Miami home field sun advantage and why this is wrong on so many levels

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, UKBillFan said:

 

Maybe I'm overly cynical but, with Bills2022 being a new member, I have to wonder... actually a Bill? 

 

Interesting thought!

 

Wouldnt surprise me it a player or two have made it onto these forums.

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, Einstein said:

 

Interesting thought!

 

Wouldnt surprise me it a player or two have made it onto these forums.

 

Ah, I meant actually a Bill fan? 😁

[Einstein]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

 

Ah, I meant actually a Bill fan? 😁

 

Ahh.

Well either way, I wouldn’t be surprised if we have had a player or two on here.

[What a Tuel]

I bet if you ask the players they'd be pretty vocal about it being bullcrap that they can't have shade on the sideline.

 

The battle takes place on the field where both teams are equal in the elements. 

[Mr. WEO]

39 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

You got almost every point there wrong. Being fair and being safe are the two critical issues. You can’t grasp that.  I think a house call from @DC Tom is in order. Have a nice life. 

 

 

.

they think they are safe.  You say they are wrong.

 

summed for you

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

38 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

The funny thing about the weather on Sunday is that it was perfectly normal for September in SE FL.

 

It was in upper 80s, nearly 90, and like 101 on the heat index.  It's been pretty much that way down here on a daily basis for maybe 3 months now, or more.  
 

And it's exactly what it usually is in September.

 

I still don't understand why the players were so bothered by the heat in this particular game.

 

The conditions had to be nearly identical to what they've played in down here, early in the season, for the last good many years. 

 

 

We couldn’t substitute as much as we normally would’ve because of the injuries.  Losing kumerow early was huge.  Had two less defensive linemen to rotate in as well and on the offensive line dawkins and saffold were gassed but we had nobody left on the bench 

Edited October 1, 2022 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[UKBillFan]

5 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

We couldn’t substitute as much as we normally would’ve because of the injuries.  Losing kumerow early was huge.  Had two less defensive linemen to rotate in as well and on the offensive line dawkins and saffold were gassed but we had nobody left on the bench 

 

Timings as well - don't think our offense has been on the field for 40+ minutes in previous games?

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

they think they are safe.  You say they are wrong.

 

summed for you

 

What they “think” doesn’t matter. Korey Stringer’s family and the shield want to avoid future tragedies.

 

But you disagree.   🤦‍♂️ 

 

Countless high school and college kids have also been lost in recent decades. It doesn’t have to result in death to be absurd to argue against. 

[Saxum]

16 hours ago, Augie said:

 

What they “think” doesn’t matter. Korey Stringer’s family and the shield want to avoid future tragedies.

 

But you disagree.   🤦‍♂️ 

 

Countless high school and college kids have also been lost in recent decades. It doesn’t have to result in death to be absurd to argue against. 

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31850139/korey-stringer-death-20-years-later-lasting-impact-how-nfl-changed

Quote

Twenty summers ago, a healthy NFL star died after practice on a scorching day at the Minnesota Vikings' training camp. The words still sting and baffle in equal measure. Korey Stringer's sudden death at age 27 was not from a heart attack, a broken neck or an undetected genetic malady. The offensive tackle succumbed to complications from exertional heatstroke, an avoidable and easily treated condition that sports medicine largely ignored at the time.

 

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Limeaid said:

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31850139/korey-stringer-death-20-years-later-lasting-impact-how-nfl-changed

 

 

Stringer's death during practice changed rules for the conditions for which players are monitored for heat stroke--a major move which is well known and well documented.  

 

Despite this, 20 yers later, there is no rule making for games in the heat.   None. The conclusions are obvious.  You won't accept this...that doesn't change them.

 

I'm not disagreeing with anything.  I'm stating the facts as they are.  It really doesn't get any simpler than that.  

[1onemangang7]

Baltimore let all that rain in. Cook couldn't catch. The NFL needs to do something 😅

[Beck Water]

On 9/26/2022 at 5:08 AM, oldschoolfootball1963 said:

The NFL or players association needs to step in and do something about this. We could have had several players die or be so heat effected that it could effect those players for several games. This is a safety issue. When the dolphins play in buffalo they have the same heaters and cold weather gear and it’s on equal footing. In Miami one team gets to be in the shade the entire game while the other side bakes in the sun. I’ve never been to Hard Rock stadium. But it appears there is some sort of screen or something that keeps their side shady. This is a very unfair advantage that effects the players heath. It would be like the dolphins having to play in leather helmets Vs the Bill's with todays helmet technology. I’m not pissed that we lost. I’m mad about how the sun effected the Bills players more because one team gets the shade while the other team bakes. This needs to stop to protect player safety.

 

It's the orientation of the field combined with the overhang of the stadium roof, which is symmetrical about the field but due to orientation provides shade to the SW side of the field much earlier than to the NE side of the field, which remains in full sun until late afternoon/evening.

 

The home sideline is on the SW side, shaded in the afternoon,  and the visitor sideline is on the NE side, sunny all afternoon.  The NFL has some sort of regulation prohibiting effective sun shades.  I guess if they are too high, they block spectator view but if they're too low, they present a hazard to players running on and off the field of play.  Anyway, technically the sideline could be tarped to provide shade to the visitors but NFL regs apparently prohibit this.

