Julio to Tampa

[4merper4mer]

17 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Not sure you understand the word "inevitably."

They both have a track record of injuries so………….oh, wait.

[Thurman#1]

21 hours ago, NewEra said:

Lots of people admit it.  Some people just trust the process more than others.  I trust it too, but i was hoping we’d add another outside WR for depth.  Maybe shakir can do it!  Maybe Austin can do it?  Maybe crowder can fill in?  Maybe Mckenzie?  I do think they have a plan for if Davis or Diggs get hurt….but I just don’t know what it is by looking at the depth chart

 

 

That's the situation. There are a lot of guys who might be able to fill in. This is an offense that has had smaller guys as their #3 receiver the last two years.

 

If none of them work out, (my guess is they pepper them all in and out in case of an injury) the coaching staff will surely let Beane know. They could bring Sanders back. Sanders greatly outproduced Julio Jones last year despite not having a great year. If not Sanders, someone else decent, cheap and smart.

 

Some people seem to want excellent players at every position. And it doesn't work that way. Even before the salary cap every team had weaknesses. It's just the way things work in complicated systems.

 

When they fix the weakest position, then people complain about what used to be the second-weakest position which has now fallen to worst. Fix the weakest two positions and people will complain about the third-weakest which has now fallen to weakest. It never ends.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Thurman#1

[GunnerBill]

4 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

Some people seem to want excellent players at every position. And it doesn't work that way. Even before the salary cap every team had weaknesses. It's just the way things work in complicated systems.

 

When they fix the weakest position, then people complain about what used to be the second-weakest position which has now fallen to worst. Fix the weakest two positions and people will complain about the third-weakest which has now fallen to weakest. It never ends.

 

So this is true, but that is what we do as fans. It doesn't mean people don't appreciate where the team is at. And of course every team has weaknesses but they are also all making choices about where to take that risk. We, as fans, debate the merits of those choices. That is what this thread is for me. It's a sort of referendum on he decision to plough their FA cash into the defensive line as opposed to receiver depth. Only time shows whether they were right or wrong but it is a legitimate discussion. 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

Again, it is relatively small beer in the big picture of how they have built the roster and the job Beane and McDermott have done, but I haven't loved their approach to outside receiver the last two springs. I think they kept Gabe as the depth option a year longer than they should have and then I think they should have been more aggressive pursuing a depth option this spring. 

 

 

I don't think it's relatively small because the talent drop-off from the WR1 and WR2 to everyone else is that massive.

 

Their obsession with defensive depth is impressive though.    

 

This defense should shut everybody down..........the team has never had this much invested in a defense in its history..........lotta' money and 6 of the last 8 first rounders on that side of the ball.

 

So if the receiving corps is a failure they might be able to run it and punt it and still win enough games to get in the tournament and then just let Josh Allen run 12-15 times per game in the playoffs and see what happens.

 

Hopefully it never gets to that though.    Very telling that Beane isn't downplaying the depth situation at outside WR though.   

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I don't think it's relatively small because the talent drop-off from the WR1 and WR2 to everyone else is that massive.

 

Their obsession with defensive depth is impressive though.    

 

This defense should shut everybody down..........the team has never had this much invested in a defense in its history..........lotta' money and 6 of the last 8 first rounders on that side of the ball.

 

So if the receiving corps is a failure they might be able to run it and punt it and still win enough games to get in the tournament and then just let Josh Allen run 12-15 times per game in the playoffs and see what happens.

 

Hopefully it never gets to that though.    Very telling that Beane isn't downplaying the depth situation at outside WR though.   

 

I meant the big picture in terms of since 2017, not specific to this year. 

[Southern_Bills]

23 hours ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

Julio seems to always have lingering hamstring injuries, but when he's on the field he's still plenty good.  Only 33 years old.  He averaged 14ypc with Tannehill as his QB and 15.1 the year before (his last in Atlanta).

 

Yeah, but Availability is greater than ability. If you can't stay on the field it's tough, and the kind of injuries it is just screams that this will never get better. Soft tissue generally doesn't get stronger with age.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Let’s stop this bickering and actually look at the top Super Bowl contenders. Some of these WRs like Godwin, Allen, Kupp, and Smith-Schuster are going to run out the slot the majority of the time but can play all over.

