Gugny Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 5 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: the cheating helped The constant bending and breaking of the rules helped him too the Refs turning a blind eye also helped them. if you have to cheat to win. Are you really that good? I'm glad you brought up rules. The fact that Belichick has always known the rules better than anyone else is, in my opinion. one of the things that makes him the best ever. He never broke rules. He learned them and exploited them. That's not cheating. Working the system? Yes. But cheating? No. As far as the refs go, that is completely out of any head coach's control. I get that Bills fans hate Belichick because he's owned us for the majority of his career and that there are sour grapes because the Bills, during Belichick's tenure in New England, have hired some of the absolute worst coaches the league has ever seen. But sometimes, you just gotta give credit where it's due. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 32 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: That couldn’t stop Josh Allen last season barring 60 mile per hour winds He was so amazed he personally walked into the Bills locker room and had a chat with Josh. What is Tua’s record against BB? The fact that he can’t stop a unicorn that nobody in the league. Doesn’t mean anything He stopped the highest scoring offense in NFL history against the bills in Super Bowl 25 Shut down the greatest show on turf against St. Louis And just has 30+ years of defensive mastermind game plans He’s always been ahead of the curve 39 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: Belicheat went to the Pats when Drew was QB. The team was already playoff caliber when he got there Then there was the Tuck game that f’d the Raiders then it was PATRIOTIC to root for them after 9-11. Then there was Spygate do I need to keep listing them? They’re not even based in New York City I never understood how it was patriotic to root for them lol Just because it’s in their name New York City and New England have nothing to do with each other And the patriots have like zero fans in New York City where the tragedy occurred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 Coryell Levy Knox Noll Landry Gibbs Schottenhiemer - i loved me some Marty ball I hate to say it but Jimmy Johnson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextmanup Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 18 minutes ago, Gugny said: I'm glad you brought up rules. The fact that Belichick has always known the rules better than anyone else is, in my opinion. one of the things that makes him the best ever. He never broke rules. He learned them and exploited them. That's not cheating. Working the system? Yes. But cheating? No. As far as the refs go, that is completely out of any head coach's control. I get that Bills fans hate Belichick because he's owned us for the majority of his career and that there are sour grapes because the Bills, during Belichick's tenure in New England, have hired some of the absolute worst coaches the league has ever seen. But sometimes, you just gotta give credit where it's due. Your post here is just 100% dead on the money. Not only do I agree that Belichick did not "cheat," but I would argue that is not even debatable. As you say, studying the rules to find gray areas that can be exploited to your benefit is not cheating. It's called being smart. Formula One motor racing teams have armies of engineers and technical people that are paid many millions of dollars each year to do exactly what Belichick did. It's an accepted part of the sport and finding a rule to exploit to you advantage might be the difference between winning the championship and not. Only in football and Bills land would this be thought of "cheating." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 One of my favorite football quotes, from Bum Phillips, is “he can take his’ n and beat your’n, and your’n and beat his’n.” I’ve read different accounts. One has him talking about Bear Bryant, and the other about Don Shula. Perhaps he said it twice. Being an NFL coach is such a unique job. GMs and scouts find talent and ability and certainly look at character and personality when they assemble teams. Coaches, though, they’re the straw that stirs the drink. The demographics, culture, upbringing, values, education, family situations of the 50 or so men in a locker room can’t be more diverse. You get close in a military unit, perhaps, but even then there are divisions in the natural groups that form. You have enlisted high school kids from one background and an officer corps from another. Comparable. But, a locker room is different. There is no rank among the 50. You have to make them know, like and trust one another and perform at elite levels. No small task. A football team is conjoined “twins” of fifty men sharing so many qualities and all individuals. Coaches are teachers, confidants, mentors, parents and bosses. They’re also lion tamers catching eyes with theirs in a no nonsense glare, demanding a behavior with a glance, before moving to the next restless and dangerous beautiful specimen. Control an animal superstar and the crowd roars at the synchronized wonder. Break that same animal and the crowd groans at the disjointed performance. Life’s funny. I know two coaches quite well. Time and distance have reduced our nights out to once every two years or so. Long ago, it was more frequent. When you’re out with then and five or six others you feel them. One for all and all for one. Their room presence and intellectual, emotional and physical charisma is palpable. Logos, ethos, pathos, in the words of Aristotle. Now, this isn’t all coaches, of course. I wouldn’t call Belichick charismatic. Rare bread and worth every penny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextmanup Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 4 hours ago, Chaos said: Success and Innovation. OK, but how do you quantify "Success" and "innovation?" Win %? Most SB wins? Most winning seasons or something? If you are going to go by hard statistical data, you don't need to ask anyone what they think; you just have to look at the data. How in the world would you conclude coach 6 is correctly 6th, and that the 7th guy was correctly behind him, but just, and not as far behind him as 8? That's what I meant when I said "how would you rate this stuff?" It's a question that has no answer--but I guess that's part of the fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Posted October 1, 2022 Author Share Posted October 1, 2022 14 minutes ago, Nextmanup said: OK, but how do you quantify "Success" and "innovation?" Win %? Most SB wins? Most winning seasons or something? If you are going to go by hard statistical data, you don't need to ask anyone what they think; you just have to look at the data. How in the world would you conclude coach 6 is correctly 6th, and that the 7th guy was correctly behind him, but just, and not as far behind him as 8? That's what I meant when I said "how would you rate this stuff?" It's a question that has no answer--but I guess that's part of the fun! Reading comprehension is key. In my initial post, I quite clearly said "in no particular order". