This Aqib Talib story...

[That's No Moon]

1 hour ago, JoPoy88 said:

Agreed you don’t mess with the refs unless there’s some sort of blatant bias going on (ref is a relative of someone on the other team, etc…) even if there is, you go through the proper channels to report it.

I got thrown out of one basketball game as a coach.  Ref was calling nothing.  We had a girl drive the lane and get a forearm to the mouth that knocked her to the floor bleeding out of the mouth, no call.  My offense was yelling out onto the floor "Make a call!" no cursing. Double tech. Out.

 

I've gotten a lot better as a hockey parent. All the other sports my own kids have played have been fine. Baseball, soccer, lacrosse, swimming, whatever. It's been fine.  Hockey is a lot harder for me just because of the inherent danger and risk of injury when the refs let things get out of control and it devolves into illegal checks, dangerous stick work, targeting and eventually fights on the ice. I now volunteer myself to be timekeeper, when I have a job to do I'm able to keep my mouth shut better and it helps me to not hyper focus on my own kid and to watch the game. Sitting in an enclosed box by myself also helps.  I've also learned that when I stand up things are much more likely to come out of my mouth so I now sit and force myself to do so. I'll blame an upbringing at Rich Stadium for that.  If I have to stand because of the rink configuration, I stand somewhere by myself, behind the glass rather than above it, so I can't be heard on the ice.  I'm not the guy who loses his mind. There are some of those, but I realize that it's not appropriate and I've tried to learn how to reign myself in before it gets out of line. The guys (and moms) that seem to have the most trouble are the ones that hit the pre-game/inter game tailgate too hard or spend too much time in the rink bar.  Rinks with bars are the best and worst idea at the same time.  

 

The worst parents I see now honestly are the parents of the youngest kids.  It's not just hockey, it's most sports I've been a part of.  The parents that are new, are often the worst.  We had to kick 4 people out of a TRACK MEET this year because they were riding one of the meet officials after they incorrectly thought she'd made an error in getting the kids lined up.  I had to kick two people out of a basketball game after they, in excitement after a nice play, ran out to the foul line DURING PLAY.  They didn't understand why I was kicking them out of the gym. After running out onto the floor. During the actual game. During live play. Couldn't understand why they'd been ejected.  What's really needed are sessions led by parents of older kids talking to the parents of kids just starting.  "How to be a <insert sport here> parent."  What I'm going to do this year is try to make a series of funnyish videos for our students and parents to watch about how not to act at games because people seem to be coming in not having any clue whatsoever and I'm not sure what else to do at this point. We have to have uniformed police at every game. We kick people out all the time. It's not helping.

[HardyBoy]

3 hours ago, RobbRiddicksTDLeap said:

As a Coach, sometimes you need to give the Ref the business. 
 

As a Coach, sometimes you need to give the other Coach the business. 
 

But it ends at the business. I’ve given and gotten it, and never once resulted in fists. My blood has boiled watching other boys hack at my son in Lacrosse, or trip my daughters in soccer. Or worse, the blatant BS in one of our Flag Football leagues. I’m not going to say it hasn’t come close. The minute some guy gives the “ok chief” it’s hard for me. I won’t lie. But, the thought of my kids, whether my own or the ones I Coach, seeing me taken away in cuffs over a game, is just awful to me. I don’t understand how grown men, who have clearly seen the right side of things, can’t behave the same way. 
 

Just disgusting 

 

You're drawing a pretty clear line at safety stuff though from what it sounds like. Getting protective of players where a coach is intentionally coaching their team to dangerously slash in lax cause they're not going to call everyone, is very different from losing it because a ref in a bang band play saying a player had just scooped a ground ball an instant before being pushed in the back leading to a 30 second man down vs getting possession (random lax deep dive there).

 

Overall though, even calling out another coach for safety reasons, isn't that sort of like saying, sometimes I just need to road rage on a car that cut me off. That said, I would never get it to the level where someone is shot on the side of the road in a road rage situation.

 

Except you can't necessarily control if the other person suddenly pulls over and starts walking towards your car.

 

I think that you might be attributing your lack of something bad happening with your ability to be in control, when in fact there was a loss of control and fortunately you were not in a situation where the ingredients were present for that to turn sideways.

 

Also, there's gamesmanship where you're pointing out things to get a call later, which is cool and part of the game and everyone gets it when done in a controlled, positive and non toxic way. Then there's yelling at 16-17 year olds reffing 12 year old club soccer. I speak from experience as a soccer player and ref in high school. You have any idea how socially intense that situation is already, and then add in parents and coaches thinking it matters in the slightest (outside of player safety stuff). A random game, or screw it, a random call in a game when your kid is 12 isn't going to change the trajectory of their life in any way. Seeing that a game can make a parent that angry...

