the Punt god

[mrags]

3 minutes ago, Logic said:

Well...I don't see how those two statements are incompatible.

"He's not yet complete as a punter" and "I think he'll likely end up being really good" are not mutually exclusive, and one of the key things that I think would lead from statement one to statement two is improving upon his hangtime. 

the thing I was originally responding to was your comment that "hang time is meaningless almost all the time". And then IronMaiden said "hangtime is a non starter of an issue". I disagree. 
 

Well. We will disagree that it’s a non issue. I understand your point. I just think for the most part, the number of punts that we will likely be forced into, I think it’s a non issue. The kid has a big enough leg that even backed into your own zone he will likely flip the field and chances to make it a touchback are much greater than any concern over hang time. 
 

again, he would have to be punting inside his own 10-20 yard line for it to not be a touchback. I’ll give it that is on his best kicks. But even his not so good kicks they will likely mean anything inside his own 30-40 will be touchbacks almost 100% of the time. Anything closer to midfield than that, I would hope that McDermott decides to let Allen take his chances and go for it. 
 

all I’m saying is, the majority of the time I don’t believe it will ever be an issue. 

[Saint Doug]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Um, the guy is, arguably, the most talented punter ever. Why wait to “make sure that the sky doesn’t fall?” Don’t go through life like that!! Celebrate that we have AN ELITE talent at a position where we were, arguably, the worst in the league. This isn’t a time to be negative!! Enjoy the ride!!

I certainly never meant to be negative. It’s just a reality of any player handling a wet ball or making one travel in precipitation, not a knock against him. 

[FilthyBeast]

Seems like this punt god stuff is already getting old.

 

There's nothing this kid is doing that we didn't see already with a guy like Bojo who everyone raved about after the Pats tried hiding him and we brought him here. Still think Hauck has a better chance to make the team over him than most probably expect.

 

 

[Warcodered]

2 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

Seems like this punt god stuff is already getting old.

 

There's nothing this kid is doing that we didn't see already with a guy like Bojo who everyone raved about after the Pats tried hiding him and we brought him here. Still think Hauck has a better chance to make the team over him than most probably expect.

 

 

Bojangles had an inconsistent really strong leg and couldn't hold consistently either, Ariaza is already showing better consistency at both.

[FilthyBeast]

2 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Bojangles had an inconsistent really strong leg and couldn't hold consistently either, Ariaza is already showing better consistency at both.

 

I guess but one game isn't really enough of a sample size to truly know if he's an upgrade yet. But even if it's even between him and Hauck he's obviously getting the nod for the job.

[Warcodered]

5 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

I guess but one game isn't really enough of a sample size to truly know if he's an upgrade yet. But even if it's even between him and Hauck he's obviously getting the nod for the job.

Haack has a history of shanks which he has seemingly been doing better with now that his job is on the line. Still the kid has shown he can hold which was really the biggest worry with him now all he needs is control. If he doesn't get that down then I guess he's the touchback king and that's disappointing but I can live with that over shanks. If he does figure it out then he's not just a good punter if there's such a thing as a HOF punter he'd be that. You gamble on that over a potentially marginally better than average punter who could also be significantly worse.

[without a drought]

46 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

Seems like this punt god stuff is already getting old.

 

There's nothing this kid is doing that we didn't see already with a guy like Bojo who everyone raved about after the Pats tried hiding him and we brought him here. Still think Hauck has a better chance to make the team over him than most probably expect.

 

 

Stop kidding yourself, Haack has zero chance to make the team. 

 

This isn't really a competition for the job. Haack is only here because he wasn't getting a starting job anywhere and the Bills needed an extra leg for camp. It also is providing him to stay ready for a team with an early cut or injury.

[Kirby Jackson]

1 hour ago, Saint Doug said:

I certainly never meant to be negative. It’s just a reality of any player handling a wet ball or making one travel in precipitation, not a knock against him. 

Obviously, it is tougher to throw, punt, catch, kick, handle the ball, cheer, coach, rush the passer, etc… when the weather is bad. That’s not a point that needed to be raised. That holds true FOR EVERY SINGLE POSITION. It’s safe to assume, “Araiza won’t consistently hit 82 yard punts, into the wind, on a rainy December day.” We already know that it is harder to play football in bad weather. 

1 hour ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

I guess but one game isn't really enough of a sample size to truly know if he's an upgrade yet. But even if it's even between him and Hauck he's obviously getting the nod for the job.

But his career isn’t? He’s the greatest punter in NCAA history. Was that sample size sufficient or is “it harder to punt against pro competition?”

1 hour ago, FilthyBeast said:

Seems like this punt god stuff is already getting old.

 

There's nothing this kid is doing that we didn't see already with a guy like Bojo who everyone raved about after the Pats tried hiding him and we brought him here. Still think Hauck has a better chance to make the team over him than most probably expect.

 

 

I’ll book that bet and give you 20-1. You name the stakes. If Haack makes the team I’ll send you 20X of what you’ll send me if it’s Araiza. You CLEARLY are not familiar with Araiza’s reputation. He’s not “like Bojo.” He’s “like no one ever” at this point. It needs to continue, obviously, but at this stage there isn’t a comp.

