Bills sign Jordan Poyer to new deal with increased incentives, continue to work toward extension

[Buddo]

7 minutes ago, Mango said:

A lot of talk about the Bills doing this to “keep him quiet” or “knowing he’s leaving”. 
 

The Bills may or may not re-sign Poyer. But make no bones about this, the Bills are doing this because they want to try and keep him. They are willing to lose $2M this year even if he doesn’t.

 

But it’s certainly not paying $2M just to make Poyer shut up. They’re doing their best to keep him. Full stop. 

 

'Doing their best to keep him' strikes me as being somewhat relative.

 

I'm sure the Bills FO would like to keep him, especially if he's going to return cheap.

 

What the Bills FO sees 'their best' as, may come nowhere near Poyer's expectations, and consequently not be viewed by him as 'their best'.

 

Imho, what this has done is to show some good faith, while at the same time, buying everyone time. (Also rewarding good service)

 

It's a bit like a negotiation where nobody walks away entirely happy with the end result, but all that usually means, is that it was fair on all sides.

[3rdand12]

11 minutes ago, Buddo said:

 

'Doing their best to keep him' strikes me as being somewhat relative.

 

I'm sure the Bills FO would like to keep him, especially if he's going to return cheap.

 

What the Bills FO sees 'their best' as, may come nowhere near Poyer's expectations, and consequently not be viewed by him as 'their best'.

 

Imho, what this has done is to show some good faith, while at the same time, buying everyone time. (Also rewarding good service)

 

It's a bit like a negotiation where nobody walks away entirely happy with the end result, but all that usually means, is that it was fair on all sides.

plainly said. And agreed. small wins all around are OK at times.
Go Bills

[HomeTeam]

6 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

Exactly.   In the simplest of terms, he will look at what he can get in the market and what the Bills will give him.   There will be a delta.  His agent will calculate for him how much money he will have when he retires.   By the end of this season, his total career earnings will be around $34 million.  Lose half in taxes, that's $17 million.   With the investment earnings, he has been able to spend maybe $1 million a year for the last eight years and still have $15 million banked, maybe better than that.  Say he can get a $15 million all-deal from the Bills next season, and $25 million someplace else.   After tax, that's eight or ten versus 12 or 15.    Maybe a net $10 million difference.   Maybe the two offers are twice that, so it's a net $20 million difference.  

 

Point is, that he's looking at retiring with $30 million or perhaps as much as $50 million.  Pretty big difference.   I mean, he can live very, very nicely on $30 million, because even spending $1 million a year, which is pretty hard to do, his net worth is going to grow a lot over his retirement.   But it's one thing for Josh, at his level, to give up $20 million, it's a different thing at Poyer's level.   It'll be his choice, but I think he's gone.  

And where does one get a 6% return these days? Just curious for personal interests xD 

 

If I'm a player that's looking to get paid one last time, I'm going to a state that has no state tax. 

 

Eventually, some players are going to have move on. We can't pay everyone. That's why I was surprised Knox got paid, I though he would of been one of those low priority players. 

[Shaw66]

11 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

And where does one get a 6% return these days? Just curious for personal interests xD 

 

If I'm a player that's looking to get paid one last time, I'm going to a state that has no state tax. 

 

Eventually, some players are going to have move on. We can't pay everyone. That's why I was surprised Knox got paid, I though he would of been one of those low priority players. 

These guys have long-term portfolios - they're sitting on $20 to $100 million or more, so they invest for the long-term, which means you can own mostly stock and only maybe 30% or 40% fixed income.  Getting 6-7% total return (interest, dividends, and appreciation) isn't all that difficult to do.   Portfolio managers do it all the time.   Granted, in some years you don't get that return, but on average (and the average is all that matters when you're that wealthy) you can get it.   If all you have is $1 million, then that's too risky an approach, and then you can't count on getting as high a return.  

 

And, as for where these guys live after they retire, you're absolutely right.   Even if they absolutely love Buffalo, they're living six months plus someplace, because avoiding the income tax on a million bucks every year is certainly a good idea.  

 

Edited September 10, 2022 by Shaw66

[aristocrat]

23 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

And where does one get a 6% return these days? Just curious for personal interests xD 

 

If I'm a player that's looking to get paid one last time, I'm going to a state that has no state tax. 

 

Eventually, some players are going to have move on. We can't pay everyone. That's why I was surprised Knox got paid, I though he would of been one of those low priority players. 

it’s all about your home state in how you are taxed especially with bonuses. He lives in Florida so no state income tax. This happened with jeter when New York tried to claim he was a resident here and he proved he was a Florida resident for tax purposes. 

[HomeTeam]

Just now, aristocrat said:

it’s all about your home state in how you are taxed especially with bonuses. He lives in Florida so no state income tax. This happened with jeter when New York tried to claim he was a resident here and he proved he was a Florida resident for tax purposes. 

Ah, so as long as you live in a state for more than 6 months, that's considered you're home state. It's not the state where that money was earned?

 

I'm from Canada btw. 

[aristocrat]

Just now, HomeTeam said:

Ah, so as long as you live in a state for more than 6 months, that's considered you're home state. It's not the state where that money was earned?

 

I'm from Canada btw. 

Yes, New York is 6 months and a day but other states are different with residency requirements. 

[blacklabel]

Has it been reported on how many years he's looking for on his extension? I know that's probably something they could get hung up on. Poyer is 31, not that he can't still go but you know how it goes in football, you hit 30 and people start looking for the decline. I'd imagine maybe a two year extension? That'd keep him here through 2024. Either way, I hope it all works out.

