LA Chargers @ KC Chiefs - TNF Game Thread

[Nextmanup]

31 minutes ago, KDIGGZ said:

This entire game came down to 2 plays:

 

1. Asante Samuel Jr makes that INT and then Jeff Bezos radios down and says to change it so the first Amazon prime game is more interesting.

 

2. Everett is tired and asking to come out but for whatever reason the Chargers run hurry up offense with a 1st and goal inside the 5 and plenty of time on the clock. He lazily runs his route and the throw is picked off and returned for 6.

 

KC didn't win that game, the Chargers lost it. A team that can't even make the playoffs can't win in the big moments. No surprise there

Your second point was absolutely devastating.  LA had some momentum and were driving the field and looking to get a TD, and just like that, no TD but KC gets one instead.

 

Devastating play!  Biggest of the game.

 

 

 

[Solomon Grundy]

2 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

And yet, we went into the half tied 10 - 10 despite that dominance.  Why is that?

 

I understand your point.  The Bills did appear to dominate the game at the LOS.  But when the dust settles, what we have is that despite that apparent dominence, and in part due to all the turnovers, the Bills didn't go up by 2 scores until the 4Q.  That won't cut it with a "Lucky Horseshoe Butt" team like the Chiffs.

3 of the 4 TOs were in the 1st half hence the 10-10 tie. 2nd half, no contest!! 

[Son of a K-Gun]

6 minutes ago, Motor26 said:

 

Chargers have been blowing games dating back to the beginning of the Phillip Rivers days. 

 

I am guessing you are younger than me if you think the Chargers only started blowing games when Phillip Rivers came on board.

 

5 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Did Leslie Frazier learn anything watching the Chargers defense last night? Kelce was 5/51 yds. 

 

To be fair, Frazier always had to worry about Kelce + Hill...if DC's don't have to focus as much on the WR's it makes it easier to key on Kelce and take him away (to the extent you can actually take Kelce away at least).

[SCBills]

Good point made on GMFB.  Chargers didn’t just fade against the Chiefs, they did the same thing last week against the Raiders. 

 

We have our own demon to erase in 13 seconds against KC in the playoffs, but that was a one off… LAC just fades down the stretch as an identity.   They fade at the end of seasons, and through two games this year.. have faded down the stretch of actual games. 
 

Talented team, but they just come across as frauds.  Wear down their elite level starters throughout the course of a game/season and they seem to have no heart or depth. 

[Beck Water]

2 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Haaaaaa, ok. 
 

Not at all comparable.  
 

Bills dominated and turnovers kept Rams in it for a half.  
 

Chiefs struggled and it took a turnover & overturn of a turnover to decide the game.

 

I understand your point that the "feeling" during the game was that the Bills were dominating.

My point is that in reality, the Rams were "in the game" until the 4Q when we (finally) went up by 2 scores.

 

You could say it took a low-probablilty deep completion to Gabe Davis and a rare pick on a deep target of Cooper Kupp  or it could have been a tie game in the 4th.

 

I'm not trying to "diss" the Bills here, my point is that at times, the Bills crapped the bed in the game vs. the Rams, and at times, Mahomes came through Big Time for his team last night.  So I don't think it makes any more sense to dump on Mahomes for that game, than it would to deny that Allen had his struggles and the Bills game vs the Rams ultimately hinged on a few big plays.

 

Mahomes had 68% completions for 235 yds and 2 TDs, including a beautiful 41 yd TD pass to bring the Chiefs back within 3 points.  It's not like he sucked.

 

 

[Son of a K-Gun]

3 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

3 of the 4 TOs were in the 1st half hence the 10-10 tie. 2nd half, no contest!! 

The turnover differential was only -1...if the D hadn't stepped up and take the ball back the score might have looked a bit different.

[Beck Water]

8 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Your second point was absolutely devastating.  LA had some momentum and were driving the field and looking to get a TD, and just like that, no TD but KC gets one instead.

 

Devastating play!  Biggest of the game.

 

No argument there.  I don't know what to make of that play, except that if your team leaves you on the field you damned well better summon up everything you got to not allow your team to be victimized like that.

 

That was just bad all around.  Bad coaching, bad awareness by Herbert, half-assedness by Everett

[SCBills]

11 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I understand your point that the "feeling" during the game was that the Bills were dominating.

My point is that in reality, the Rams were "in the game" until the 4Q when we (finally) went up by 2 scores.