[Doc]

16 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

Seems like this punt god stuff is already getting old.

 

There's nothing this kid is doing that we didn't see already with a guy like Bojo who everyone raved about after the Pats tried hiding him and we brought him here. Still think Hauck has a better chance to make the team over him than most probably expect.

 

16 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

I guess but one game isn't really enough of a sample size to truly know if he's an upgrade yet. But even if it's even between him and Hauck he's obviously getting the nod for the job.

 

Araiza's been perfect on holds in camp and in the game the other day.  That was a very important criterion for him getting the job over Haack. 

 

As for punting, he's got things to learn, but like Josh in his first 2 seasons, he's got major potential and is worth developing.  Where Haack is at is the best he's going to be.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Doc
grammar

[Ralonzo]

Hack’s absolute ceiling is league average, that’s it. And that requires being immaculate and avoiding blocks and shanks.

 

Araiza has a top-3 type ceiling, and his floor is probably about league average.

 

Feels like this one is over but for the visit from the Turk.

[Sierra Foothills]

I don't believe Araiza's freakishly strong leg forgives all sins, nor do I believe it revolutionizes punting.

 

Here's a sortable database for NCAA punting:

 

https://www.footballdb.com/college-football/stats/stats.html?mode=U&yr=2021&lg=FBS&sort=puntnet

 

It shows that Araiza was 1st in gross yardage but only 6th in net yardage. On the downside he led the nation in touchbacks and had a below average touchback percentage of 19%. He was also mediocre in percentage of punts returned (27.8%) and downright bad in yards per return (11.4 yards per return).

 

Araiza was drafted under the hope that he improves substantially. Hopefully that happens.

.

[PetermansRedemption]

13 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

I don't believe Araiza's freakishly strong leg forgives all sins, nor do I believe it revolutionizes punting.

 

Here's a sortable database for NCAA punting:

 

https://www.footballdb.com/college-football/stats/stats.html?mode=U&yr=2021&lg=FBS&sort=puntnet

 

It shows that Araiza was 1st in gross yardage but only 6th in net yardage. On the downside he led the nation in touchbacks and had a below average touchback percentage of 19%. He was also mediocre in percentage of punts returned (27.8%) and downright bad in yards per return (11.4 yards per return).

 

Araiza was drafted under the hope that he improves substantially. Hopefully that happens.

.

I may be in the minority, but I have absolutely no problem if all Araiza does is boot it out if the end zone every time. I’ll take an average opponent start of the 20 yard line. If the Bills get to the right side of the 50 yard line I believe they are going for it the vast majority of the time anyways. 

[Son of a K-Gun]

17 hours ago, JayBaller10 said:

Remember the days when Haack was shanking three punts in a row during a game? Why is this even still being dressed as a “competition”? Give Haack his release papers, wish him well, and send him on his way. He has probably a less than 1% chance to win the job. 

That shank-fest was in typical (poor) late-season Buffalo weather.  There is no reason to believe Haack would do any better this season when we get late into the year and the weather goes downhill.  The obvious hope is that Araiza has the leg strength to kick through the wind/rain/snow/hail/monsoon similar to Josh's arm strength.  Guess we won't know until we see it...

[Ralonzo]

If anything Araiza should be more of a weapon the worse the weather gets. Allen can really spin it and those longer throws in the Cyclone Bowl were still getting whipped around to where Diggs couldn’t catch a ball put right on his hands. Punts should get Niekro’d far beyond that, good luck with those.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

16 hours ago, without a drought said:

Stop kidding yourself, Haack has zero chance to make the team. 

 

This isn't really a competition for the job. Haack is only here because he wasn't getting a starting job anywhere and the Bills needed an extra leg for camp. It also is providing him to stay ready for a team with an early cut or injury.

 

Also just in case this coming week Aariza were to get hurt, then he goes to IR and they keep Haack.  So buys them a small insurance policy for a week or even two more weeks.

[TBBills]

17 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

Seems like this punt god stuff is already getting old.

 

There's nothing this kid is doing that we didn't see already with a guy like Bojo who everyone raved about after the Pats tried hiding him and we brought him here. Still think Hauck has a better chance to make the team over him than most probably expect.

 

 

Wrong again... your shtick is getting old.

[unbillievable]

I'm still trying to find the state of San Diego.

[without a drought]

5 minutes ago, unbillievable said:

I'm still trying to find the state of San Diego.

I think it's in God's country.

[Returntoglory]

18 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

Seems like this punt god stuff is already getting old.

 

There's nothing this kid is doing that we didn't see already with a guy like Bojo who everyone raved about after the Pats tried hiding him and we brought him here. Still think Hauck has a better chance to make the team over him than most probably expect.

 

 

Bojo was not even close to the talent that Matt possess.  

[Son of a K-Gun]

1 hour ago, Ralonzo said:

If anything Araiza should be more of a weapon the worse the weather gets. Allen can really spin it and those longer throws in the Cyclone Bowl were still getting whipped around to where Diggs couldn’t catch a ball put right on his hands. Punts should get Niekro’d far beyond that, good luck with those.

"Niekro’d" -- perfect.