CFB Playoff Expansion to 12 teams approved

[Bill from NYC]

1 hour ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

But it's not just about last year. Look at the Final AP top 25 going back years. 

 

We usually have the same 3-4 teams in the top 4, but there are times (more often than not) a team was a "almost in" or "we will never know" outside looking in. 

 

2018 Ohio State

2017 UCF

2017 Wisconsin 

2015 Ohio State

2015 Houston

2014 TCU

2013 Michigan State

2012 Oregon

2011 Oklahoma State

 

I just don't see how more football is in issue. We can reduce meaningless non-conference games for power 5 programs v FBS teams all together. Reduce it to 2 non-conference games for each program. Max. You're only then adding another game to a team who wins the NCAA Championship... and again, we can crown a TRUE NCAA championship, not just a mythical one. I agree completely about schedule and conference reform. We can do all three. 

Mythical? Maybe you should come up for air.

 

Do you think that the 2021 chanpionship (OSU vs Bama)was "mythical?" Please. And as fas os OK State beating Bama in the year they beat LSU, no possible way. LSU barely made it across midfield. I wonder if OK State would have made it past their own 30.

[ArdmoreRyno]

22 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Mythical? Maybe you should come up for air.

 

Do you think that the 2021 chanpionship (OSU vs Bama)was "mythical?" Please. And as fas os OK State beating Bama in the year they beat LSU, no possible way. LSU barely made it across midfield. I wonder if OK State would have made it past their own 30.

 

Since there is no NCAA trophy awarded, no real playoff... it's been called "Mythical" for decades. You new to college football? 

As for the 2011 team, we will never know. That's why we needed an expansion of the BCS or a Playoff. That's one of the MAIN reasons why we have it now... the 2011 season and OSU getting screwed over. You clearly didn't watch much of the 2011 OSU season if you think we wouldn't be able to move the ball. Near 50 points per game and the last half of the season, was closer to 60 ppg. 

 

Alabama didn't win their conference, Alabama didn't even win their own division. Alabama had a crap resume compared to Oklahoma State that year.  We've talked about this before. 

 

TEAM A

• Beat #10, #11, #17, #22 and #25 during the regular season 
• Beat 7 total bowl bound teams with winning records
• Jeff Sagarin's Conference Power Rank: #1
• SOS: 6th
• Won Conference Championship
• LONE LOSS: On the road in doubt OT

TEAM B

• Beat #8 and #21 teams during the regular season
• Beat 3 total bowl bound teams with winning records
• Sagarin's Conference Power Rank: #2
• SOS: 29th
• Did not play in conference championship
• LONE LOSS: At home in OT

 

Take team names out... only a Alabama homer would say "TEAM B! TEAM B!" 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 13, 2022 by ArdmoreRyno

[Buffalo716]

5 hours ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

That's your opinion. 

 

Who had the best defense(s) in the NCAA last year? Georgia and Oklahoma State. OSU managed to shut out practically EVERY TEAM they played last year in the 2nd half. Historically, OSU would have to (and usually are able to) score 40-50 points per game. Last year? No. You saw it first hand as a Notre Dame fan. What did the Pokes do to the Irish in the 2nd half of the Fiesta Bowl? 

 

Now, would OSU had beat UGA last year? I don't know. Probably not... but it would damn sure be nice to have a chance. 

 

And in 2011, Oklahoma State would have beat both LSU and Alabama. Neither of those teams would have stopped the OSU offense. No team could. There is *nothing* anyone can say to make be feel otherwise. Better resume that entire season than Alabama. 

 

So you don't think Baylor or Oklahoma State would have had a chance vs UGA or Alabama last year? 

