Hodgins must stay

[BillsFanNC]

11 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Why did 13 seconds get included in that

 

Special teams communications error led to 13 seconds being left on clock.

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, FireChans said:

.

Guys like Stefon Diggs and AB were STers early in their careers. I would hate to be the team that gets rid of them too early in favor of 32 year old gunners. 

 

Again, no team is doing that. Teams do not get rid of developmental guys who can play special teams to keep an elite gunner. They get rid of fringe people who don't really belong in the NFL. The Jake Kumerows, the Tommy Sweeneys, the Duke Johnsons and the like. 

 

You are wrong about special teams. It's okay. Most fans are. 

[billybrew1]

I give up, he’s on the show for 75 minutes?

[BillsFanForever19]

12 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

If it were me I would keep Hodgins over Kumerow.  Just because Kumerow played special teams doesn't mean he isn't replaceable on special teams.

 

Yes, but you are making the assumption that Hodgins is as good at Special Teams or there's another player on the team at another position that is.

 

This mentality is demeaning to our core Special Teams players. Comes across as "anyone can do it". And not just anyone can do it and do it well. 

[BADOLBILZ]

8 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Again, no team is doing that. Teams do not get rid of developmental guys who can play special teams to keep an elite gunner. They get rid of fringe people who don't really belong in the NFL. The Jake Kumerows, the Tommy Sweeneys, the Duke Johnsons and the like. 

 

You are wrong about special teams. It's okay. Most fans are. 

 

 

In fairness........Duke Johnson belongs in the NFL.

 

He had a down year with the Texans in 2020 but otherwise he's been a much better player than the slightly older JD McKissic, for example.

 

The chances of James Cook averaging over 9 yards per reception in his career like Duke Johnson are scant...........that is an elite number for a pass catching RB.

 

[Don Otreply]

9 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Again, no team is doing that. Teams do not get rid of developmental guys who can play special teams to keep an elite gunner. They get rid of fringe people who don't really belong in the NFL. The Jake Kumerows, the Tommy Sweeneys, the Duke Johnsons and the like. 

 

You are wrong about special teams. It's okay. Most fans are. 

    I here what you are saying, but, STs like it or not are pretty much the red headed step child of the league.  
 

   STs are like cops and lawyers, no one wants them around until they need them,  so to speak,  As an example of how the league values STs players;  Zero specific STs players in the HOF, This is in large part why fans don’t value STs as they likely should. 
 

   Believe it or not I’m not against having competent STs guys on the team, so it’s not that, it’s that the league in all reality is “smh” when it comes down to giving meaningful recognition to the minor 3rd phase of the game, the league sets the example.  As is said, actions speak louder than words. 
 

Go Bills!!!

[SCBills]

8 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Yes, but you are making the assumption that Hodgins is as good at Special Teams or there's another player on the team at another position that is.

 

This mentality is demeaning to our core Special Teams players. Comes across as "anyone can do it". And not just anyone can do it and do it well. 

 

It's really tough. 

 

We haven't had bad special teams play for a few years now (sans punter issues).. The first time Araiza bombs a punt and we give up a huge return, fans will start to turn on how they view this issue.  

 

It will also be very frustrating if a legit slot corner like Cam Lewis or a legitimately promising young WR get claimed before we can stash them on the PS, simply because we feel the need to keep four guys on the roster that are only expected to ever contribute on special teams. (Jones, Neal, Kumerow, Matakevich)

 

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, SCBills said:

 

It's really tough. 

 

We haven't had bad special teams play for a few years now (sans punter issues).. The first time Araiza bombs a punt and we give up a huge return, fans will start to turn on how they view this issue.  

 

It will also be very frustrating if a legit slot corner like Cam Lewis or a legitimately promising young WR get claimed before we can stash them on the PS, simply because we feel the need to keep four guys on the roster that are only expected to ever contribute on special teams. (Jones, Neal, Kumerow, Matakevich)

 

 

Neal is not only expected to contribute on teams. He is our backup nickel, we use him as a big nickel in packages on defense against certain teams. He can play safety in a pinch and has even played a bit of oustide corner for us in a pinch.

