Benford is outplaying 1st rounder Elam in camp (edit) Benford gets start

[mjd1001]

5 hours ago, JGMcD2 said:

That's part of the problem on a message board or in the media.. nobody wants to dive into the detail. Everything is very surface level and lack critical thinking. 

 

They want to look at teams individually and view success as binary: Win = Successful and Lose = Bad.

 

When in reality each decision is so much more nuanced, is dependent on so many factors and can really only be considered good or bad by comparison to similar decisions. 

As is the thinking in all of our society. There is minimal critical thinking.

 

Watch your news network of choice, follow who you want on social media. Argue with people on message boards.  People no longer read opinions, THINK about them, and then develop or alter their thinking.  Now it is a matter of finding a source of information that you WANT to believe, have it presented to you in a way that you want to hear, and then take it as truth. 

 

Going to message boards is the same, it is no longer about hearing other points of view that might be different than yours so you can think about them. It is developing your own opinion, and looking for people to agree with you and preparing for battle with people who don't agree with you.

 

I was always thought the best way to learn about things is to take in as much information as possible, engage with people who don't agree with you with an open mind (basically asking them to explain to you why they think they way they do) and then developing your own theory. Then, you try to disprove that thought, break it down to is smallest parts, and if you cannot do that, then and only then have you 'validated' your line of thinking.

 

When I come up with what I believe, I WANT to hear other opinions that are different. I WANT to hear people give me a WELL THOUGHT OUT counter point for me to consider, maybe they thought of something I didn't think of,  and I want to hear that.  But in todays world, its all about 'being right' or just getting spoon fed what you want to hear like a baby eating baby food.

Edited August 19, 2022 by mjd1001

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

I just thought of something:

 

Say that it's true that Dane Jackson is holding it down and Benford and Elam are neck and neck. If so, I feel a lot better about putting White on PUP for 4 weeks

[Warriorspikes51]

8 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

I just thought of something:

 

Say that it's true that Dane Jackson is holding it down and Benford and Elam are neck and neck. If so, I feel a lot better about putting White on PUP for 4 weeks

Not happening, Tre will be ready before that 

[TheFunPolice]

If Benford really is playing that well, then that's great news!

 

Elam will be fine. Then we have a deeper group at DB, which is huge for the defense. Overall this draft looks very promising, IMO. 

[Billy Claude]

6 hours ago, mjd1001 said:

As is the thinking in all of our society. There is minimal critical thinking.

 

Watch your news network of choice, follow who you want on social media. Argue with people on message boards.  People no longer read opinions, THINK about them, and then develop or alter their thinking.  Now it is a matter of finding a source of information that you WANT to believe, have it presented to you in a way that you want to hear, and then take it as truth. 

 

Going to message boards is the same, it is no longer about hearing other points of view that might be different than yours so you can think about them. It is developing your own opinion, and looking for people to agree with you and preparing for battle with people who don't agree with you.

 

I was always thought the best way to learn about things is to take in as much information as possible, engage with people who don't agree with you with an open mind (basically asking them to explain to you why they think they way they do) and then developing your own theory. Then, you try to disprove that thought, break it down to is smallest parts, and if you cannot do that, then and only then have you 'validated' your line of thinking.

 

When I come up with what I believe, I WANT to hear other opinions that are different. I WANT to hear people give me a WELL THOUGHT OUT counter point for me to consider, maybe they thought of something I didn't think of,  and I want to hear that.  But in todays world, its all about 'being right' or just getting spoon fed what you want to hear like a baby eating baby food.

 

You can always tell that people are only looking for people to agree with when they attack the messenger instead of the message. 

 

An example is a few weeks ago when Warren Sharp argued that it would be difficult for the Bills to win 12 games and he was attacked as a "hater" and click-bait mostly (though not all) by people who did not bother to listen to his video.  For me,  his schedule strength arguments while valid, others not so much but it is certainly not unreasonable for someone to think 12 games might be difficult when the over/under is 11.5.  If that was so, half the bettors are placing an obvious losing bet simply because they are haters.