That’s also your opinion

 

You haven’t seen Oklahoma State in a final four playoffs with all the chips on the line

 

I do believe Georgia and Alabama would be scoring a lot of points and Oklahoma State would have to score a lot … especially last year 

 

If Notre Dame scored 30 , Georgia is scoring a lot more

 

Yeah Oklahoma State has a good second half defense but that’s not the college football championship on the line … I don’t believe they would hold the best SEC team to under 28 … it would be a shootout in the 30s or 

 

 

 

 

[ArdmoreRyno]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

That’s also your opinion

 

You haven’t seen Oklahoma State in a final four playoffs with all the chips on the line

 

I do believe Georgia and Alabama would be scoring a lot of points and Oklahoma State would have to score a lot … especially last year 

 

If Notre Dame scored 30 , Georgia is scoring a lot more

 

Yeah Oklahoma State has a good second half defense but that’s not the college football championship on the line … I don’t believe they would hold the best SEC team to under 28 … it would be a shootout in the 30s or 

 

 

 

 

 

OSU and UGA having the top 2 defenses last season... that's not an opinion. That's a fact. In many of those "2nd half shutouts", teams struggled to score anything in the 1st half. In fact, OSU didn't allow a TD in 3 of the final 6 games of the year. At all. 

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

OSU and UGA having the top 2 defenses last season... that's not an opinion. That's a fact. In many of those "2nd half shutouts", teams struggled to score anything in the 1st half. In fact, OSU didn't allow a TD in 3 of the final 6 games of the year. At all. 

But it’s also a fact Notre Dame scored 35

 

If Notre Dame scored 30+ Georgia is scoring more… coan threw for like 5tds and he’s not that great 

 

I’m not talking ***** about Oklahoma State… I’m just saying they would have a hard time against Georgia

Edited September 13, 2022 by Buffalo716

[ArdmoreRyno]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

But it’s also a fact Notre Dame scored 30

 

If Notre Dame scored 30 Georgia is scoring more… coan threw for like 5tds and he’s not that great 

 

I’m not talking ***** about Oklahoma State… I’m just saying they would have a hard time against Georgia

 

Yes, ND scored 28 points in the first half. They were practically shut down in the 2nd. And they wouldn't have beat UGA last year. I'm not saying that, but they would have been able to hang with them. Both teams would have put on a defensive show.

Edited September 13, 2022 by ArdmoreRyno

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

Yes, ND scored 28 points in the first half. They were practically shut down in the 2nd. 

Yes they were

[GunnerBill]

18 hours ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

But it's not just about last year. Look at the Final AP top 25 going back years. 

 

We usually have the same 3-4 teams in the top 4, but there are times (more often than not) a team was a "almost in" or "we will never know" outside looking in. 

 

2018 Ohio State

2017 UCF

2017 Wisconsin 

2015 Ohio State

2015 Houston

2014 TCU

2013 Michigan State

2012 Oregon

2011 Oklahoma State

 

I just don't see how more football is in issue. We can reduce meaningless non-conference games for power 5 programs v FBS teams all together. Reduce it to 2 non-conference games for each program. Max. You're only then adding another game to a team who wins the NCAA Championship... and again, we can crown a TRUE NCAA championship, not just a mythical one. I agree completely about schedule and conference reform. We can do all three. 

 

But your argument that there is often a worthy team who just misses out is a good argument for going 4 to 6 and running it like the old NFL conference playoff style. I have already said I agree that would have been a reasonable and sensible step. That isn't my problem with the playoff proposal we have. It is that the teams 12 through 7 have no shot and you are just lining them up to get eaten alive. That is more noncompetitive football not less. 

[Cynical]

On 9/13/2022 at 11:54 AM, ArdmoreRyno said:

TEAM A

• Beat #10, #11, #17, #22 and #25 during the regular season 
• Beat 7 total bowl bound teams with winning records
• Jeff Sagarin's Conference Power Rank: #1
• SOS: 6th
• Won Conference Championship
• LONE LOSS: On the road in doubt OT

TEAM B

• Beat #8 and #21 teams during the regular season
• Beat 3 total bowl bound teams with winning records
• Sagarin's Conference Power Rank: #2
• SOS: 29th
• Did not play in conference championship
• LONE LOSS: At home in OT

 

Here, let me help you with this;

 

TEAM A

LONE LOSS: On the road in doubt OT - to an unranked opponent.

 

TEAM B

LONE LOSS: At home in OT - To the #1 ranked team in the country.

 

 

[Cynical]

On 9/13/2022 at 9:05 AM, ArdmoreRyno said:

And in 2011, Oklahoma State would have beat both LSU and Alabama. Neither of those teams would have stopped the OSU offense. No team could. There is *nothing* anyone can say to make be feel otherwise.

 

 

In 2011, LSU averaged approx 40 points a game during the regular season.