 

Like listen, I know people feel like these things are important, but important for who? These are the kids' hobbies, that I'm assuming parents and other adults involved are hoping become life long hobbies and character lessons. Why are adults making it about themselves instead?

 

Also, 20 years from now, the kids involved aren't going to remember the wins or losses. They're not going to remember the missed calls or the missed opportunities in some random summer tournament from when they were 12. They will remember the examples set though, and they'll likely only remember it as shades of feelings when they think back. 

 

Again, this is not at all talking about player safety stuff. If a player is out of control, it is the responsibility of the adults to knock that crap out, and agree that can lead to confrontational conversations.  Like I said, you might not remember who won a game, but will definitely remember the time your friend had their ankle stepped on dirty af the first game of the season and had to miss just about his entire senior year season, or when a friend of yours got pushed in the back full force with two hands while she was blocking out someone in the corner during indoor soccer and smashed her teeth into the boards and lost teeth (was a separate girls and boys tournement at the same place and my team was set to go on next, so yeah saw that happen).

[wppete]

So is Aqib Talib a suspect in this murder? This is insane story. 

[K D]

2 hours ago, BUFFALOTONE said:

Why do you have a gun at a youth football game? 

 

1 hour ago, CoudyBills said:

Because some crazy assclown might shoot you, isn't that obvious?  It literally just happened today.

This times infinity. This is the answer to any of the why questions regarding carrying on the daily 

7 minutes ago, wppete said:

So is Aqib Talib a suspect in this murder? This is insane story. 

No, his brother is. Hardly a suspect, more like we have you on video and 100 witnesses that saw you do it, enjoy prison for the rest of your life

[JoPoy88]

2 hours ago, maddenboy said:

"Murder" is a legal conclusion.  We have scant, if any, facts.  "Murder" is incendiary and emotionally evocative. 

 

Defenses to "murder" might be in play here.

 

A "Homicide" appears to have occured.  A "Shooting Death" as PFT termed it.

 

Lets be civilized.

“Someone” got “shot to death” over a youth football game. Civilized enough?

1 hour ago, wppete said:

So is Aqib Talib a suspect in this murder? This is insane story. 

No. He was there obviously but no warrant is out for his arrest for anything connected to this. His brother is in big trouble. 
 

doesn’t help the OP won’t edit his thread but yeah. We’ve already learned his level of effort.

[maddenboy]

post deleted.  Apologies for offending your sensitivities.  Sorry for wasting your time.

[JoPoy88]

2 hours ago, That&#x27;s No Moon said:

I got thrown out of one basketball game as a coach.  Ref was calling nothing.  We had a girl drive the lane and get a forearm to the mouth that knocked her to the floor bleeding out of the mouth, no call.  My offense was yelling out onto the floor "Make a call!" no cursing. Double tech. Out.

 

I've gotten a lot better as a hockey parent. All the other sports my own kids have played have been fine. Baseball, soccer, lacrosse, swimming, whatever. It's been fine.  Hockey is a lot harder for me just because of the inherent danger and risk of injury when the refs let things get out of control and it devolves into illegal checks, dangerous stick work, targeting and eventually fights on the ice. I now volunteer myself to be timekeeper, when I have a job to do I'm able to keep my mouth shut better and it helps me to not hyper focus on my own kid and to watch the game. Sitting in an enclosed box by myself also helps.  I've also learned that when I stand up things are much more likely to come out of my mouth so I now sit and force myself to do so. I'll blame an upbringing at Rich Stadium for that.  If I have to stand because of the rink configuration, I stand somewhere by myself, behind the glass rather than above it, so I can't be heard on the ice.  I'm not the guy who loses his mind. There are some of those, but I realize that it's not appropriate and I've tried to learn how to reign myself in before it gets out of line. The guys (and moms) that seem to have the most trouble are the ones that hit the pre-game/inter game tailgate too hard or spend too much time in the rink bar.  Rinks with bars are the best and worst idea at the same time.  

 

The worst parents I see now honestly are the parents of the youngest kids.  It's not just hockey, it's most sports I've been a part of.  The parents that are new, are often the worst.  We had to kick 4 people out of a TRACK MEET this year because they were riding one of the meet officials after they incorrectly thought she'd made an error in getting the kids lined up.  I had to kick two people out of a basketball game after they, in excitement after a nice play, ran out to the foul line DURING PLAY.  They didn't understand why I was kicking them out of the gym. After running out onto the floor. During the actual game. During live play. Couldn't understand why they'd been ejected.  What's really needed are sessions led by parents of older kids talking to the parents of kids just starting.  "How to be a <insert sport here> parent."  What I'm going to do this year is try to make a series of funnyish videos for our students and parents to watch about how not to act at games because people seem to be coming in not having any clue whatsoever and I'm not sure what else to do at this point. We have to have uniformed police at every game. We kick people out all the time. It's not helping.

this is depressing and informative at the same time and I thank you for it. I honestly don’t know what the answer is, beyond the obvious and banning guns at a youth football game (which won’t happen in texas) but yeah, in general, the parents at these games need to chill out. So many of them are still trying to live out their failed athletic fantasies through their kids and they take it way, WAY too seriously.

