Pokebball Posted May 22 Posted May 22 1 hour ago, daz28 said: Here's the Doc classic once again. All bad things are equal, so I'm allowed to support one side. They're not equal. Trump had the right to take them via the Presidential Records Act
daz28 Posted May 22 Posted May 22 1 minute ago, Pokebball said: They're not equal. Trump had the right to take them via the Presidential Records Act That's not for you, me, Fox news, or trump's lawyers to decide. That's up to the courts who define and implement the laws.
4th&long Posted May 22 Posted May 22 32 minutes ago, daz28 said: You say that, because you equate all bad things, which allows you to support one side. You do it with pretty much everything. I'm all for charging Biden, but the SC already decided it was a losing proposition. He fully explained his reasoning. On the other side, you have Trump openly obstructing. LITERALLY attempting to hide them from attempts to return them to where they belong. The worst part of the whole thing is that MAGA is hoping he slides on a technicality. I’ve said this all along, trump would not have been charged if he just gave them back without a fight. He thinks rules don’t apply to him. also it seems like all of them, on both sides have no respect for classified documents. 1
Biden is Mentally Fit Posted May 22 Posted May 22 3 minutes ago, daz28 said: That's up to the courts who define and implement the laws. You need to attend a civics class asap.
ChiGoose Posted May 22 Posted May 22 3 minutes ago, daz28 said: That's not for you, me, Fox news, or trump's lawyers to decide. That's up to the courts who define and implement the laws. What the Trump backers here seem to constantly forget (aside from all that obstruction) is that Trump had the right to the documents while president and his possession of them was illegal as of noon on Inauguration Day 2021. Thankfully for Mr. Trump, the Feds treated him like others who had been in his position and just asked for the documents back. Unfortunately for Mr. Trump, he took Tom Fitton’s advice instead of his attorney and decided to obstruct the Feds, resulting in him being charged. 2
daz28 Posted May 23 Posted May 23 8 minutes ago, JDHillFan said: You need to attend a civics class asap. Is there a reason I'm not attending one right now? If the judge and grand jury felt that he was protected under the PRA, the case would already have been dismissed. In fact, if it were as clear as you're claiming, they wouldn't have even had an investigation. 1
ChiGoose Posted May 23 Posted May 23 1 minute ago, daz28 said: Is there a reason I'm not attending one right now? If the judge and grand jury felt that he was protected under the PRA, the case would already have been dismissed. In fact, if it were as clear as you're claiming, they wouldn't have even had an investigation. Fun fact: Trump wasn’t charged under the PRA. 1
Pokebball Posted May 23 Posted May 23 17 minutes ago, daz28 said: That's not for you, me, Fox news, or trump's lawyers to decide. That's up to the courts who define and implement the laws. So they're equal?
daz28 Posted May 23 Posted May 23 12 minutes ago, 4th&long said: I’ve said this all along, trump would not have been charged if he just gave them back without a fight. He thinks rules don’t apply to him. also it seems like all of them, on both sides have no respect for classified documents. Possibly. They certainly do have a hard on for trump. Not saying he didn't do what they claim, but the last 10,000 congressional investigations have gotten us virtually no justice at all for anything. If anything, all of this partisanship might actually end them covering up for one another constantly. It's the only positive I can come up with out of this whole division debacle.
Pokebball Posted May 23 Posted May 23 Just now, ChiGoose said: Fun fact: Trump wasn’t charged under the PRA. Of course not
daz28 Posted May 23 Posted May 23 1 minute ago, Pokebball said: So they're equal? No, but they are what we have to work with. The right has everyone thinking the judicial system is going rogue against them, but I'd argue they're finally just not sweeping everything under the rug anymore. If the final result is politicians being held accountable, I'm ok with that.
