservative at all costs when they shouldn't.

[The Firebaugh Kid]

6 minutes ago, pocoboy said:

I'm also going to add this - being at the game yesterday, the general sentiment being spewed by the Jets' faithful is that Allen is a paper tiger MVP candidate - that he can't make the big throws, and will look to run as soon as the situation turns dark.

 

I don't think that's true, but I do believe that - generally speaking - this team is generally viewed outside WNY as majorly overrated. Some of it for sure is jealousy, but these players have to learn that they have a target on their backs every single week.

 

Coaches, or QB. Who knows? What one can say is that they've spent considerable resources towards RB, and to not be effectively using that position group is some kind of knock against the OC. On the other hand - JA17 is often checking at the line, and if he checks into a run when it's ill-advised, it'll likely fail.

Jealousy, plain and simple. Allen is the best in the league when he's on. 

[ExWNYer]

They have 'losing ugly' down to a science...

[pocoboy]

1 minute ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

Jealousy, plain and simple. Allen is the best in the league when he's on. 

Of course, and as I said to the morons, they're about as far from a league MVP QB as anyone could be.

[Johnnycage46]

31 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

I said this coming into the Jets game, but the thing that this team needs is to

learn how to “win ugly.” 
 

there is a little Clip I post below, where the commenters made this same point about the patriots. Brady would be off, or guys would be injured, or they just wouldn’t play their best. In those games, they still knew how to win. Key ST play, decent game from a RB, not turning the ball over, etc. 

 

For us, that means not turning the ball over, taking the check downs, making some FG’s, hitting good punts, playing field position, letting the other inferior teams make mistakes. If we had done that yesterday, it would have been an easy but maybe ugly 20-10 win.

 

I think a lot of this comes down to coaching and offensive playcalling

and decision-making. The Bills really need to play cleaner games. This is a long season— can’t always play your best football or be fully healthy. But you still have to gut out wins.

 

https://www.espn.com/espnplus/player?id=27820471

 

 

 

Agreed.  The Chiefs last night won ugly.  Sometimes that's what is needed to get the W.

[BuffaloRebound]

16 minutes ago, pocoboy said:

Another part of winning ugly - look at the way they treated Milano, Poyer, and White this week.

 

1) Teams shouldn't need extra motivation to beat you, but clearly that kind of thing happens in the NFL - and if they had given any indication that those guys would be in there in a big game, it's just the kind of disrespect a coach like Saleh is going to pump his team with.

2) You're also without those guys, which puts your team at some level of disadvantage

3) It also COULD signal to your own guys - who each may be fighting their own level of pain/injury - that "man maybe if I were more important they'd look to give me the week off" & bag it.

 

Of course it would mean risking each of those guys getting injured worse (Poyer may be an outlier, he seemed to be the worst of the bunch not practicing at all last week). But if I'm evaluating my coach/GM, they'd better be considering a division opponent an important game - especially when you're already 0-1 in the division.

 

Again, the loss is the generator of every overreaction in the book - but I believe it all adds up to the team not putting much importance on @NYJ, and while there's a good chance it won't impact the playoff hunt, you never know.

Excellent points.  Mosley came back in game after what looked like a separated shoulder.  Diggs goes to the bench anytime he’s touched.  

Who was the hungrier team yesterday?  

[pocoboy]

1 minute ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Excellent points.  Mosley came back in game after what looked like a separated shoulder.  Diggs goes to the bench anytime he’s touched.  

Who was the hungrier team yesterday?  

 

They're built to the liking of the Stat Nerds who don't believe in momentum or smashmouth trench warfare. Is it any wonder that the team fancies itself as too dainty to be willing to play through a sore toenail?

[BuffaloRebound]

9 minutes ago, pocoboy said:

 

They're built to the liking of the Stat Nerds who don't believe in momentum or smashmouth trench warfare. Is it any wonder that the team fancies itself as too dainty to be willing to play through a sore toenail?

Just looks like we’re trying to coast until we get closer to the home stretch.  Who knows, maybe it’ll work.  Heck, Thurman did  the same thing Diggs does in the last half of his career going to sideline after he got hit and he lasted 12 years and ended up in Canton.  

From a fan perspective, it’s frustrating especially when McDermott constantly preaches the ‘hungry and humble’ line.  Gotta be infuriating for Bills fans at Met Life yesterday.  

[pocoboy]

5 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

 Gotta be infuriating for Bills fans at Met Life yesterday.  

 

Yeah it was a real %$(*$& %$&*$( %& *%($&^W@_) &%($#& of $%&$(%& #&%$(@ %&@^.

[Big Blitz]

You can’t with this oline and complete lack of running game

 

DCs just don’t care if we hand it off. 
 

No RB with breakaway speed. 
 

No RB that’s a physical pain to bring down.   
 

 

Those of us “pounding the table!” for a run game back in oh December of 2021 knew the league was catching up to Mahomes and Allen and if they aren’t great that day you need an RB (especially in Buffalo in winter) to bail you out.  
 

My biggest issue is what will surely be mocked like the audacity of wanting to trade up for an RB or give whatever draft capital you could for CMC - it is an absolute fact if teams see the only thing you can do isn’t working - the life gets sucked from your team real quick and the energy shifts right to your opponent because they know they got you

 

 

We have 1 weapon on offense right now.  1

 

In back to back games the number 1 CB (in fairness we just saw 2 of the best in the league) completely neutralize Davis and teams are doubling Diggs.  Dorsey needs to figure this out.

 

McKenzie not being a viable option is just as big a deal as having no running game 

[BigBuff423]

46 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

You can’t with this oline and complete lack of running game

 

DCs just don’t care if we hand it off. 
 

No RB with breakaway speed. 
 

No RB that’s a physical pain to bring down.   
 

 

Those of us “pounding the table!” for a run game back in oh December of 2021 knew the league was catching up to Mahomes and Allen and if they aren’t great that day you need an RB (especially in Buffalo in winter) to bail you out.  
 

My biggest issue is what will surely be mocked like the audacity of wanting to trade up for an RB or give whatever draft capital you could for CMC - it is an absolute fact if teams see the only thing you can do isn’t working - the life gets sucked from your team real quick and the energy shifts right to your opponent because they know they got you

 

 

We have 1 weapon on offense right now.  1

 

In back to back games the number 1 CB (in fairness we just saw 2 of the best in the league) completely neutralize Davis and teams are doubling Diggs.  Dorsey needs to figure this out.

 

McKenzie not being a viable option is just as big a deal as having no running game 

 

I've said it in other places, the absence of a true slot WR is holding the Offense back. That and Josh seems off for an unknown reason, but the slot WR isn't cutting it and in a year when they need all of these complementary parts to hold their own because every team is coming for them...that's what it means when you're top dawg...you're the hunted. Not because you're weak, or ripe for the plucking, but because you're on top of that mountain and in the AFC, that's who the Bills have become - especially after beating KC a few weeks ago.