Donald Trump is under criminal investigation by the Department of Justice

[Irv]

8 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

You have to be a leftist to believe stirring up a deadly riot is a crime? 

 

What are you smoking this morning? 

 

Don't slip on your own ejagulate.  You got lied to that Biden and Harris were going to be in charge when you casted your vote but you don't care.  Are you that big of a wussy?  Where's your backbone?  Have you no pride?  

 

 

Edited July 27, 2022 by Irv

[wnyguy]

Oh man, looks like they finally got him this time. I think this is the time they actually got him. After all the other times they have tried and failed I'm pretty sure that this time they will finally get him. Thank you J6 Committee and DOJ, you guys will finally nail this character once and for all.

[BillStime]

41 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

How many tens of millions of taxpayer money has been spent going after trump with zero results? 
 

Who’s going to get thrown is jail for that crime… ??  abuse of power, embezzlement collusion, corruption and general dereliction of duty. How the hell could this many attempts come up empty handed? 

 

Probably not nearly as much as US tax payers spent at Trump properties and golf outings... right Mista Independent?

 

[BillStime]

 

Now we got em... just like the freaks who chant "LOCK HER UP" at every Trump Klan fest. 

 

 

[BillStime]

33 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

There was only one person murdered and the shooter got away with it. 

Why was she shot?

[BillStime]

48 minutes ago, Irv said:

 

Don't slip on your own ejagulate.  You got lied to that Biden and Harris were going to be in charge when you casted your vote but you don't care.  Are you that big of a wussy?  Where's your backbone?  Have you no pride?  

 

 

What a mess.

 

And you’re going to talk to us about PRIDE?

 

 

WUSSY?

 

 

Idiots 

[Doc]

You'll (continue to) get nothing and like it. 

[The Frankish Reich]

1 hour ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

There was only one person murdered and the shooter got away with it. 

There was one Q Anon inspired fool who tried to break through an interior security door protecting duly elected lawmakers, who resisted lawful efforts to repel her, who was then shot and killed. 
By the way, gun lovers: I have a good friend who’s a cop. He tells me that the Capitol Police officer’s shot was textbook perfect. Center torso, aorta blown up, immediate blood pressure drop to zero, threat neutralized. 

[ChiGoose]

I understand why everyone focuses on the violence of January 6th, but a charge under 18 U.S. Code § 2384 is probably the least likely charge due to the difficulty in proving intent.

 

If Trump himself actually faces a charge, it is far more likely to be either 18 U.S. Code § 371 - Conspiracy to commit offense or to defraud United States or 18 U.S. Code § 1505 - Obstruction of proceedings before departments, agencies, and committees.

 

Given what we've seen in the reporting, it seems the DoJ is very interested in the fake electors scheme, which would likely fall under conspiracy to defraud the United States.

 

All of that being said, I am skeptical that Merrick Garland would approve an indictment of Trump himself, even if it ends up being a slam dunk case.

[ChiGoose]

14 minutes ago, B-Man said:

FTA:

 

As I’ve shared before, I just don’t get the whole “false electors” obsession nor do I see any illegality in it. All it entailed was a group of self-chosen “alternative” electors making a purely ceremonial and non-legally biding commitment to vote for Trump if decertification happened. I’m not going to argue with those that find that objectionable, but there’s a difference between objectionable and criminal.

 

None of the “false electors” ever cast a vote for anything, they didn’t interfere with the election, and the original electors cast their votes for Joe Biden. If that’s what the DOJ is probing, good luck proving a “seditious conspiracy” without any actual attempt at sedition on the record. Besides, how can something be a conspiracy when the plans were public knowledge at the time?

 

Moving on to the idea that Trump criminally conspired to obstruct a government proceeding, that doesn’t make much sense either. Trump was asking former Vice President Mike Pence to do something he felt was legal under the Electoral College Act. It is not “obstructing” a government proceeding if you intend to use legal mechanisms to reach your goal.