[That's No Moon]

2 hours ago, JoPoy88 said:

this is depressing and informative at the same time and I thank you for it. I honestly don’t know what the answer is, beyond the obvious and banning guns at a youth football game (which won’t happen in texas) 

The weapons thing is always my biggest concern. Stuff is obviously banned but we don't have metal detectors like a pro stadium. People bring in purses and bags all the time and honestly they could carry something directly on their person and we'd never know. Even if we keep it out of the gym/stadium there is always the parking lot after the event. I'm often the person making the call on when a person gets ejected from the stands and I have no way of knowing if they are waiting for me outside when I'm done for the night. 

 

To be honest, this is part of my concern every day.  There's nothing to stop kids from bringing in basically whatever they want to bring in and even if there were it would be at school and not on the bus they ride to school with 50 other kids. There's nothing to stop a disturbed staff member from bringing whatever they want right through the front door.  There's very little to nothing to stop an outsider from breaching the building and doing whatever they want.  We have a uniformed, armed, State Trooper on campus every single day but they aren't screening people at the door and even if they were the building has something like 9 different sets of exterior doors plus exterior doors to most of the first floor classrooms, plus huge ground floor windows all over the place.  The trooper has their sidearm on them and an AR-15 in their office.  Odds of them being able to get to the office if they needed to in a situation are 50/50 at best just because of where it's located and the traffic flow of the building. Odds of them being able to effectively intervene in a situation are basically zero.  Again, I don't know what solution there is for any of this which is what makes it so exasperating and depressing.  This is now my life and these are things I shouldn't have to be thinking about.

[Beerball]

17 hours ago, Bermuda Triangle said:

....it's something.

 

RIP to the coach who was murdered.

 

Belichick really does go after high-character guys, doesn't he?

Common man, not a time to take a jab at Bellichick. Put a link in it next time.

 

Overall terrible story. I was surprised to find out that peewee teams now have owners.

https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/local/yaqub-talib-lancaster-football-shooting-man-wanted-in-killing-of-another-man-at-a-lancaster-youth-football-game-police-say/287-146f7389-c53d-4f04-9b7b-7e976d01de85

[RobbRiddicksTDLeap]

7 hours ago, HardyBoy said:

 

You're drawing a pretty clear line at safety stuff though from what it sounds like. Getting protective of players where a coach is intentionally coaching their team to dangerously slash in lax cause they're not going to call everyone, is very different from losing it because a ref in a bang band play saying a player had just scooped a ground ball an instant before being pushed in the back leading to a 30 second man down vs getting possession (random lax deep dive there).

 

Overall though, even calling out another coach for safety reasons, isn't that sort of like saying, sometimes I just need to road rage on a car that cut me off. That said, I would never get it to the level where someone is shot on the side of the road in a road rage situation.

 

Except you can't necessarily control if the other person suddenly pulls over and starts walking towards your car.

 

I think that you might be attributing your lack of something bad happening with your ability to be in control, when in fact there was a loss of control and fortunately you were not in a situation where the ingredients were present for that to turn sideways.

 

Also, there's gamesmanship where you're pointing out things to get a call later, which is cool and part of the game and everyone gets it when done in a controlled, positive and non toxic way. Then there's yelling at 16-17 year olds reffing 12 year old club soccer. I speak from experience as a soccer player and ref in high school. You have any idea how socially intense that situation is already, and then add in parents and coaches thinking it matters in the slightest (outside of player safety stuff). A random game, or screw it, a random call in a game when your kid is 12 isn't going to change the trajectory of their life in any way. Seeing that a game can make a parent that angry...

 

Like listen, I know people feel like these things are important, but important for who? These are the kids' hobbies, that I'm assuming parents and other adults involved are hoping become life long hobbies and character lessons. Why are adults making it about themselves instead?

 

Also, 20 years from now, the kids involved aren't going to remember the wins or losses. They're not going to remember the missed calls or the missed opportunities in some random summer tournament from when they were 12. They will remember the examples set though, and they'll likely only remember it as shades of feelings when they think back. 