 

You could say it took a low-probablilty deep completion to Gabe Davis and a rare pick on a deep target of Cooper Kupp  or it could have been a tie game in the 4th.

 

I'm not trying to "diss" the Bills here, my point is that at times, the Bills crapped the bed in the game vs. the Rams, and at times, Mahomes came through Big Time for his team last night.  So I don't think it makes any more sense to dump on Mahomes for that game, than it would to deny that Allen had his struggles and the Bills game vs the Rams ultimately hinged on a few big plays.

 

Mahomes had 68% completions for 235 yds and 2 TDs, including a beautiful 41 yd TD pass to bring the Chiefs back within 3 points.  It's not like he sucked.

 

 

Allen had the only questionable pass he threw all game intercepted.   And then he also had a perfectly fine throw picked off when McKenzie spazzed.  
 

If not for the McKenzie mistake, we put that game away early. 
 

Mahomes was fine.  I didn’t think he was great.  He got rattled by the pass rush, just like the Cinci game, until the Chargers got tired and apparently have no depth on the DL.   Every questionable throw he made, he was bailed out on…

 

Threw a deep pick and was bailed out by a bogus PI. 
 

Threw another pick.. bailed out by a penalty.  

Threw a pick in the end zone, dropped. 
 

Threw yet another pick and was bailed out by Samuel putting on a juggling act and then inexplicably being overturned on replay. 
 

He also made plays … yes, if you continue to bail out Mahomes and give him opportunities, he will take advantage. 
 

 

Edited September 16, 2022 by SCBills

[Nextmanup]

1 minute ago, Beck Water said:

 

No argument there.  I don't know what to make of that play, except that if your team leaves you on the field you damned well better summon up everything you got to not allow your team to be victimized like that.

 

That was just bad all around.  Bad coaching, bad awareness by Herbert, half-assedness by Everett

The frustrating part (if you're a Chargers fan) is that the only LA player who had a real shot at the ball carrier after the INT was Herbert himself...and he was well positioned to make the stop.  

 

But then close to the point of contact the runner made a quick move and it left Herbert grasping at air.  Needless to say, tackling is not what he is paid to do, but he could have shut that play down at about the 20 yard line I think, 80 yards short of the TD.  He's a much bigger guy than the DB and he could easily have brought him down, but he whiffed.

And from there, no one was going to catch that guy.

 

To be honest, I thought it was a poorly thrown ball.  He put it on the wrong side of the receiver, to the inside, when he should have thrown to the outside.  The throw also got there late, which is what allowed the DB to jump it.

 

 

13 minutes ago, Son of a K-Gun said:

 

I am guessing you are younger than me if you think the Chargers only started blowing games when Phillip Rivers came on board.

 

 

To be fair, Frazier always had to worry about Kelce + Hill...if DC's don't have to focus as much on the WR's it makes it easier to key on Kelce and take him away (to the extent you can actually take Kelce away at least).

Yeah, even in the Dan Fouts era (who I always really liked and thought was underrated), the Chargers found ways to lose and were never an ultra elite team. 

 

I do remember that playoff game out in SD, though.  What was that? 1980?  We lost that one and it ripped my soul out, probably for the first time.  Age: 9.

 

 

[Zerovoltz]

Good teams win ugly games sometimes.

 

....to put that in perspective....  The Jags beat the Bills last year.  It happens.

 

But perhaps a better way to put it...  When is the last time ANYONE ever said "the Chargers won that game and they had no business winning it"  ...you never hear that about them...it's often the other way around though.   

 

And...I'll reiterate this one more time....  when the interception happened, it was 17-17 in the fourth quarter.  There were about 10 minutes left.  The Chargers had to punt.  The Chiefs got the ball back and punted...the Chargers had the ball back again with just under 6 minutes left, trailing 24-17.  They ended up punting again.

 

The interception return was the key play obviously, but the Chargers had TWO chances to drive and tie, and possibly win the game after that happend.  

 

The Chargers had 400 or so total yards.  KC had 320 or so total yards.  That stat was Even when the Chargers had their final drive...but by then KC was up 10 and KC was letting them have yards in exchange for running clock.  The Chargers were only 5-16 on third down, but 4-4 on 4th Down.... The Chargers only rushed for 75 yards on 25 carries.  That's 3.3 YPC.  