 

Nor is Kumerow. Kumerow is not supposed to be here just for special teams. He is supposed to be here as a depth outside receiver and those guys HAVE to play special teams. Nobody carries a 5th or 6th receiver who never sees the field and doesn't play teams. Just doesn't happen. The issue with Kumerow is that his special teams contributions are better than his receiver contributions. But someone has to beat him out and so far, nobody has. Hodgins might have a shot right now but its now or never for him.

 

The two players the Bills keep almost entirely for special teams (except the K, P and LS) are Matakevich and Taiwan Jones. They have both been excellent at their jobs. 

 

I agree it'd suck seeing Cam Lewis go. Good kid, can play nickel and a bit of outside corner himself, and is a good teams player in his own right. But he is the only player on this roster who has flashed some proper potential and who might be at risk as a result of the Bills keeping other special teams guys. I think (and hope) there is a way to keep him on the roster. 

[Scott7975]

11 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Yes, but you are making the assumption that Hodgins is as good at Special Teams or there's another player on the team at another position that is.

 

This mentality is demeaning to our core Special Teams players. Comes across as "anyone can do it". And not just anyone can do it and do it well. 

 

Yes I am because I believe that Kumero is JAG.  

[BillsFanForever19]

16 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Yes I am because I believe that Kumero is JAG.  

 

As a Special Teams player? Because he made the squad for that last season. He was the 7th WR on a roster that always kept 6 max for that reason. If they felt he was so replaceable there, the Bills would have just let him walk after last season. Instead, they gave him a new contract.

 

I get the feeling you're once again referring to his play as a WR and completely disregarding Special Teams. To your end of arguing for bottom of the roster WR's who won't be active on Game Day over core Special Teams players.

Edited August 17, 2022 by BillsFanForever19

[BillsFanForever19]

On 8/14/2022 at 7:18 AM, John from Riverside said:

We drafted him

we’ve been patient with him

We need to keep him

 

We've been patient with him? You are aware we released him last season after Training Camp and he was only here on the Practice Squad, meaning anyone could have claimed him at any time - right?

[hemma]

Beane may be playing 4D chess for the foreseeable future, trying to hold onto talent. Have some big contracts to work around.

I have no idea how far his roster planning extends into the future, but:

 

In 2024, as things now stand, we’ll have Diggs, Shakir, Stevenson and Pau’u under contract, which is to say, Diggs and Shakir.

I think he’ll be forced ($$) to be pretty restrictive on picking up free agents and will try to use other means of rounding out the roster.

 

Davis may be spectacular - or at least out of our restricted $$ range for keeping, with the same for Mackenzie.

 

Hodgins however, will be an ERFA and will be able to be resigned for peanuts - a 1 year contract at league minimum.  

This may a small + that nudges him over the top.

 

Yes, a spitball.

[DCbillsfan]

15 minutes ago, hemma said:

Beane may be playing 4D chess for the foreseeable future, trying to hold onto talent. Have some big contracts to work around.

I have no idea how far his roster planning extends into the future, but:

 

In 2024, as things now stand, we’ll have Diggs, Shakir, Stevenson and Pau’u under contract, which is to say, Diggs and Shakir.

I think he’ll be forced ($$) to be pretty restrictive on picking up free agents and will try to use other means of rounding out the roster.

 

Davis may be spectacular - or at least out of our restricted $$ range for keeping, with the same for Mackenzie.

 

Hodgins however, will be an ERFA and will be able to be resigned for peanuts - a 1 year contract at league minimum.  

This may a small + that nudges him over the top.

 

Yes, a spitball.

If Hodgins keeps making plays he'll make the team this year.  I believe drafting a WR in 2023 will be high priority.  Keeping Oliver and Davis are the priorities imo.  

[LABILLBACKER]

Yeah I don't get all this Kumerow love. I just don't see what he does so compelling on ST that justifies his zero contribution on offense? Just train Hodgins to do exactly what Kumerow does and call it a day.  Last Saturday Hodgins reminded me of an extremely taller, younger version of Beasley. 