 

Again, this is not at all talking about player safety stuff. If a player is out of control, it is the responsibility of the adults to knock that crap out, and agree that can lead to confrontational conversations.  Like I said, you might not remember who won a game, but will definitely remember the time your friend had their ankle stepped on dirty af the first game of the season and had to miss just about his entire senior year season, or when a friend of yours got pushed in the back full force with two hands while she was blocking out someone in the corner during indoor soccer and smashed her teeth into the boards and lost teeth (was a separate girls and boys tournement at the same place and my team was set to go on next, so yeah saw that happen).

Thank you. 
 

The hyper competitive coaches and parents in Youth sports is the issue. When you get so wrapped up in the win that you forget the idea is teaching children how to work together and about unity and the bonds of hard work. 
 

My point remains. I Coach my kids to NEVER bark at the ref. NEVER. That’s a sure fire way to never get a call. Communication is the way to get what you need from a ref. Until they don’t listen. Then sometimes they get the business. Same with a Coach who is having his kids hack and trip and stiff arm and shoulder block. Sometimes they need to be reminded that the rules are the rules for a reason, and not guidelines to be bent. 
 

I take coaching seriously. It’s not my profession, but I am passionate about it. There are fine lines and A LOT of grey area, and at the end of the day, we are coaching children. Role models and examples of adults to respect and follow. That includes how to deal with things when they don’t go your way. 

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/lancaster-coach-killed-during-shooting-at-sporting-event/3047970/

 

https://www.fox4news.com/news/yaqub-talib-lancaster-youth-football-shooting

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/dfw/news/lancaster-police-looking-for-man-accused-of-shooting-coach-at-youth-football-game/

 

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crime/2022/08/14/aqib-talibs-brother-named-as-suspect-in-shooting-of-lancaster-youth-football-coach/

 

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/crime/article264504436.html

 

[wjag]

I really don't understand how a child's game gets so heated as for someone to draw a gun and shoot someone else.  This is such a sad commentary on life in America in 2022.  And what is distressingly worse for me is this is more normal now than abnormal in 2022 America.  What are we doing people?!?!??

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

4 minutes ago, wjag said:

I really don't understand how a child's game gets so heated as for someone to draw a gun and shoot someone else.  This is such a sad commentary on life in America in 2022.  And what is distressingly worse for me is this is more normal now than abnormal in 2022 America.  What are we doing people?!?!??

 

 

 

[Jauronimo]

11 hours ago, CoudyBills said:

Because some crazy assclown might shoot you, isn't that obvious?  It literally just happened today.

I bet thats what Talib's brother would have said before he became the crazy assclown who lost control.

[muppy]

gun shots popping off at the youth sports activity. I find the incident shocking and disgusting. Who deems it to be appropriate to be packing guns at their kids games.  It speaks to that being 'normal" in civilized society am I right?   Do most normal sane people arm themselves to attend a youth sports function? NOPE I refuse to think we have sunk THAT low people.  It just is NOT MY CULTURE Thank goodness

 

as far as the thread hoopla I think fessing up to a mistake shows character and respected amongst the brethren here. 

Edited August 15, 2022 by muppy

[StHustle]

5 hours ago, \GoBillsInDallas/ said:

 

 

 

Thugs!

[Niagara Bill]

On 8/14/2022 at 12:33 PM, Bermuda Triangle said:

....it's something.

 

RIP to the coach who was murdered.

 

Belichick really does go after high-character guys, doesn't he?

Yeh, and we thought Frank Gore was a good guy. A lot of sickos out there

[Buffalosouth]

As a youth coach I have personally coached in league where people were running numbers, heated coaches arguments with each other and refs every game, and there was a shooting. Also had announcement before a game not to smoke cigs and pipes... Needless to say I no longer coach in that league and went to NFL sponsored and faith based leagues. But the fact remains its sad when you enjoy something enough to dedicate time to it and things like this happen. 

[thenorthremembers]

5 hours ago, wjag said:

I really don't understand how a child's game gets so heated as for someone to draw a gun and shoot someone else.  This is such a sad commentary on life in America in 2022.  And what is distressingly worse for me is this is more normal now than abnormal in 2022 America.  What are we doing people?!?!??

Because a lot of parents view their kid as a lottery ticket.   I coach JV Football and I hear parents screaming from the sidelines to put their kid in or freaking out over play calls.   Meanwhile they cant get their kid to practice on time or send them with the proper equipment.    They think their kids perceived talent entitles them to playing time, even when they don't make it to practice or study their playbooks.

 

Entitlement. 

Edited August 15, 2022 by thenorthremembers

[Buffalo716]

7 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

Because a lot of parents view their kid as a lottery ticket.   I coach JV Football and I hear parents screaming from the sidelines to put their kid or freaking out over my play calls.   Meanwhile they cant get their kid to practice on time or send them with the proper equipment.  

Your school doesn’t donate equipment ? 
 

And we do practice Within An hour after school and then they don’t need to leave and return