 

Fundamentally, the job (game) requirement to undergo maximum physical exertion for several hours in conditions where the workers (players) are required to wear protective clothing that retains heat, where there's no shade during rest periods, heat radiating off the field, and temperature/humidity conditions higher than skin temperature is a heat stroke death waiting to happen.

 

I'm frankly surprised that the NFLPA hasn't stepped up with an action limit where, when the temperature/humidity are over certain levels measured by a wet bulb globe thermometer on the sunnier sideline, the game must be postponed until the WBGT falls below levels AND shade must be provided on both sidelines.

Edited October 3, 2022 by Beck Water

[JoeF]

I can't wait until December 18th.  Wonder how many Fin fans will be in attendance?  

 

First play of the game....Christian Wilkins

 

 

[Bob in STL]

When we play Miami in December we will provide heaters on their sideline because we will use them too.   We will not cheat during the game.  

 

We will beat the hell out of them on the field.

 

We should turn the furnace off in their locker room to start the third quarter, let the room get cold.  In addition, turn off the hot water heater to their showers too.   None of this affects the game.  

[Beck Water]

On 9/30/2022 at 8:46 PM, Mr. WEO said:

they think they are safe.  You say they are wrong.

 

summed for you

 

Given objective measurements like WBGT and the whole IH science/OSHA guidance around avoiding heat stress illness and death in the workplace, it's kinda clear it's more than a "they think....you say" issue.

 

Football players are known to be  LETSGO! types who have long training since HS to go play hard in "whatever" conditions. 

 

Objectively, the conditions in Hard Rock Stadium on a sunny day in September are dangerous heat stress conditions for unacclimatized workers wearing thick protective clothing and undergoing maximal physical exertion in the absence of rest periods in shade.

 

Bills game there last season was partly cloudy and light rain.  Similar 2020.

 

[Mr. WEO]

2 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Given objective measurements like WBGT and the whole IH science/OSHA guidance around avoiding heat stress illness and death in the workplace, it's kinda clear it's more than a "they think....you say" issue.

 

Football players are known to be  LETSGO! types who have long training since HS to go play hard in "whatever" conditions. 

 

Objectively, the conditions in Hard Rock Stadium on a sunny day in September are dangerous heat stress conditions for unacclimatized workers wearing thick protective clothing and undergoing maximal physical exertion in the absence of rest periods in shade.

 

Bills game there last season was partly cloudy and light rain.  Similar 2020.

 

 

 

This again?

 

Can you show me anything where the NFL, it players, its owners or its players union have declared 1 pm games in Miami in September dangerously hot?

 

 

[1ManRaid]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

This again?

 

Can you show me anything where the NFL, it players, its owners or its players union have declared 1 pm games in Miami in September dangerously hot?

 

 

 

You know damn well most are afraid to speak up, and the NFL is a reactionary league.  They'll wait for someone to die on the field to immediately make a change, kind of like with Tua.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, 1ManRaid said:

 

You know damn well most are afraid to speak up, and the NFL is a reactionary league.  They'll wait for someone to die on the field to immediately make a change, kind of like with Tua.

 

 

The NFL is too afraid?  The owners?  Is the NFLPA too afraid to speak up too?  Really--this is your position?

 

The players are loudly crying about playing on the most technically advanced artificial turf surfaces---too dangerous!  It's too haaaaaaaard!  The NFLPA took down the Dolphins independent neurologist (you know, with Tua, who's not dead) right quick----but everyone is just too damn "afraid" to say this heat is dangerous?

 

You must be joking right?

[Gilberto]

For some reason I just found this thread and wanted to share my experience. 

 

I grew up in FL; I know heat and humidity. I went to University of Miami for undergrad, I have been at Hardrock many, many times. 

 

I was at the game last week, seated on Visitor side, 30 yard line, in the sun the entire game. 

 

It was absolutely unbearable being in the sun. Heat is one thing, and everyone in the stadium feels heat, but to be in the sun is an entirely different experience. I would estimate the "feel" temperature of being in the sun was probably 20 degrees or more higher compared to the shaded portions of the stadium. There was zero cloud cover the entire game.

 

I know people want to downplay the effects of the stadium design, but the reality is that it Definitely makes a huge difference to have one team in the sun and the other in the shade. Also, this is the tropics... the sun is stronger than in NY or higher latitudes due to the angle of being closer to the equator. Buffalo brought out these dinky little PVC shades, but those only covered a small area of the bench. Players standing on the sidelines received no benefit. In years prior there was cloud cover which provided relief. The NFL absolutely needs to address this issue. If it makes no difference why doesn't Miami have their bench in sun? It's because it does make a difference. 

[Just Jack]

4 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

We should turn the furnace off in their locker room to start the third quarter, let the room get cold.  In addition, turn off the hot water heater to their showers too.   None of this affects the game.  

 

Nah, just add these to the showers in the locker room.

 

Coin operated shower