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 4 hours ago, Virgil said: No Dick Jauron? Mods, please delete this trash thread Or Hank Bullough for that matter. What about Kay Stevenson? The Noive. Put ‘em up, put ‘em up! I fight ya with one paw behind my back… (My daughter and I’d favorite movie of all time, meaning daddy daughter). She’s 19 and still asks me at least once a year to come to my home and watch together. I think she just likes my terrible imitations of the characters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stenbar Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 How can you not have John McKay in there, just due to his quotes Question: What do you think of your offenses execution? Answer: I'm all for it. Lol. We couldnt run the football, we couldnt pass the football, we couldn't block. But we made up for it by not tackling. Epic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 18 hours ago, Chaos said: This is my list of my top 9, in no particular order. Not sure if I want to be put Tony Dungy, Marv Levy or John Madden in the last spot. Vince Lombardi Tom Landry Joe Gibbs Bill Parcells Bill Walsh Bill Belichek Paul Brown Chuck Noll Don Shula I'll go out on a limb and say most people posting on this board weren't old enough to follow or understand football when Paul Brown was at his peak in the 50's or so, myself included. But from things I've read, he probably should be at the top of the list as far as he actual coaching part of the game. For similar reasons I'd elevate Bill Walsh closer to the top. IMO Brown and Walsh are the only two names on the list where people talk other coaches following their systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Posted October 2, 2022 Author Share Posted October 2, 2022 2 hours ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: I'll go out on a limb and say most people posting on this board weren't old enough to follow or understand football when Paul Brown was at his peak in the 50's or so, myself included. But from things I've read, he probably should be at the top of the list as far as he actual coaching part of the game. For similar reasons I'd elevate Bill Walsh closer to the top. IMO Brown and Walsh are the only two names on the list where people talk other coaches following their systems. As I mention in the original post it is in no particular order. The numbers are simply for counting. Based on innovation I think Marc Levy gets most of the credit for the no huddle which is wildly used today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 5 minutes ago, Chaos said: As I mention in the original post it is in no particular order. The numbers are simply for counting. Based on innovation I think Marc Levy gets most of the credit for the no huddle which is wildly used today. OK missed the "no particular order" part! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 20 hours ago, First Round Bust said: on my top list I would include Halas, Lambeau in the top 10 next level off the top of my head - not in order Andy Reid - regular season winning since 1999 - 5th best win % in histiry- coaching tree -1 super bowl win Tom Flores - 2 super bowl wins - 12 season but only 97-87 so at the bottom of the top Mike Shanahan - 2 super bowl wins, coaching tree Jimmy Johnson - 2 super bowls - 80-64 record Mike Tomlin - 1 super bowl win, 13 non-loosing seasons - 133-74 record George Seifert - 2 super bowl wins - 98-30 in SF John Harbaugh - 148-96 (. 607) - 1 loosing season in 13 years - 1 super bowl win Pete Carroll - 152–104–1 (.593) - 1 super bowl win Paul Holmgren - 1 super bowl win, coaching tree, Tom Coughlin - 2 super bowl win over Brady and coach Dungy and Bill Cowher - 1 super bowl - 66 and 62 percent win percent Sean Payton 1 super bowl, 63 win percent, next coach of the Cowboys ? I know who you mean, but this made me laugh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 20 hours ago, Gugny said: There has never been an elite head coach who didn't have an elite QB. The only one close might be Parcells. You take the starting QBs away from the "best ever," coaches and they're very likely JAGs. You don't win 6 super bowls if you're not a great coach. Joe Gibbs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 21 hours ago, Chaos said: Success and Innovation. I don't know my coaches in history well. But innovation I've always appreciated Mike Shanahan's zone blocking and of course his coaching tree today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First Round Bust Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 11 minutes ago, BRH said: I know who you mean, but this made me laugh faux pas - meant his twin...Mike...smh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubba Gump Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 Landry, Shula, Siefert and that other old white haired bastard in SF. Chuck Knoll too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PonyBoy Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 22 hours ago, Chaos said: This is my list of my top 9, in no particular order. Not sure if I want to be put Tony Dungy, Marv Levy or John Madden in the last spot. Vince Lombardi Tom Landry Joe Gibbs Bill Parcells Bill Walsh Bill Belichek Paul Brown Chuck Noll Don Shula Very good thread! How about dojng one for 10 worst coaches too? I think a Bills coach or 2 might make the list 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 Sean McVay, no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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