 

Yes, in the end, Pence decided he didn’t believe he had the power, but obviously, Trump thought otherwise. There’s no intent there. Are we going to start criminalizing all possible misinterpretations of law by politicians? Because that would be quite the can of worms to open.

 

In the end, the DOJ’s pursuit, if the Post’s sourcing is accurate, just seems like a big reach to please the January 6th committee and Democrats at large. Still, it’s probably best to just embrace the chaos at this point. Things are so far off the rails that you might as well kick back and enjoy the show. Let’s see how charging Trump criminally for a bunch of probable non-crimes works out.

 

 

https://redstate.com/bonchie/2022/07/26/report-federal-criminal-probe-into-donald-trump-underway-n602078

 

 

 

The fake electors signed documents that they were the true electors and transmitted those documents to the national archive. That is fraud. There is no legal justification for their actions.

 

Where the conspiracy to defraud comes into play is that some of Trump's advisors wanted the fake electors to take those actions so that when Pence rejects the certification, they can have Congress vote on which slates of electors to accept, hoping they would select the fake electors and overturn the election.

 

Here is a timeline of the scheme: https://www.justsecurity.org/81939/timeline-false-alternate-slate-of-electors-scheme-donald-trump-and-his-close-associates/

 

 

[BillStime]

2 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

There was only one person murdered and the shooter got away with it. 

You don’t want to provide us with some horseshit answer why Miss American Taliban was killed?

 

I’m shocked.

 

REALITY is tough for the cult 

[T master]

Does any of this really matter ? Even if there is proof that he did nothing as in the Russian collision thing & there is proof that it was all paid for by the other party & that FISA warrants were rewarded on false claims or in layman terms lies .

 

You won't believe any of it any way ! If he was totally 100% exonerated in all & every way you would still have your bias & hatred running rapid against him & you will still continue as always to blow smoke up any one ass that will listen despite any proof or facts .

 

But with that being said if he is found guilty i for one will say throw his ass in prison as they would any of us if we were guilty !

 

It should make no difference past/current POTUS if you broke the law & there is proof beyond a shadow of a doubt or a eye witness go directly to jail do not pass go do not collect any money . PERIOD !! 

[ChiGoose]

8 minutes ago, T master said:

Does any of this really matter ? Even if there is proof that he did nothing as in the Russian collision thing & there is proof that it was all paid for by the other party & that FISA warrants were rewarded on false claims or in layman terms lies .

 

You won't believe any of it any way ! If he was totally 100% exonerated in all & every way you would still have your bias & hatred running rapid against him & you will still continue as always to blow smoke up any one ass that will listen despite any proof or facts .

 

But with that being said if he is found guilty i for one will say throw his ass in prison as they would any of us if we were guilty !

 

It should make no difference past/current POTUS if you broke the law & there is proof beyond a shadow of a doubt or a eye witness go directly to jail do not pass go do not collect any money . PERIOD !! 

 

I think we have enough evidence to charge several people close to Trump, and Trump himself, with conspiracy to defraud the United States. If a jury acquits him, then we *have* to accept that.

 

Whether or not Garland has the stones to actually do it, remains another question.

[T master]

1 minute ago, ChiGoose said:

 

I think we have enough evidence to charge several people close to Trump, and Trump himself, with conspiracy to defraud the United States. If a jury acquits him, then we *have* to accept that.

 

Whether or not Garland has the stones to actually do it, remains another question.

 

Well if he's guilty & there is proof then Garland needs to grow some balls & if the proof is there & he doesn't then throw his ass in jail too because he's as big a part of the problem than those breaking the law !

 

For to long just like in there recent Pelosi, Hunter & who ever else you would want to include has shown that if you have money to buy your self out of trouble it will be done even if you lie to the hill top you will still get away with it ! 

 

Welcome to America !! 

[cle23]

5 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

There was only one person murdered and the shooter got away with it. 

 

Yep, ignoring lawful commands from an officer while climbing through a broken window, into a restricted area with Congress meeting, all while having a gun pointed at you and ignoring the said commands, is about a simple as it gets.