[Cash]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Neal is not only expected to contribute on teams. He is our backup nickel, we use him as a big nickel in packages on defense against certain teams. He can play safety in a pinch and has even played a bit of oustide corner for us in a pinch.

 

Nor is Kumerow. Kumerow is not supposed to be here just for special teams. He is supposed to be here as a depth outside receiver and those guys HAVE to play special teams. Nobody carries a 5th or 6th receiver who never sees the field and doesn't play teams. Just doesn't happen. The issue with Kumerow is that his special teams contributions are better than his receiver contributions. But someone has to beat him out and so far, nobody has. Hodgins might have a shot right now but its now or never for him.

 

The two players the Bills keep almost entirely for special teams (except the K, P and LS) are Matakevich and Taiwan Jones. They have both been excellent at their jobs. 

 

I agree it'd suck seeing Cam Lewis go. Good kid, can play nickel and a bit of outside corner himself, and is a good teams player in his own right. But he is the only player on this roster who has flashed some proper potential and who might be at risk as a result of the Bills keeping other special teams guys. I think (and hope) there is a way to keep him on the roster. 

 

There is real value in guys like Siran Neal, who can play at all the positions Gunner listed without completely killing the defense.  Is he great at any of those spots?  No.  But he's a depth player, and that's what's available.  The alternative is probably a specialist who's slightly better at 1 of the positions, but significantly worse at all the others. 

[Robert Paulson]

14 hours ago, StHustle said:

So let me start by saying I like Cover 1 and the deep dives they take on the technical part of the game. It’s impressive how they’ve been able to get multiple Bills players to come on and do extensive interviews with them. Many even speculate that that’s a major reason Thad Brown hated on them like he did a couple weeks ago.

 

With that said, watching this particular episode, I came away feeling like Hodgins said way too much. I understand the opponent gets to go over the same game type they did and can break down Hodgins tendencies themselves. But to me it’s like, let them do their jobs. Give them a chance to come to false conclusions instead of you laying things out on a platter like that.

 

McKenzie was on their show a few weeks back and was seemingly intent on keeping things very general but still gave insight and was informative and entertaining. But it didn’t feel like any of it was to the detriment of the ingredients of his secret sauce.

 

Maybe I’m totally overreacting here. Curious of what me fellow TBDers think 🤔 

 

 

 

 

I didn't  think was bad at all. Scouting interns should know this stuff 

[John from Riverside]

2 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

We've been patient with him? You are aware we released him last season after Training Camp and he was only here on the Practice Squad, meaning anyone could have claimed him at any time - right?

So you think if you put someone on your practice squad you are giving up on him?

[HamptonBillsfan]

Hodgins looked good vs the Colts, but can we see him produce in a real game against starters before we anoint him as a member of our receiver corp. I’m rooting for him because he’s had challenges but we need a consistent, clutch, durable player to replace Cole.

[BillsFanForever19]

45 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

So you think if you put someone on your practice squad you are giving up on him?

 

Considering that you a.) Have to release the player and subject them to waivers and then b.) Are placing them in a position to be signed to anyone's active roster at any given time - I wouldn't exactly call that being heavily invested in someone or being patient with a player. 

 

Patient to me would be protecting them by giving them a spot on the 53. They flat out cut him.

[Don Otreply]

12 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Considering that you a.) Have to release the player and subject them to waivers and then b.) Are placing them in a position to be signed to anyone's active roster at any given time - I wouldn't exactly call that being heavily invested in someone or being patient with a player. 

 

Patient to me would be protecting them by giving them a spot on the 53. They flat out cut him.

I just watched a “ locked on Bills” episode, Joe Marino broke down who over the last couple of years was picked up from our team in the waiver process and signed to another teams 53, before going to our PS, it’s wasn’t very many, and once to the PS the player has to agree to play for another team, they cannot just take a player, also consider they can pay a PS guy as much as they want to, to keep

them around. Also consider 31 other teams have guys they want to keep as well, that the put through waivers…,