Bills show what a class organization they are

[Mango]

26 minutes ago, Bills2022 said:

 

B+.  Bills should have done their homework. This was handled well, but nobody should be congratulating anyone.  It is like congratulating the Bills after losing to the Chiefs last year in the playoffs.  The team and the front office need to move from playoff caliber to championship caliber. Enough with the stupid errors due to being unprepared. This is right up there with not squibbing the kick at the end of the playoff game.  Unforced errors are killers. 

C. Im grading on a bell curve. I don’t think they did anything extraordinary here. They let it play out. It became a PR nightmare. They let him go. Outside of Cleveland and maybe Andy Reid, most other teams do the same thing.

 

Thats part of my frustration. These guys spent forever talking about community, culture, family, and that this was different. But it’s not. They behaved just like every other NFL team. The Buffalo Bills are just another NFL franchise. 

 

 

Edited August 28, 2022 by Mango

[Alphadawg7]

32 minutes ago, Starr Almighty said:

Just a reminder. This is a football team not a Police Department. The actual Police and DA haven't come to a conclusion to what really happened 10 months later. But somehow you want a room full of football guys to have all the answers. They knew he was accused of something and tried to figure out if it was true or not with their limited resources to do so. Because again this is a football team. 

 

Surprisingly, I feel like a lot of people here are very much missing this very fact and just have unrealistic and unreasonable expectations of the reach and investigative prowess of a sports organization.  

 

Very well said, and I think this is a post worth pinning to be honest.  

[Inigo Montoya]

I don't see what the Bills should have done differently.

 

They heard of an allegation.  It might be true, it might be completely fabricated.  They have no way to know.  They start to look into the matter because Araiza totally denies the accusations.  He is entitled to some due process by the Bills.

 

The civil case is filed and now it becomes a media issue and it becomes a huge dark cloud and distraction hanging over the team.  Beane and McDermott make the judgement that it is better for the team to release Araiza instead of dragging this anchor around for the entire season.

 

This is a Super Bowl caliber roster and having this distraction could put the season in jeopardy.  They cut Araiza for the good of the team.  

 

At this point no one knows if these allegations are true or not.  If a lawyer calls your place of work and alleges a heinous crime against you that you adamantly deny, what would you want your company to do?  I think Beane gave it as much time as he could to look into the matter and try to figure out the truth but ultimately the clock ran out when the civil suit was filed.  

 

I think they played it straight and have nothing to apologize for.

[Alphadawg7]

19 minutes ago, Mango said:

C. Im grading on a bell curve. I don’t think they did anything extraordinary here. They let it play out. It became a PR nightmare. They let him go. Outside of Cleveland and maybe Andy Reid, most other teams do the same thing.

 

Thats part of my frustration. These guys spent forever talking about community, culture, family, and that this was different. But it’s not. They behaved just like every other NFL team. The Buffalo Bills are just another NFL franchise. 

 

 

 

Hard disagree...honestly I couldn't disagree more with this assessment.  Very few, if any, other HC's would have come to the press conference and initiate the discussion of Matt and then refuse all football questions to focus only on this subject. If they even took questions at all, they would have maybe taken a few and then moved on to questions about the game.  

 

Then after cutting him, most GM's and HC's would not have given a face to face press conference for 30 min takin any and all questions from reporters out for blood trying to force any negative narrative they can for clicks.  Most teams the GM would have released a written statement or maybe a short video where they controlled the message and that is it.  They would have hidden behind being able to say they cant comment on an active investigation.  

 

Both McD and Beane did not hide from this and went out there and took responsibility and addressed the press directly and took what ever heat they wanted to throw at them.  And they were clearly emotionally affected by the severity and gravity of the situation for the victim and did nothing but do their best to respect everyone involved.  

 

Sorry, you are categorically wrong if you think that is the behavior or just any other franchise.  And that is just a flat out fact.  

Edited August 28, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[Gugny]

21 minutes ago, Mango said:

C. Im grading on a bell curve. I don’t think they did anything extraordinary here. They let it play out. It became a PR nightmare. They let him go. Outside of Cleveland and maybe Andy Reid, most other teams do the same thing.

 

Thats part of my frustration. These guys spent forever talking about community, culture, family, and that this was different. But it’s not. They behaved just like every other NFL team. The Buffalo Bills are just another NFL franchise. 

 

 

 

Had they drafted him after they knew about the incident/before the lawsuit, I would agree with you.