 

If you're dumb enough to do that, you get what you get.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

7 hours ago, Tiberius said:

He's a friggin criminal, so ya 

He's screwed. He's being sued, grand juries have been convened at state and federal level. He's a scum bag and needs jail time 

What, for wrasslin a secret service agent?  

 

[Doc]

38 minutes ago, cle23 said:

 

Yep, ignoring lawful commands from an officer while climbing through a broken window, into a restricted area with Congress meeting, all while having a gun pointed at you and ignoring the said commands, is about a simple as it gets.

 

If you're dumb enough to do that, you get what you get.

 

Does this apply to many of the black people who have been shot by cops for doing something illegal and then ignoring commands by officers?

[All_Pro_Bills]

48 minutes ago, cle23 said:

 

Yep, ignoring lawful commands from an officer while climbing through a broken window, into a restricted area with Congress meeting, all while having a gun pointed at you and ignoring the said commands, is about a simple as it gets.

 

If you're dumb enough to do that, you get what you get.

And yet every other officer on duty that day assessed the threat differently and choose not to discharge their weapons in that situation.  So a trigger happy police officer who has a reported history of incidents shot and killed an unarmed person that posed no immediate danger.  But no big deal, right?   

 

13 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

What, for wrasslin a secret service agent?  

 

 I think a lot of the pissing and moaning is the allegation that Trump suggested and "encouraged" replacing some electoral college representatives in states he lost with others that would override the voters choice and change their vote in the Electoral College. 

But in 2016 numerous Democratic officials went on the record suggesting the electors be pressured and coerced to change their votes to Hillary.  So how many of them got indicted, charged, tried, convicted, and sentenced?  None.  Because 1) they were Democrats, 2) they were members of the political class, 3) they were members of the perpetual war uni-party.  I guess the logic is they did it, anything goes for them, and the rules and laws don't apply in the pursuit of "good".  Only the other guys need to follow the law.

Edited July 27, 2022 by All_Pro_Bills

[cle23]

40 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Does this apply to many of the black people who have been shot by cops for doing something illegal and then ignoring commands by officers?

 

Each situation depends.  A lot of them, white/black/brown/whatever, yes it does.  A lot it doesn't.  

 

32 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

And yet every other officer on duty that day assessed the threat differently and choose not to discharge their weapons in that situation.  So a trigger happy police officer who has a reported history of incidents shot and killed an unarmed person that posed no immediate danger.  But no big deal, right?   

 

Different situations.  It was a barricaded door with quite a few protestors behind it.  Behind the officer was Congress, in session.  He gave a lawful command and she continued through a broken window, ignoring his drawn gun and orders to stop.  There is no way to tell from his end if she was unarmed.  

Edited July 27, 2022 by cle23

[ChiGoose]

27 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

 I think a lot of the pissing and moaning is the allegation that Trump suggested and "encouraged" replacing some electoral college representatives in states he lost with others that would override the voters choice and change their vote in the Electoral College. 

But in 2016 numerous Democratic officials went on the record suggesting the electors be pressured and coerced to change their votes to Hillary.  So how many of them got indicted, charged, tried, convicted, and sentenced?  None.  Because 1) they were Democrats, 2) they were members of the political class, 3) they were members of the perpetual war uni-party.  I guess the logic is they did it, anything goes for them, and the rules and laws don't apply in the pursuit of "good".  Only the other guys need to follow the law.

 

The idea that 2020 was the same as what the Democrats did in 2016 is just false and relies on a misunderstanding of the facts.

• 2016: Some Democrats call for "faithless electors" which are duly elected electors to choose someone other than the winner of the popular vote in the state.
• 2020: Trump engages in a conspiracy to replace the duly elected electors with a slate of electors of his choosing.

One of the purposes of the electoral college is so that it could act as an intermediate body to prevent a dangerous candidate from being elected. The founders were concerned that a candidate might whip up the masses and wanted the electors as a check against that.

 

Had Trump tried to convince the actual electors to change their votes to him, that would have been similar to 2016. Instead, he and/or his advisors had them create fraudulent documents in an attempt to overthrow the election.