 

One of my pet peeves on this board is people responding to headlines without even bothering to read the article.

 

 

 

 

[Simon Says]

On 8/18/2022 at 10:38 AM, FireChans said:

But we need 3 starting CB's.

Taron Johnson in the slot and Dane Jackson outside. Plus Elam/Benford until White returns. It could be a while before one of the rookies unseats Jackson.

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

I think in your nickel and dime packages, all 3 will get plenty of playing time.

[RoyBatty is alive]

11 minutes ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

I think in your nickel and dime packages, all 3 will get plenty of playing time.

Is that what they have been calling Jake, JakeFrommStateFarm or did you create that.  Creative name and I looked up Jake Fromm and they have that as his nick name on Wikipedia.  Wonder if you should get credit..

[No_Matter_What]

On 8/18/2022 at 4:32 PM, HOUSE said:

Ok, so we drafted Benford in the 1st and Elam in the 6th

 

Are you happy now ?

After the draft we already agreed that we drafted Shakir in 3rd and Bernard in 5th.

 

This is getting confusing

[Beck Water]

5 hours ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

I think in your nickel and dime packages, all 3 will get plenty of playing time.

 

Taron Johnson is the nickel corner.

 

 

[BillsVet]

21 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

It really isn't when the next best pick they have spent there in those 6 drafts is a 4th rounder. 

 

Over investment in DEFENSE fair enough. Over investment in SECONDARY? Nah. And the investments they have made have paid divideneds. Where they have over invested without the return is 2 firsts, 2 seconds and a third on the Dline plus big FA deals for Star, Addison, Butler, Murphy and now Von. 

 

Edit: just by way of comparison the last three Superbowl Champs in the same period -

 

Rams - three day 2 picks spent on DBs plus two 1st rounders traded away for Jalen Ramsey and one 2nd rounder for Marcus Peters. 

 

Bucaneers - no 1st rounders but SIX day two picks on DBs in the same period.

 

Chiefs - one 1st rounder, two day 2 picks, a big FA deal for Tyrann Mathieu and now a slightly smaller FA deal for Justin Reid that still outstrips what the Bills have paid either of their safeties in AAV.  

 

Think it is hard to look at that and argue the Bills have ploughed lots of resources into their secondary relative to other successful teams. The argument doesn't hold water.

 

 

GB - This is a heavy dose of quibbling.  You're citing the Rams and Bucs as evidence other teams are investing as much in secondary talent?  I will be ecstatic when Buffalo also begins investing on offense the way TB and LAR have these past few seasons.  Or, with KC who up until last season had All-Pro caliber receiving talents that scorched Buffalo's vaunted defense 2 playoffs going.

 

I'm not arguing against drafting CB's high (sorry @BillfromNYC), but there's a decision to be made when they're as weak in outside skill players as this team is heading into the regular season.    

 

 

 

[GolfandBills]

That’s great if he’s out playing him.  They both looked pretty good to me last Saturday. Looks like we got two 1st round talent CBs in the draft.  

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

On 8/18/2022 at 12:31 PM, FilthyBeast said:

 

No doubt about that but will see how much it matters given the ridiculous amount high end QB/WR matchups we face in the first 8 weeks.

 

 

 

Yeah, because Tennessee, Baltimore, Pittsburgh and the NY Jets which are half of the first 8 teams we play have awesome QB/WR matchups. 

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, BillsVet said:

 

GB - This is a heavy dose of quibbling.  You're citing the Rams and Bucs as evidence other teams are investing as much in secondary talent?  I will be ecstatic when Buffalo also begins investing on offense the way TB and LAR have these past few seasons.  Or, with KC who up until last season had All-Pro caliber receiving talents that scorched Buffalo's vaunted defense 2 playoffs going.

 

I'm not arguing against drafting CB's high (sorry @BillfromNYC), but there's a decision to be made when they're as weak in outside skill players as this team is heading into the regular season.    