 

But they didn't.  They learned about it in July and let it play out in the most responsible way possible.  And once the news came out about the lawsuit, they moved as swiftly and properly as anyone could hope for.

[Bills2022]

17 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Surprisingly, I feel like a lot of people here are very much missing this very fact and just have unrealistic and unreasonable expectations of the reach and investigative prowess of a sports organization.  

 

Very well said, and I think this is a post worth pinning to be honest.  

 

Come on.  They knew about this when they cut Haack.  The Bills were well aware this guy had a criminal investigation for rape hanging over his head.  They just did not know the specifics.  If TMZ can figure out this type of thing, any NFL organization can figure it out.  My guess is they didn't see it as their job.  But don't for a second believe they could not have gotten the specifics of the alleged story.  If this was a star Quarterback they would have known what he was wearing and had for dinner the night of the incident.  There are a ton of former police, FBI, and other intelligence community members that can get their hands on anything they want if someone with deep pockets is willing to pay them.

 

The Bills did a good job.  But it could have been dealt with a little better. 

 

Edited August 28, 2022 by Bills2022

[SCBills]

11 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Hard disagree...honestly I couldn't disagree more with this assessment.  Very few, if any, other HC's would have come to the press conference and initiate the discussion of Matt and then refuse all football questions to focus only on this subject. If they even took questions at all, they would have maybe taken a few and then moved on to questions about the game.  

 

Then after cutting him, most GM's and HC's would not have given a face to face press conference for 30 min takin any and all questions from reporters out for blood trying to force any negative narrative they can for clicks.  Most teams the GM would have released a written statement or maybe a short video where they controlled the message and that is it.  They would have hidden behind being able to say they cant comment on an active investigation.  

 

Both McD and Beane did not hide from this and went out there and took responsibility and addressed the press directly and took what ever heat they wanted to throw at them.  And they were clearly emotionally affected by the severity and gravity of the situation for the victim and did nothing but do their best to respect everyone involved.  

 

Sorry, you are categorically wrong if you think that is the behavior or just any other franchise.  And that is just a flat out fact.  

Just tell anyone who disagrees with your spot on analysis to watch the Browns HC, GM and Owners vomit all over themselves in their pressers. 
 

Bills showed 100x more contrition and concern and they don’t even know if the allegations against Araiza are true. 
 

Edited August 28, 2022 by SCBills

[UKBillFan]

4 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

 

Well I guess his typical impulsive behavior probably cost him a career in the NFL.  Maybe a prison sentence.  Dude was not just a regular student at a regular party. 

 

Probably? If he has found not guilty in a criminal charge setting, or none are bought, and he settles out of court then he's back.

Not sure how you can deem his behaviour as being 'typically' impulsive either, unless we're going down the guilty before being proven innocent route again.

Edited August 28, 2022 by UKBillFan

[nucci]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

No disrespect bud, and really not singling you out on this, but what did you expect them to do?  And to be clear, I don't have an exception with your post here, its a good one.  I am just asking about the stayed quiet for a bit.  Others are really stuck on that, so this reply is more about addressing that staying quiet from the overall thread than your post here.  

 

This was a sensitive subject they had no idea that was true or not.  They were just accusations, and we live in a country where false accusations are made every day.  Heck, let's be real, it so common that our own politicians and media on both sides of the aisle literally lie and make false accusations daily to the entire country.  

 

My point really is there were no criminal chargers (still aren't) and there was no civil case (just got filed).  A civil attorney, who is someone working to get money for his client, contacted the accused employer to push pressure on Matt that he has something massive to lose here to incentivize a settlement and for the most he can get for his client.  

 

Anyone would be reckless to take that at face value, assume guilt, and throw the player under the bus making public statements on something they don't not yet know are credible accusations.  Bills not only respected the seriousness of the accusations and victim, but also the seriousness of the accused and working to figure this out behind the scenes before making any decisions or statements.  

 

Also, lets not forget these are football coaches and football executives.  They are not professional investigators, lawyers, etc...this could not have been, and clearly was not, easy for them to deal with and figure out what the right thing was to do.  And there is 0% chance any decision they made would have been seen 100% of all people approve of.  Had they just cut him over an accusation from a civil attorney working on a settlement, they would have looked bad to for not giving it a chance to shake out and see if this is credible or not.  

 

So people just need to give these guys a break (not really talking to you on that, you seem to be pretty level headed on this whole thing, just saying to the board in general)...they did what they felt was the best they could in a really bad spot.