 

I'm not telling you the Chiefs are some juggarnaut, or that they don't get enough credit, but I am telling you the Chargers A) couldn't get it done in the 4th quarter and B) The Chiefs defense was a part of why they couldn't get it done.  C) The Chargers are held back by crappy coaching.  That's a strong roster.

 

[Beck Water]

17 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Allen had the only questionable pick he threw all game intercepted.   And then he also had a perfectly fine throw picked off when McKenzie spazzed.  
 

If not for the McKenzie mistake, we put that game away early. 
 

Mahomes was fine.  I didn’t think he was great.  He got rattled by the pass rush, just like the Cinci game, until the Chargers got tired and apparently have no depth on the DL.   Every questionable throw he made, he was bailed out on…

 

Threw a deep pick and was bailed out by a bogus PI. 
 

Threw another pick.. bailed out by a penalty.  
 

Threw yet another pick and was bailed out by Samuel putting on a juggling act and then inexplicably being overturned on replay. 
 

He also made plays … yes, if you continue to bail out Mahomes and give him opportunities, he will take advantage. 

 

That's fair.  Mahomes wasn't bad.  He wasn't great.  He had some "ooooohs" and "aaaaaahs" plays. 

 

15 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

The frustrating part (if you're a Chargers fan) is that the only LA player who had a real shot at the ball carrier after the INT was Herbert himself...and he was well positioned to make the stop.  

 

But then close to the point of contact the runner made a quick move and it left Herbert grasping at air.  Needless to say, tackling is not what he is paid to do, but he could have shut that play down at about the 20 yard line I think, 80 yards short of the TD.  He's a much bigger guy than the DB and he could easily have brought him down, but he whiffed.

 

TBH, I don't think Herbert's heart was in making that tackle.  vs. Stafford, who was going to make that tackle if it tore his arm off.

 

15 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

To be honest, I thought it was a poorly thrown ball.  He put it on the wrong side of the receiver, to the inside, when he should have thrown to the outside.  The throw also got there late, which is what allowed the DB to jump it.

 

Didn't one of the announcers (or maybe post game) say they thought the play called for the receiver to break to the inside?  I'm not sure it was a poorly thrown ball; the receiver was not where Herbert expected him to be, and I don't think we can say whether that was on Herbert, or on the receiver.

 

The thing that is clear is that the receiver was gassed or maybe dinged from a previous play and wanted to come out.

Edited September 16, 2022 by Beck Water

[Beck Water]

11 minutes ago, Zerovoltz said:

Good teams win ugly games sometimes.

 

....to put that in perspective....  The Jags beat the Bills last year.  It happens.

 

But perhaps a better way to put it...  When is the last time ANYONE ever said "the Chargers won that game and they had no business winning it"  ...you never hear that about them...it's often the other way around though.   

 

And...I'll reiterate this one more time....  when the interception happened, it was 17-17 in the fourth quarter.  There were about 10 minutes left.  The Chargers had to punt.  The Chiefs got the ball back and punted...the Chargers had the ball back again with just under 6 minutes left, trailing 24-17.  They ended up punting again.

 

The interception return was the key play obviously, but the Chargers had TWO chances to drive and tie, and possibly win the game after that happend.  

 

The Chargers had 400 or so total yards.  KC had 320 or so total yards.  That stat was Even when the Chargers had their final drive...but by then KC was up 10 and KC was letting them have yards in exchange for running clock.  The Chargers were only 5-16 on third down, but 4-4 on 4th Down.... The Chargers only rushed for 75 yards on 25 carries.  That's 3.3 YPC.  

 

I'm not telling you the Chiefs are some juggarnaut, or that they don't get enough credit, but I am telling you the Chargers A) couldn't get it done in the 4th quarter and B) The Chiefs defense was a part of why they couldn't get it done.  C) The Chargers are held back by crappy coaching.  That's a strong roster.

 

 

In the first half, I found myself saying "that's a Well Coached team" about the Chargers.  Would you disagree? 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 16, 2022 by Beck Water

[Livinginthepast]

This game was greatly affected by 2 bad calls by the officials. The first call was a PI call on the Chargers defense in the first half on a play where they got an interception. What looked like PI was actually an arm hook initiated by the KC receiver. KC then go on to score a TD and get back in the game. The 2nd was even huger on another INT that the refs overturned on review. Looking at it several times the Chargers defender has the ball in his grasp as part of the ball hits the ground. Its not a trap and definitely an INT. What's even more ridiculous is the call on the field was an INT and there wasnt definitive evidence to overturn yet they did anyway.  Nobody but KC gets calls like that.  In the end though the Chargers literally gift wrapped this game for KC. The Pick 6 was a terrible decision by Hebert and his pathetic attempt to tackle didnt even slow down the KC player. Just embarrassing but how many of you thought, "Ive seen this movie before" with Jeff Tuel of the Bills doing it against KC in almost the identical position in 2013.