In 2011, LSU failed to score even 10 points in only 2 games.

Guess which 2.

 

16 players on the Bama-LSU defenses got drafted.

There was some serious talent on those 2 teams, especially on the defensive side of the ball.

 

Would either team "stopped" OSU?

Maybe not.

Shut outs can be difficult to achieve.

 

But I can confidently say, either team would have done a much better job than Iowa St did at slowing down the OSU offense.

And I seriously doubt OSU would have been prepared for any offense LSU or Bama would have brought to the game.

 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

11 hours ago, Cynical said:

 

In 2011, LSU averaged approx 40 points a game during the regular season.

In 2011, LSU failed to score even 10 points in only 2 games.

Guess which 2.

 

16 players on the Bama-LSU defenses got drafted.

There was some serious talent on those 2 teams, especially on the defensive side of the ball.

 

Would either team "stopped" OSU?

Maybe not.

Shut outs can be difficult to achieve.

 

But I can confidently say, either team would have done a much better job than Iowa St did at slowing down the OSU offense.

And I seriously doubt OSU would have been prepared for any offense LSU or Bama would have brought to the game.

 

And why are we talking about 2011 in the first place? 2011 was before the playoffs. In the playoff era OSU would have had their shot at LSU in the semi final and Alabama in the final if they got there. 

 

The conversation here is about whether an expansion to 12 is a good idea. So unless the argument is Brady Hoke's 12th ranked Michigan team was denied its rightful shot at 'Bama in the Natty then 2011 is entirely irrelevant. 

 

EDIT: and I make clear because obviously @Cynical and @BillfromNYC are big Bama guys that I am the opposite of that. I do not support a college team I am a neutral college football fan. I would absolutely LOVE more unpredictability, love more competitiveness. As great as they have been at times within it the Saban dynasty has been boring as hell for CFP more generally. I absolutely want to improve the status quo. I just genuinely believe a 12 team playoff is not the way to go about it. 

Edited September 15, 2022 by GunnerBill

[ArdmoreRyno]

14 hours ago, Cynical said:

 

In 2011, LSU averaged approx 40 points a game during the regular season.

In 2011, LSU failed to score even 10 points in only 2 games.

Guess which 2.

 

16 players on the Bama-LSU defenses got drafted.

There was some serious talent on those 2 teams, especially on the defensive side of the ball.

 

Would either team "stopped" OSU?

Maybe not.

Shut outs can be difficult to achieve.

 

But I can confidently say, either team would have done a much better job than Iowa St did at slowing down the OSU offense.

And I seriously doubt OSU would have been prepared for any offense LSU or Bama would have brought to the game.

 

 

 

 

Maybe... if our team had another tragedy take place the same day of the game like we did before the Iowa State game. OSU lost 2 coaches (head coach and assistant basketball coach) in a plane crash the DAY OF THE FOOTBALL GAME. 

 

I know Justin Blackman's family pretty well. His sister graduated with my oldest daughter at Plainview (OK). I know Warren (his dad) and mother, who teaches at Ardmore public schools (I'm a school counselor at the HS). That seriously hit the team, hard. They were VERY close to the basketball team and the coaches. 

 

 So sure, it's possible. 

 

But that year, the OSU snub, was a main reason we have the 4 team playoff today... and it's why I'm 100% fore an even more expanded playoff system. LSU averaged 37 ppg that year, had a sub-20 points against Miss State as well... but they were two TOTALLY different offenses. OSU wasn't a run first offense like LSU. We threw it. A lot. We had the two time Biletnikoff Award winner (IMO, the best WR to play in 25 years in college) and our offenses put up scores of 70, 66, 61, 59 and 52 that year. The biggest issue (besides we will never know) is there was a chance to see a team who was a "in the trench" team (LSU) vs the Big XII "Air raid" team and they put another boring game... a rematch... in the final. 

 

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

And why are we talking about 2011 in the first place? 2011 was before the playoffs. In the playoff era OSU would have had their shot at LSU in the semi final and Alabama in the final if they got there. 

 

The conversation here is about whether an expansion to 12 is a good idea. So unless the argument is Brady Hoke's 12th ranked Michigan team was denied its rightful shot at 'Bama in the Natty then 2011 is entirely irrelevant. 