 

Now lets all move on and get back to football.  This is in the rear view mirror and they guys did the right thing.  

 

I think they made the right move by being quiet. I agreed with it

[Mango]

13 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Hard disagree...honestly I couldn't disagree more with this assessment.  Very few, if any, other HC's would have come to the press conference and initiate the discussion of Matt and then refuse all football questions to focus only on this subject. If they even took questions at all, they would have maybe taken a few and then moved on to questions about the game.  

 

Then after cutting him, most GM's and HC's would not have given a face to face press conference for 30 min takin any and all questions from reporters out for blood trying to force any negative narrative they can for clicks.  Most teams the GM would have released a written statement or maybe a short video where they controlled the message and that is it.  They would have hidden behind being able to say they cant comment on an active investigation.  

 

Both McD and Beane did not hide from this and went out there and took responsibility and addressed the press directly and took what ever heat they wanted to throw at them.  And they were clearly emotionally affected by the severity and gravity of the situation for the victim and did nothing but do their best to respect everyone involved.  

 

Sorry, you are categorically wrong if you think that is the behavior or just any other franchise.  And that is just a flat out fact.  

 

2 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Just tell anyone who disagrees with your spot on analysis to watch the Browns HC, GM and Owners vomit all over themselves in their pressers. 
 

Bills showed 100x more contrition and concern and they don’t even know if the allegations against Araiza are true. 
 

 

I literally said outside of the Browns and maybe Andy Reid. 
 

Almost every one of the 30 other orgs in the NFL let this play out until it becomes a media schyte storm. Then cuts Araiza. They had two press conferences. Your bar for excellence is quite low. 
 

Comparatively the Bills found out about this. Sat in their hands. Then cut the guy once it spun out of control. 
 

It’s what most NFL teams do. I don’t find their handling of this anything other than average when compared to a majority of their peers. 

[nedboy7]

6 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

 

Probably? If he has found not guilty in a criminal charge setting, or none are bought, and he settles out of court then he's back.

Not sure how you can deem his behaviour as being 'typically' impulsive either, unless we're going down the guilty before being proven innocent route again.

 

I am not.  It was sarcasm.  Also I was commenting on her being under age.  Not the other accusations.  Point is he should have been way smarter and cautious at the least.  Btw the idea that he was not found guilty is not accurate from what I am reading.  He could end up facing statutory rape charges if the District Attorney feels the evidence is strong enough. Based on the alleged facts in the civil complaint, the evidence may end up persuading prosecutors to file formal charges.

Edited August 28, 2022 by nedboy7

[SCBills]

Just now, Mango said:

 

 

I literally said outside of the Browns and maybe Andy Reid. 
 

Almost every one of the 30 other orgs in the NFL let this play out until it becomes a media schyte storm. Then cuts Araiza. They had two press conferences. Your bar for excellence is quite low. 
 

Comparatively the Bills found out about this. Sat in their hands. Then cut the guy once it spun out of control. 
 

It’s what most NFL teams do. I don’t find their handling of this anything other than average when compared to a majority of their peers. 

What would you like them to do?  Hear about an allegation towards one of their players and immediately cut them?

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, nedboy7 said:

 

I am not.  It was sarcasm.  Also I was commenting on her being under age.  Not the other accusations.  Point is he should have been way smarter and cautious at the least. 

 

One night stands when drunk happen every evening. The question will be what age he thought she was, and what is believed.

[nedboy7]

3 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

 

One night stands when drunk happen every evening. The question will be what age he thought she was, and what is believed.

 

While it is unclear if the accuser was in fact raped, the crime of rape is measured differently when the accuser is a minor. This is because minors cannot consent to sex with an adult. Therefore, there is never a question of whether the accuser consented. Sex with a minor is automatically rape in most jurisdictions and particularly in San Diego where Araiza is accused. Hence why it is called statutory rape. It is rape, as a matter of law, when an adult has sex with a minor. Depending on the age difference, the rape would be a misdemeanor or a felony. If there is more than a three year age difference between perp and victim, it is generally charged as a felony. In San Diego, whether to charge the crime as a felony or misdemeanor is up to the prosecutor’s discretion. It appears at least that if the alleged victim was 17 and Araiza was in fact 21 at the time, then the four-year age difference could warrant a felony charge, depending on the evidence. A felony charge could carry up to three years in jail, if there is a conviction.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, T master said:

 

As i asked if it was Josh (or maybe even Diggs) would there be a different out come or would there be more time granted to a investigation as to what the facts were or would it be the same for all ? I'm just asking questions to the what if ...