Edited September 16, 2022 by Livinginthepast

[Beck Water]

29 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Did Leslie Frazier learn anything watching the Chargers defense last night? Kelce was 5/51 yds. 

 

The Chargers could learn something from watching Leslie Frazier's defense.  The Bills had 3 picks.  And they won.

[aristocrat]

Chargers reminded me of the Bills KC game a couple years back where we blinked when it came time for the 4th down go for it plays. Gotta have the gas on and the balls to put your foot on the throat when you need to. Impose your will on the other team. The Chargers defense held Mahomes to 3 punts and 1 td before that second punt. Gotta have faith in both your offense to convert and your defense to hold them. 

[Zerovoltz]

Just now, Beck Water said:

 

In the first half, I found myself saying "that's a Well Coached team" about the Chargers.  Would you disagree? 

 

 

I do.  That doesn't mean the Chargers aren't capable of excellent football.  they are, and they looked excellent, especially in the first quarter.  

 

I would say, it's not hard to find articles etc out there that document how they are very often less than optimal in their decision making and game planning, play calling etc.  But....just as you observe some of what they do....their coaches too often make the wrong choice or opt for a suboptimal call.  

 

Herbert is now 16-18 as a starter.  I think he's better than that record indicates and I think part of why it isn't better is coaching.  

 

 

[JerseyBills]

1 hour ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Why all this great hype on Mahomes from last night's game? He should've had 3 INTs and lost that game. 

Ya he was not impressive to me. And LA really lost that game instead of KC winning imo.

Messed up on that 95+ yard pick 6 , which was obviously a game changer. 

I was dialed in on TE Everett for fantasy purposes.  

He just had a great 25 yard reception and Was calling to the sideline for a breather. Instead LA goes hurry up, Herbert goes right back to him and you can see Everett had no energy and boom- pick 6

 

 

[BananaB]

11 hours ago, EffKCChiefs said:

#$%/ the Chiefs, luckiest team I've ever seen. 

Wouldn’t call it luck, it’s more like a helping hand by the fellas in stripes

[DrDawkinstein]

I havent dug through this whole thread, but are folks talking about those HUGE hits both Mahomes and Herbert were taking while IN THE POCKET?

 

With all these Bills fans concerned about Josh running, last night was another great example of QBs being most vulnerable while in the pocket, not while running.

 

We beat the crap out of Stafford - in the pocket.

Mahomes took a couple of big hits (one right under his chin, one into his legs) last night - in the pocket.

Herbert got crushed repeatedly, and injured - in the pocket.

 

In the pocket, QBs are sitting ducks and are completely vulnerable.

Out running, Josh does the hitting.

 

Put your concerns to bed. LET THE BEAST LOOSE!

[Zerovoltz]

6 minutes ago, Livinginthepast said:

This game was greatly affected by 2 bad calls by the officials. The first call was a PI call on the Chargers defense in the first half on a play where they got an interception. What looked like PI was actually an arm hook initiated by the KC receiver. KC then go on to score a TD and get back in the game. The 2nd was even huger on another INT that the refs overturned on review. Looking at it several times the Chargers defender has the ball in his grasp as part of the ball hits the ground. Its not a trap and definitely an INT. What's even more ridiculous is the call on the field was an INT and there wasnt definitive evidence to overturn yet they did anyway.  Nobody but KC gets calls like that.  In the end though the Chargers literally gift wrapped this game for KC. The Pick 6 was a terrible decision by Hebert and his pathetic attempt to tackle didnt even slow down the KC player. Just embarrassing but how many of you thought, "Ive seen this movie before" with Jeff Tuel of the Bills doing it against KC in almost the identical position in 2013.

 

I would agree that the INT overturned by replay, was the wrong call.  That was an INT.

 

the PI....that penalty is tough.  Sometimes that one is flagged, sometimes it's not.  Did the reciever initiate it?  Possibly....but the point is...part of the NFL unfortunately, is that you can expect some bad calls.  Sometimes they go your way, and sometimes they don't.  And....sometimes, you just need to be lucky and catch a break to win a game.