 

EDIT: and I make clear because obviously @Cynical and @BillfromNYC are big Bama guys that I am the opposite of that. I do not support a college team I am a neutral college football fan. I would absolutely LOVE more unpredictability, love more competitiveness. As great as they have been at times within it the Saban dynasty has been boring as hell for CFP more generally. I absolutely want to improve the status quo. I just genuinely believe a 12 team playoff is not the way to go about it. 

 

No, OSU would have played Alabama in the semi-finals. We were barely 3rd place... 0.086 behind Alabama.

Edited September 15, 2022 by ArdmoreRyno

[GunnerBill]

11 minutes ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

No, OSU would have played Alabama in the semi-finals. We were barely 3rd place... 0.086 behind Alabama.

 

Apologies, wrong way around. Point stands. 

[Back2Buff]

Look at how fun these Alabama games have been vs LSU and Tenn.  Just think how meaningless they would be with 12 teams in playoffs.  Alabama would still get in.

 

Say no to expansion of playoffs!!!!  There isn't a league out there that has extremely meaningful game for 8 straight weeks.

[FireChans]

On 11/7/2022 at 12:41 PM, Back2Buff said:

Look at how fun these Alabama games have been vs LSU and Tenn.  Just think how meaningless they would be with 12 teams in playoffs.  Alabama would still get in.

 

Say no to expansion of playoffs!!!!  There isn't a league out there that has extremely meaningful game for 8 straight weeks.

This is the opposite takeaway. LSU would still have a chance of getting in, and they may deserve it for knocking off the top ranked team, despite their bad FSU loss week 1.

 

This year has made it extremely clear that OSU, Alabama, Clemson are not gonna just kill everyone else like they normally do. Georgia has been the only team that’s looked like that.

 

The parity in CFB is the most it’s been in like 10 years. I want TCU vs UT. I want Michigan vs USC. 

[Back2Buff]

45 minutes ago, FireChans said:

This is the opposite takeaway. LSU would still have a chance of getting in, and they may deserve it for knocking off the top ranked team, despite their bad FSU loss week 1.

 

This year has made it extremely clear that OSU, Alabama, Clemson are not gonna just kill everyone else like they normally do. Georgia has been the only team that’s looked like that.

 

The parity in CFB is the most it’s been in like 10 years. I want TCU vs UT. I want Michigan vs USC. 

 

LSU in a playoff doesn't drive the needle as an Alabama loss.  LSU getting in as an 8 will be a meaningless playoff game.

[FireChans]

46 minutes ago, Back2Buff said:

 

LSU in a playoff doesn't drive the needle as an Alabama loss.  LSU getting in as an 8 will be a meaningless playoff game.

For who?  Not for LSU fans. Or USC fans (who they would play if the season ended today and top 2 seeds got a bye).  That would be a great game lol

 

The bottom line is bowl season is dying.  Players opt out. No one care about winning the Tostito Bowl anymore without a shot at the Natty.

 

You are infinitely better covnerting the top 8 bowls into the remaining playoff games.  You will get less kids opting out. They will be playing for something.

[Back2Buff]

43 minutes ago, FireChans said:

For who?  Not for LSU fans. Or USC fans (who they would play if the season ended today and top 2 seeds got a bye).  That would be a great game lol

 

The bottom line is bowl season is dying.  Players opt out. No one care about winning the Tostito Bowl anymore without a shot at the Natty.

 

You are infinitely better covnerting the top 8 bowls into the remaining playoff games.  You will get less kids opting out. They will be playing for something.

 

For the entire country.  One specific fan base <<<<<<<<<<< Entire College Football fanbase.

 

Kids will still opt out and the games will still be trash.  Every year there are only 4 teams that have a legit chance.  Everyone else is just fluff.  

[FireChans]

2 hours ago, Back2Buff said:

 

For the entire country.  One specific fan base <<<<<<<<<<< Entire College Football fanbase.

 

Kids will still opt out and the games will still be trash.  Every year there are only 4 teams that have a legit chance.  Everyone else is just fluff.  

What are the only 4 teams that have a chance this year? 

[Back2Buff]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

What are the only 4 teams that have a chance this year? 

 

Georgia, Ohio State, Michigan, Tenn