 

If anything, McDermott knows how to coach defensive backs. Tre and Kaiir are first round guys but Dane Jackson was a 7th rounder and he's done pretty well. Christian Benford went in the 6th and won the starting gig for now. Hyde went in the 5th, Poyer in the 7th. Ol' Josh Norman was a 5th and had his best days in Carolina while McDermott was the DC there. Jaquan Johnson (6th round) looks like he could be a solid replacement. All I've read on the guy is that he has every trait you look for in a safety and has a natural knack for the position and always seems to be around the ball...he's just undersized. Taron Johnson was a 4th round guy and he's only turned into one of the best slot CBs in the game. Levi Wallace was undrafted and just held down the starting spot across from Tre for like four seasons. Siran Neal is a jack of all trades in the secondary and a core special teamer. If they can't retain Poyer, I won't be too bummed because I'm confident they'll find an adequate replacement. 

Edited September 11, 2022 by blacklabel

[HomeTeam]

Just now, aristocrat said:

Yes, New York is 6 months and a day but other states are different with residency requirements. 

So there is no incentive what team these players sign on to, as long as they live in a state with no state tax 6 months of the year. 

 

You'd think the tax would be taxed in the state it's earned. 

 

[aristocrat]

4 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

Ah, so as long as you live in a state for more than 6 months, that's considered you're home state. It's not the state where that money was earned?

 

I'm from Canada btw. 

https://www.abajournal.com/news/article/new_york_sues_yankees_jeter_over_residency_claim

 

this is what I’m speaking of. New York lost the case. 

[HomeTeam]

21 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

These guys have long-term portfolios - they're sitting on $20 to $100 million or more, so they invest for the long-term, which means you can own mostly stock and only maybe 30% or 40% fixed income.  Getting 6-7% total return (interest, dividends, and appreciation) isn't all that difficult to do.   Portfolio managers do it all the time.   Granted, in some years you don't get that return, but on average (and the average is all that matters when you're that wealthy) you can get it.   If all you have is $1 million, then that's too risky an approach, and then you can't count on getting as high a return.  

 

And, as for where these guys live after they retire, you're absolutely right.   Even if they absolutely love Buffalo, they're living six months plus someplace, because avoiding the income tax on a million bucks every year is certainly a good idea.  

 

If we end up signing Knox and Edmunds and lose Oliver and Davis, I think that would be a mistake. 

 

I hope Beane would be smarter than that. I guess we have this year before we have to make that decision. 

[aristocrat]

4 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

If we end up signing Knox and Edmunds and lose Oliver and Davis, I think that would be a mistake. 

 

I hope Beane would be smarter than that. I guess we have this year before we have to make that decision. 

i think Davis goes for a 1 this next draft and is replaced that way. Ed we can let go and maybe get a third back in comp picks. 

[HomeTeam]

9 minutes ago, aristocrat said:

https://www.abajournal.com/news/article/new_york_sues_yankees_jeter_over_residency_claim

 

this is what I’m speaking of. New York lost the case. 

Thanks for this interesting read. 

 

I'll look into the details of the ruling on my own time. I don't want to derail the thread with all my questions. 

[Scott7975]

25 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

So there is no incentive what team these players sign on to, as long as they live in a state with no state tax 6 months of the year. 

 

You'd think the tax would be taxed in the state it's earned. 

 

 

NFL players have to pay tax in every state they play in for that week.

 

https://smartasset.com/taxes/nfl-jock-taxes

[Dopey]

7 hours ago, Watkins90 said:

This place will absolutely meltdown if Edmunds gets a massive contract extension. 

I would absolutely love signing Edmunds to an extension!

[Shaw66]

41 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

If we end up signing Knox and Edmunds and lose Oliver and Davis, I think that would be a mistake. 

 

I hope Beane would be smarter than that. I guess we have this year before we have to make that decision. 

Well, I'm pretty sure that Beane is smarter than both you and me.   I just watch what he does and listen to what he and McDermott say, and then try to deduce what the rules are that they operate by.  

 

Gunner says Beane has said things that make Oliver more or less a lock.  As for Davis, I think he is an excellent #2, and if that is what he is, he may be expendable.  But maybe he's going to become Mike Evans, and if that's who he is, then they have to keep him.  

[Putin]

8 hours ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

All-Pro Po getting a nice bump and Beane doing his best to reward the guys responsible for the turn around.

This right here ^^^ simple as that !!! 

[Shaw66]

51 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

So there is no incentive what team these players sign on to, as long as they live in a state with no state tax 6 months of the year. 

 

You'd think the tax would be taxed in the state it's earned. 

 

I'm pretty sure It IS taxed in the state where it's earned.   It's treated as earned in 17 paychecks, 8 or 9 at home and 8 or 9 at home.  As I understand it, Bills players pay NYS income on half their income.  I know this because I was a practicing lawyer and I was a partner in a firm that did work in several states.  Every year I had to pay state income tax in each of those states, depending on the proportion of income our firm had in each state and without regard to the fact that I lived in only one of those states.   Thus, I'm pretty sure that each of the Bills will pay California income tax on 1/17th of their income for the privilege of having trounced the Rams the other night.  

 

I don't think their residence matters when they're playing.   It matters when they're retired.  

[Captain_Quint]

This is awesome news. Maybe it will satisfy the wife enough to let the contract negotiations go until next year. 

 

I feel like this is Beane recognizing that she needs more money in the short term in order to keep Jordan happy. 

 

Jordan will get a new contract, but it may take another year to time it correctly. 

[Dopey]

1 hour ago, HomeTeam said:

If we end up signing Knox and Edmunds and lose Oliver and Davis, I think that would be a mistake. 

 

I hope Beane would be smarter than that. I guess we have this year before we have to make that decision. 

Oliver is in his 4th yr and we have a 5th yr option as a 1st round pick. Gabe  is in yr 3 of his rookie contract. Beane has time and will make it work.