 

The Texans put Watson on the shelf until more evidence or more of the same testimony's were given to basically incriminated him which i believe he is that scum bag & did what was said but at first they gave him the benefit of the doubt to see what was what before a decision was made .

Watson put himself “on the shelf” before he was sued.  He refused to play for them ever again.

 

Why do people keep getting this wrong?

[UKBillFan]

5 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

 

While it is unclear if the accuser was in fact raped, the crime of rape is measured differently when the accuser is a minor. This is because minors cannot consent to sex with an adult. Therefore, there is never a question of whether the accuser consented. Sex with a minor is automatically rape in most jurisdictions and particularly in San Diego where Araiza is accused. Hence why it is called statutory rape. It is rape, as a matter of law, when an adult has sex with a minor. Depending on the age difference, the rape would be a misdemeanor or a felony. If there is more than a three year age difference between perp and victim, it is generally charged as a felony. In San Diego, whether to charge the crime as a felony or misdemeanor is up to the prosecutor’s discretion. It appears at least that if the alleged victim was 17 and Araiza was in fact 21 at the time, then the four-year age difference could warrant a felony charge, depending on the evidence. A felony charge could carry up to three years in jail, if there is a conviction.

 

There has been a lot of back and forth on the 270+ page Araiza thread since Thursday about this. General agreement, from those who have looked in to Californian law, seem to be that, if Araiza has good reason to think she was 18 then that charge may not be placed, dependant on witness statements etc. Additionally, the age gap suggested that it could be treated as a misdmeanour rather than a felony as the alleged offender is 21 or under and the alleged victim is not 16 or under.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Starr Almighty said:

Just a reminder. This is a football team not a Police Department. The actual Police and DA haven't come to a conclusion to what really happened 10 months later. But somehow you want a room full of football guys to have all the answers. They knew he was accused of something and tried to figure out if it was true or not with their limited resources to do so. Because again this is a football team. 

It should be obvious that the only thing they figured out is they should have cut him as soon as the suit was made public, instead of inviting the predictable onslaught of bad public reaction before admitting the inevitable—Araiza had to go.  
 

Someone in the building, after knowing he was being sued for “gang rape” and “intoxicated rape” for a month, and then faced with the public release of the gross details, should have said: “ok that’s it.  Rook P has to go or we’re going to get creamed until we cut him”.

 

No one said this obvious truth….instead they double down on the bungling by announcing their decision (firing a radioactive player) was in HIS “best interest”. Lol wtf. 

[BigDingus]

1 hour ago, Bills2022 said:

 

B+.  Bills should have done their homework. This was handled well, but nobody should be congratulating anyone.  It is like congratulating the Bills after losing to the Chiefs last year in the playoffs.  The team and the front office need to move from playoff caliber to championship caliber. Enough with the stupid errors due to being unprepared. This is right up there with not squibbing the kick at the end of the playoff game.  Unforced errors are killers. 

 

This is exactly right. Unforced errors, and we're only a couple days removed from even hearing about this story... It definitely has room for more info to be brought to light, so let's just be happy they made the right decision & move on.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

4 hours ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

So the executives that were aware of the incident, why didn’t they alert the NFL? Which in turn could alert all the teams? It’s not like it’s a minor offense.

 

 

No idea??  Do teams commonly share?  If some team finds out a player has some medical issue, would they share that, or keep it to themselves and let another team draft damaged goods?  If it were Al Davis, I'd think the answer would be no!

 

I really have no idea how much and of what type/criteria of pre-draft info would be shared amongst teams? On one hand the less other teams know the better, but the Araiza situation does as Roger would say "Damage the shield"  From that standpoint, you'd think they would alert others, but I don't know.

[uninja]

18 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

No idea??  Do teams commonly share?  If some team finds out a player has some medical issue, would they share that, or keep it to themselves and let another team draft damaged goods?  If it were Al Davis, I'd think the answer would be no!

 

I really have no idea how much and of what type/criteria of pre-draft info would be shared amongst teams? On one hand the less other teams know the better, but the Araiza situation does as Roger would say "Damage the shield"  From that standpoint, you'd think they would alert others, but I don't know.

Pretty sure it’s just like any business sector. No one’s going to outwardly share but it’s a small world and I bet a lot of industry people know each other. If you have friends in the right places you can get some intel off the record.