ChiGoose Posted May 23 Posted May 23 3 minutes ago, daz28 said: No, but they are what we have to work with. The right has everyone thinking the judicial system is going rogue against them, but I'd argue they're finally just not sweeping everything under the rug anymore. If the final result is politicians being held accountable, I'm ok with that. Nah, it’s actually that the criminality of the right at the moment is fairly unprecedented. Simply applying the law as it’s usually applied results in literally hundreds of MAGA people being prosecuted. That then gets spun as bias by grifters and conmen as politicization instead of fairly straightforward enforcement of the law.
L Ron Burgundy Posted May 23 Posted May 23 55 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Nah, it’s actually that the criminality of the right at the moment is fairly unprecedented. Simply applying the law as it’s usually applied results in literally hundreds of MAGA people being prosecuted. That then gets spun as bias by grifters and conmen as politicization instead of fairly straightforward enforcement of the law. Yes. Someone may thumb their nose at the law but then they'll smarten up and play ball. Trump doesn't do smart. Not ever.
Pokebball Posted May 23 Posted May 23 1 hour ago, ChiGoose said: Nah, it’s actually that the criminality of the right at the moment is fairly unprecedented. Simply applying the law as it’s usually applied results in literally hundreds of MAGA people being prosecuted. That then gets spun as bias by grifters and conmen as politicization instead of fairly straightforward enforcement of the law. blue shades
Doc Posted May 23 Posted May 23 3 hours ago, Pokebball said: So they're equal? No. What Biden did was worse. But I still wouldn't charge him (or Trump). They just have a raging hard on for Trump.
ChiGoose Posted May 23 Posted May 23 8 minutes ago, Doc said: No. What Biden did was worse. But I still wouldn't charge him (or Trump). They just have a raging hard on for Trump. This is a significant divergence from the law and obviously false. But that will never stop the cult!
Doc Posted May 23 Posted May 23 1 minute ago, ChiGoose said: This is a significant divergence from the law and obviously false. But that will never stop the cult! Not false at all. Biden took classified information he never had any business having. He knowingly kept them. He kept them in a wholly insecure location. And he shared some with his ghostwriter. You can deny it all you want, but everyone, even daz28, knows it's true. But he's senile and to charge someone with something you need to be absolutely sure you can get a guilty verdict. Because in the history of the US, there have never been any "not guilty" verdicts (apparently ). 1
ChiGoose Posted May 23 Posted May 23 1 minute ago, Doc said: Not false at all. Biden took classified information he never had any business having. He knowingly kept them. He kept them in a wholly insecure location. And he shared some with his ghostwriter. You can deny it all you want, but everyone, even daz28, knows it's true. But he's senile and to charge someone with something you need to be absolutely sure you can get a guilty verdict. Because in the history of the US, there have never been any "not guilty" verdicts (apparently ). Why didn’t they charge Pence? Why don’t they generally charge people who hand the documents over when asked? What would happen if every single person who possessed illicit documents was charged regardless of how they came to possess them? Deep down, you know the truth. You know that the only reason Trump was charged was because he obstructed the investigation but you cannot accept that the godking is fallible so you drive in circles demonstrating your lack of knowledge in fealty to your ideology.
Doc Posted May 23 Posted May 23 Just now, ChiGoose said: Why didn’t they charge Pence? Why don’t they generally charge people who hand the documents over when asked? What would happen if every single person who possessed illicit documents was charged regardless of how they came to possess them? Deep down, you know the truth. You know that the only reason Trump was charged was because he obstructed the investigation but you cannot accept that the godking is fallible so you drive in circles demonstrating your lack of knowledge in fealty to your ideology. Because Pence wasn't a threat at all to Biden politically. If not a way to say "see, we don't have to charge every Republican!" He "obstructed" because he felt that he was entitled to it because a President (and only a President) can declassify anything he wants. That's the difference between him and everyone else. Different rules for different people. If anything, everyone else should be charged and he shouldn't. And again, for the millionth time, there's little difference between Trump not giving it back when asked for it versus Biden knowingly having it and keeping it for years. The spirit of the law is to prevent people from using it for nefarious purposes. Otherwise it's just a property crime. 1
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