Why oh why are we not establishing a running game ?

[The Frankish Reich]

Line: we hate PFF.  I know, I know ...

... but here it completely agrees with my perceptions:

- Dawkins: good (PFF rating in the low 70s)

- Saffold: awful (PFF rating in the mid-40s). How is it that he's actually been worse than Feliciano was? I wasn't expecting that. But old is old.

- Morse/Bates/Brown/Quessenberry: marginal/replacement level (low 60s)

It's awfully hard to trade for an O lineman and fit him in during the season. But that's kind of the move they needed to at least try to make. There's no in-house help (Boettger? Really?). It was rough watching the Jets get pressure late in the game on every dropback with a pure 4-man rush. We better get used to it and try to scheme around it as best we can.

[97bills]

29 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

Why aren't the Chiefs establishing a running game?

They do in there own way with jet sweeps and screens. Then you have a TE who just eats all day on short passes. Buffalo dose none of that. 

[MarkyMannn]

6 hours ago, Returntoglory said:

We have the backs. What gives???

Uh NO we don't

[Ethan in Cleveland]

8 hours ago, Dr.Sack said:

Why are we put 4 DL and 2 LB for a 6 man box when teams are intent on running on us?

Did you watch the game?  They played a tone of single high safety today with one of the safeties in the box.  

[Dr.Sack]

4 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Did you watch the game?  They played a tone of single high safety today with one of the safeties in the box.  

Pre snap, and lots of bales plus 1 safety or Taron Johnson is not equivalent to a 3rd LB or extra DT in terms of being able to take on blockers when they have run heavy fronts. 

[mrags]

8 hours ago, FireChans said:

8 carries for 24 yards.

 

our running backs SUCK.

 

it’s why we continue to draft and trade for them.

 

They.

Are.

Not.

Good.

One of these days maybe people will agree that superior talent at the position is worth drafting in the first round. Probably not with this bunch tho. 

[Gunsgoodtime]

12 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Barry Sanders couldn't run behind this OL.  End of question. 

Dang bro lol.  That is about as low a blow as you could go.  Dude literally took on 11 people alone every week 

Edited November 7, 2022 by Gunsgoodtime

[Maine-iac]

16 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

There's not only the eye test but there is tons of advanced metrics out there that sum up what I've said. 

By all means share some of those advanced metrics that say Singletary is the problem with the running game.

[TwistofFate]

2 hours ago, Maine-iac said:

By all means share some of those advanced metrics that say Singletary is the problem with the running game.

 

https://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/advanced-stats-rb.php

 

 

He doesn't break tackles, he's stopped almost immediately 1v1, he's not slippery enough to win 1v1 coming through the line against safeties and backers and his vision is questionable. (he doesn't create or feel the flow of the line to use cut back lanes)

 

He's a hard worker and well rounded as well as an outstanding teammate, but he isnt a feature back.

 

 

Edited November 7, 2022 by TwistofFate

[B-Large]

Mahommes has 60+ pass attempts and was the Chiefs leading rusher last night... we're not alone.

Edited November 7, 2022 by B-Large

[FieldGeneral]

Many fans believe that Allen can do anything for this team. There are only 60 minutes to a football game. If you don't execute efficiently, you get what happened yesterday. Yes, Allen can run, but he shouldn't be our leading passer and rusher. Teams that are built to win a title can make you pay for focusing on one aspect of an offense or defense. We have fallen in love with Josh's arm, that it's almost tunnel vision at this point. 

[34-78-83]

19 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Line: we hate PFF.  I know, I know ...

... but here it completely agrees with my perceptions:

- Dawkins: good (PFF rating in the low 70s)

- Saffold: awful (PFF rating in the mid-40s). How is it that he's actually been worse than Feliciano was? I wasn't expecting that. But old is old.

- Morse/Bates/Brown/Quessenberry: marginal/replacement level (low 60s)

It's awfully hard to trade for an O lineman and fit him in during the season. But that's kind of the move they needed to at least try to make. There's no in-house help (Boettger? Really?). It was rough watching the Jets get pressure late in the game on every dropback with a pure 4-man rush. We better get used to it and try to scheme around it as best we can.

