Most talented player in Bills franchise history?

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

8 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Kelly was incredibly tough. Is he tougher than Allen? Kelly had a big arm. Allen might have the biggest arm ever. There is literally nothing that Kelly could do that Allen can’t.

 

There are lots of things that Allen can do that Kelly couldn’t.

 

Talent-wise it isn’t a conversation. I wouldn’t have Kelly in the top 10 most talented Bills ever. He might not be in the top 20. 

Again, talent and accomplishment aren’t interchangeable. 

I know.  I was trying to be funny 😁 

 

IMO

JA is >>> JK 

[tomur67]

In my humble opinion, I believe if polled, OJ in his prime, would have been considered the best RB in the whole NFL.  Although great, Bruce, Thurman, and a few others mentioned would probably not have that ranking in the entire league.  Today, Josh has established himself as the most talented QB  in the whole  NFL. So, on that basis, I'd say Josh and OJ would have to be the most talented Bills.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

23 hours ago, Dopey said:

He is a talented dude. 

No reflection on his playing abilities or team character, but he certainly can rile the readers here. 😁

Edited September 5, 2022 by Ridgewaycynic2013
😁

[The Frankish Reich]

44 minutes ago, frostbitmic said:

After his football career he successfully took a stab at other things too, like acting.

 

Well played.

[JoeF]

On D-Sam Cowart would be somewhere on my list of top 10 athletes.  He was tremendous before the ankle and the achilles.  Agree with the Kyle Williams mention as well.

 

On O- Doug Flutie may be in a top 10.  Size was a limiting factor but speed, elusiveness, accuracy and arm talent all were good.  The guy just needed a chance.

[The Frankish Reich]

5 hours ago, Locomark said:

I watched OJ as a kid. He was a great athlete and dominated for 2-3 years. He rarely caught the ball, never blocked like Thurman and had a much superior line and FB. He also played in an era where LBs,DEs, and Safetys were more bulky than fast. He rarely ran anyone over. In a later era I don’t know how he would have fared. Unlike Bruce he was not in the best 5 at his position all-time. So that is why he isn’t in the conversation with Bruce. He may not be top 7/8 even though he was given the ball on every play, something most athletes dream of.  He doesn’t come close to guys like Sanders or Smith. I listed the other random just showing guys that are natural superior athletes since that was the question. 

Not sure we were watching the same OJ as kids. The OJ I saw would be great in any era. His 2,000 yard season (14 games): 6.0 yards per carry. The Bills had a very good O line, but it wasn't Dolphins perfect season good. And we had Joe Ferguson at QB, who was ... barely adequate.

How the game has changed: Fergy started all 14 games and threw for a grand total of 939 yards. Less than half what OJ ran for. He was a world class sprinter and could break one at any time - the acceleration when he saw daylight is still the best I've ever seen. Top 5 all-time? No doubter.

 

[LabattBlue]

OJ in his prime was unstoppable.  Unfortunate that his career was shortened by injury, and even more unfortunate that he became a murderer. 

[The Frankish Reich]

Kind of a strangely phrased question: "most talented player." Best athlete? Well, I suppose that would be a combination of football-relevant skills: strength, speed, agility, arm strength/accuracy, etc. Kind of what we call a "5 tool player" in baseball (hit for average, hit for power, run, field, throw). So that means QB only, or a guy (Marlin Briscoe) who could play QB and other positions too.

So that would be: Josh Allen. All by himself. Followed (about a mile lower?) by ... Briscoe? (too small) JP Losman? (too JP Losman) Kemp? Kelly? I don't even know.

You see what I mean.

EDIT: I just remembered Logan Thomas. So there's your #2. James Harris was rumored to have some running ability (he was never allowed to use it) so maybe he's third.

Edited September 5, 2022 by The Frankish Reich

[Marvin]

I don't feel qualified to answer because I did not see Butch Byrd, Marlin Briscoe, and Cookie Gilchrist.  The OP named some of the players I would have picked.

[Kirby Jackson]

1 minute ago, Marvin said:

I don't feel qualified to answer because I did not see Butch Byrd, Marlin Briscoe, and Cookie Gilchrist.  The OP named some of the players I would have picked.

I played golf with Butch Byrd in the Bills alumni golf tournament in July (humble brag). He’s a SUPER nice guy. His perspective on certain people was interesting (but not surprising). He left us with his number to connect before the game in LA this week. He will be out there with family. 

[Beast]

On 9/4/2022 at 4:28 AM, Locomark said:

Right now no one touches Bruce Smith because he was the best to ever do what he did. No other Bills player can say that. Josh can prove me wrong in another decade.  
 

you can say people like OJ, Thurman, Eric Moulds, Antoine Winfield, Micah Hyde, Jerry Butler, Cornelius Bennett, or even Doug Flutie had huge natural talents but to me that talent still needs to produce amazing jaw dropping results to be ranked the best.  
 

 

 

LOL...if you think OJ didn't produce "amazing jaw dropping results" you must be "blinder than a bat".