 

 

You have the right crime (not investing enough in offense, I have argued that myself too - not just outside receiver but offensive line where they remain questionable) but you are charging the wrong criminal. 

 

There has NOT been an over investment in the secondary. It is the defensive line where they have poured resource after resource for minimal gain. 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

On 8/18/2022 at 10:21 AM, ddaryl said:

Its a great problem to have

Your 5th round Corner outplaying your 1st rounder? I’m not so sure 😒

[PrimeTime101]

Benford is a good all-around CB while Elam excels in man coverage. he showed that. I think our defense as the year goes on is going to be able to evolve, even if Elam being beat? it's not by much and when Elam figures out zone better? It's going to make our CB's way more dynamic. Teams like PIT. Bucs run a mix of man and zone coverages on one play. IF Elam can man up the #2 WR and Tre work the #1 WR with Safety deep help... this frees up many things. Some teams cause of who is at QB is better playing full 2 deep Zone on them. This opens up opportunities for both of our rookies and makes our defense more dynamic.

 

Some look at this as a "fun problem to have"

 

I look at this as an opportunity to be a more dynamic DB group on the back end. last year our defense was good but not scary good... this defense this year could evolve into something really scarry.

 

What a great time for us Bills fans!

[ddaryl]

4 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Your 5th round Corner outplaying your 1st rounder? I’m not so sure 😒

 

 

NO!!!!  It's great having a 5th rounder playing way above his draft status.

 

Majority of camp reports are positive on both players....Both are going to make their mistakes, but both are also rising to the challenge.

 

Great problem to have....

Edited August 20, 2022 by ddaryl

[loveorhatembillsfan4life]

9 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

You have the right crime (not investing enough in offense, I have argued that myself too - not just outside receiver but offensive line where they remain questionable) but you are charging the wrong criminal. 

 

There has NOT been an over investment in the secondary. It is the defensive line where they have poured resource after resource for minimal gain. 

The infatuation with the Dline in prior years has been a disaster  in resources and money. But this has to be the year doesn’t it? If not this year then when.. 
 

I’m cautiously optimistic with the addition of Von,  Oliver taking it to another level, Groot breaking out  and the depth behind them that they can be a force to be reckoned with. Maybe we hit gold getting two Corners out of this draft solidifying the secondary in case of injury. From my point of view it’s time for this defense to take it to another level. 

But agree, Josh should be given whatever resources we can provide. Beane and Mcd seem to value Growth,  out of their home drafted guys so yeah they feel good about Gabe and the guys we have, we also can keep them around a a fairly good price..

 

I just hope that a major injury doesn’t derail the season because of lack of depth. I think I’m all for trying to bring in Odell for a stretch run if we can. 
 

I think Beane, Mcd and the players can get Odell to buy into the culture, he is with his buddy Von.. I think he could be a good asset provided he is healthy. 

Edited August 20, 2022 by loveorhatembillsfan4life

[Doc]

6 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Your 5th round Corner outplaying your 1st rounder? I’m not so sure 😒

 

If "outplaying" meant "he sucks but not as bad as the 1st rounder," I'd agree.  But "outplaying" here is "good chance to start and slightly ahead of the 1st rounder."

Edited August 20, 2022 by Doc

[QLBillsFan]

12 hours ago, BillsVet said:

 

GB - This is a heavy dose of quibbling.  You're citing the Rams and Bucs as evidence other teams are investing as much in secondary talent?  I will be ecstatic when Buffalo also begins investing on offense the way TB and LAR have these past few seasons.  Or, with KC who up until last season had All-Pro caliber receiving talents that scorched Buffalo's vaunted defense 2 playoffs going.

 

I'm not arguing against drafting CB's high (sorry @BillfromNYC), but there's a decision to be made when they're as weak in outside skill players as this team is heading into the regular season.    

 

 

 

Your saying the Bills haven’t invested in offense talent? Diggs trade, Knox, Davis, Shakir, Saffold, Crowder. They scored about 40 points a game in the playoffs. Pretty clear O isn’t the problem. So they logically went D in the draft. Slow at corner so trying to address it.