... And that's where the analysis goes to crap with Morse being listed as replacement level. Dawkins and Morse are both above average, top quarter of the league at their positions guys, in both the run game and the pass game. Morse is an athletic center and better suited in the Pin and Pulls we run in the ground game.

 

Funny irony - if we did run the ball a lot more (which we definitely don't need to do, we just need to be effective enough at it, and also utilize the short passing game more!) then Saffold and Quessenberry's grades would probably look a lot better because those guys are above average run blockers, but (far) below average pass blockers.

 

Stats and grades woot!

[Maine-iac]

2 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

 

https://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/advanced-stats-rb.php

 

 

He doesn't break tackles, he's stopped almost immediately 1v1, he's not slippery enough to win 1v1 coming through the line against safeties and backers and his vision is questionable. (he doesn't create or feel the flow of the line to use cut back lanes)

 

He's a hard worker and well rounded as well as an outstanding teammate, but he isnt a feature back.

 

 

Not sure how a link to a fantasy football stat site proves anything.  What exactly proves your point?  Mind you when you bring up a stat from the 8 games this season to say he can't do something there is most likely a career long history of him in fact being able to do it.  It's well documented that he is both good at yards after contact and making tacklers miss.

[In Summary]

On 11/6/2022 at 9:07 PM, The Frankish Reich said:

I'd go with 80% garbage - Dawkins is generally solid.

If Dawkins had prime Incognito next to him he'd be viewed differently. 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

On 11/6/2022 at 4:19 PM, IronMaidenBills said:

We can’t. Our Oline is pure garbage. 

How is Singletary averaging 4+ ypc? 

 

James Cook is averaging 5.3 ypc?

 

 

[mjd1001]

On 11/6/2022 at 4:18 PM, Returntoglory said:

My God! Putting too much pressure on Allen. We have the backs. What gives???

As others have said, it doesn't work well.  The OL is terrible at run blocking. It was bad run blocking 2 years ago, it was bad last year, its bad this year.  Sure, they may have a game or two where they are decent, but this offense moves the ball best when Allen throws, not when giving the ball to the RB more than half the plays.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

On 11/6/2022 at 8:51 PM, LeGOATski said:

Why aren't the Chiefs establishing a running game?

Because the Chiefs rotate 5 different WRs behind Kelce:

 

Hardman (4.31 in the 40) 

JuJu Smith-Schuster

Marques Valdez-Scandling

Kadarius Toney

Skyy Moore

 

And they have the best QB in football, with a legendary offensive coach.

 

The Bills have a great playmaker at QB, a high-end #1, an all or nothing deep threat, and little else at WR or Tight End. 

[ghostwriter]

On 11/6/2022 at 4:18 PM, Returntoglory said:

My God! Putting too much pressure on Allen. We have the backs. What gives???

Running the football is a team effort, everyone is lazy because Allen is their QB and he bails them out constantly.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Against the Vikings, if the Bills came out and gave James Cook 30 carries, I think he'd have ~150 yards rushing. 

 

I think we'd be fine. 

 

Sal C and all of our media love to push this idea of trust. You have to trust James Cook before you can give him more workload. He's been fine, over 5 yards per carry, catching the ball easily out of the backfield. 

 

I get that we don't want to be a running team, perfectly fine, but we don't stick with the run. We bail immediately and start chucking, and/or just say Josh is 6'5" and he can handle that too. 

 

Singletary and Cook should be getting 20 combined handoffs every game, to take some load off Allen. 

 

I listened to Dorsey talk again about game flow and that's ok, but what was the game flow when you called back to back Zack Moss runs for 1-yard against Miami? 

 

What about game flow when James Cook has 5 carries for 35 yards in rapid succession in Green Bay and then never sees the ball again? 

[John from Riverside]

5 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

 

https://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/advanced-stats-rb.php

 

 

He doesn't break tackles, he's stopped almost immediately 1v1, he's not slippery enough to win 1v1 coming through the line against safeties and backers and his vision is questionable. (he doesn't create or feel the flow of the line to use cut back lanes)

 

He's a hard worker and well rounded as well as an outstanding teammate, but he isnt a feature back.

 

 

Literally none of what you just said is true but the exact opposite his problem is that he just doesn’t have another gear