Edited September 5, 2022 by Beast

[Boatdrinks]

7 hours ago, Locomark said:

I watched OJ as a kid. He was a great athlete and dominated for 2-3 years. He rarely caught the ball, never blocked like Thurman and had a much superior line and FB. He also played in an era where LBs,DEs, and Safetys were more bulky than fast. He rarely ran anyone over. In a later era I don’t know how he would have fared. Unlike Bruce he was not in the best 5 at his position all-time. So that is why he isn’t in the conversation with Bruce. He may not be top 7/8 even though he was given the ball on every play, something most athletes dream of.  He doesn’t come close to guys like Sanders or Smith. I listed the other random just showing guys that are natural superior athletes since that was the question. 

OJ not close to Emmitt Smith in talent?  Oh wow, that’s crazy.

[mannc]

1 hour ago, tomur67 said:

In my humble opinion, I believe if polled, OJ in his prime, would have been considered the best RB in the whole NFL.  Although great, Bruce, Thurman, and a few others mentioned would probably not have that ranking in the entire league.  Today, Josh has established himself as the most talented QB  in the whole  NFL. So, on that basis, I'd say Josh and OJ would have to be the most talented Bills.

OJ in his prime was unquestionably the best player in the NFL, not just the best RB, something you could not say about any other Bill in franchise history, although I expect Josh Allen will change that shortly.

Edited September 5, 2022 by mannc

[LabattBlue]

On 9/4/2022 at 4:28 AM, Locomark said:

…you can say people like OJ, Thurman, Eric Moulds, Antoine Winfield, Micah Hyde, Jerry Butler, Cornelius Bennett, or even Doug Flutie had huge natural talents but to me that talent still needs to produce amazing jaw dropping results to be ranked the best.  
 

 

It is hilarious that you have OJ in the same sentence as these guys.  Except for Thurman are any of them on the Bills WoF let alone the pro football HoF?

[Dopey]

1 hour ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Kind of a strangely phrased question: "most talented player." Best athlete? Well, I suppose that would be a combination of football-relevant skills: strength, speed, agility, arm strength/accuracy, etc. Kind of what we call a "5 tool player" in baseball (hit for average, hit for power, run, field, throw). So in my opinion that means QB only, or a guy (Marlin Briscoe) who could play QB and other positions too.

So that would be: Josh Allen. All by himself. Followed (about a mile lower?) by ... Briscoe? (too small) JP Losman? (too JP Losman) Kemp? Kelly? I don't even know.

You see what I mean.

EDIT: I just remembered Logan Thomas. So there's your #2. James Harris was rumored to have some running ability (he was never allowed to use it) so maybe he's third.

Hope you don’t mind me adding the bold text I added 

[Canadian Bills Fan]

Not saying he is even in the top 10, but I always thought Brian Moorman was extremely athletic 

[Sierra Foothills]

8 hours ago, Locomark said:

I watched OJ as a kid. He was a great athlete and dominated for 2-3 years. He rarely caught the ball, never blocked like Thurman and had a much superior line and FB. He also played in an era where LBs,DEs, and Safetys were more bulky than fast. He rarely ran anyone over. In a later era I don’t know how he would have fared. Unlike Bruce he was not in the best 5 at his position all-time. So that is why he isn’t in the conversation with Bruce. He may not be top 7/8 even though he was given the ball on every play, something most athletes dream of.  He doesn’t come close to guys like Sanders or Smith. I listed the other random just showing guys that are natural superior athletes since that was the question. 

 

As a kid? Like 2 years old?

 

Sorry to be rude but based on your post I find it hard to believe you ever saw OJ play. 

[The Frankish Reich]

28 minutes ago, Dopey said:

Hope you don’t mind me adding the bold text I added 

Not at all. That just shows it was a poorly thought-out question.

Maybe we want to ask, "The most talented skill set FOR HIS POSITION in Bills history."

Otherwise I'm going with the Punt God.

[The Frankish Reich]

1 minute ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

As a kid? Like 2 years old?

 

Sorry to be rude but based on your post I find it hard to believe you ever saw OJ play. 

First NFL game I ever saw in person was at the old Rockpile, back in about '71. About 9 years old. Yes, that wasAnd I have really vivid memories of OJ in his glory years.

I never saw Jim Brown or Gale Sayers (at least not in my football fan memories), but based on clips I'd say they may be #1 and #1A and #1B as far as the ability to accelerate and break any run for a TD. Barry Sanders could break any run too, but it was really a different running style. Eric Dickerson is usually forgotten in these conversations, but he had that turbo boost thing too.

[Sierra Foothills]

13 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

First NFL game I ever saw in person was at the old Rockpile, back in about '71. About 9 years old. Yes, that wasAnd I have really vivid memories of OJ in his glory years.

I never saw Jim Brown or Gale Sayers (at least not in my football fan memories), but based on clips I'd say they may be #1 and #1A and #1B as far as the ability to accelerate and break any run for a TD. Barry Sanders could break any run too, but it was really a different running style. Eric Dickerson is usually forgotten in these conversations, but he had that turbo boost thing too.

 

Yeah, Barry Sanders was definitely gifted in a small, sports car sort of way.

 

Like you said, OJ had the turbo boost, like the Millenium Falcon going into hyperspace.