 

The Bills definitely could use another WR, especially comparing to the league. That 3rd guy is weak. Top 2 guys I’m taking the Bills over Chiefs, Packers, 49ers, Cowboys, Colts, Broncos, and Ravens. So top 2 we’re good. Upgrade needed at #3. Now I know Crowder can play, but he’s like Beasley. A slot only guy.

 

Bills - Stefon Diggs, Gabe Davis, Jake Kumerow

 

Bucs - Mike Evans, Chris Godwin, Julio Jones/Russel Gage

 

Chiefs - JuJu Smith Schuster, Marquez Valdes-Scantling, Mecole Hardman, 

 

Packers - Adam Lazar, Sammy Watkins, Christian Watson

 

Rams - Cooper Kupp, Allen Robinson, Van Jefferson

 

Chargers - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Josh Palmer

 

49ers - Deebo Samuel, Brandon Aiyuk, Danny Gray

 

Cowboys - Ceedee Lamb, Michael Gullup, Jalen Tolbert

 

Colts - Michael Pittman, Alec Pierre, Paris Campbell

 

Broncos - Cortland Sutton, Jerry Juedy, Tim Patrick 

 

Ravens - Rashod Bateman, Devin Duevernay, James Proche

 

Bengals - JaMarr Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Let’s stop this bickering and actually look at the top Super Bowl contenders. Some of these WRs like Godwin, Allen, Kupp, and Smith-Schuster are going to run out the slot the majority of the time but can play all over.

 

The Bills definitely could use another WR, especially comparing to the league. That 3rd guy is weak. Top 2 guys I’m taking the Bills over Chiefs, Packers, 49ers, Cowboys, Colts, Broncos, and Ravens. So top 2 we’re good. Upgrade needed at #3. Now I know Crowder can play, but he’s like Beasley. A slot only guy.

 

Bills - Stefon Diggs, Gabe Davis, Jake Kumerow

 

Bucs - Mike Evans, Chris Godwin, Julio Jones/Russel Gage

 

Chiefs - JuJu Smith Schuster, Marquez Valdes-Scantling, Mecole Hardman, 

 

Packers - Adam Lazar, Sammy Watkins, Christian Watson

 

Rams - Cooper Kupp, Allen Robinson, Van Jefferson

 

Chargers - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Josh Palmer

 

49ers - Deebo Samuel, Brandon Aiyuk, Danny Gray

 

Cowboys - Ceedee Lamb, Michael Gullup, Jalen Tolbert

 

Colts - Michael Pittman, Alec Pierre, Paris Campbell

 

Broncos - Cortland Sutton, Jerry Juedy, Tim Patrick 

 

Ravens - Rashod Bateman, Devin Duevernay, James Proche

 

Bengals - JaMarr Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd

 

Agree there are a group of teams where I would take our 1-2 over theirs - Ravens, Broncos, Colts, Cowboys, Packers, Chiefs. 

 

But the only team where Kumerow is comparable to their #3 is Baltimore where Proche is there for his ST ability as a returner and Kumerow is mainly here for his ST ability as a gunner. Watson, Gray and Tolbert are obviously rookies. Man it upsets me still seeing Tolbert on the Cowboys. He went 1 pick before us. I doubt the Bills were interested in him because if they were surely they'd have traded up, but man I love that kid. I think he is gonna be really good. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Agree there are a group of teams where I would take our 1-2 over theirs - Ravens, Broncos, Colts, Cowboys, Packers, Chiefs. 

 

But the only team where Kumerow is comparable to their #3 is Baltimore where Proche is there for his ST ability as a returner and Kumerow is mainly here for his ST ability as a gunner. Watson, Gray and Tolbert are obviously rookies. Man it upsets me still seeing Tolbert on the Cowboys. He went 1 pick before us. I doubt the Bills were interested in him because if they were surely they'd have traded up, but man I love that kid. I think he is gonna be really good. 

He would’ve been a perfect developmental WR but LB was also weak at depth. He’s the one player I look at and wonder about. Also in 2021 instead of 2 DEs early maybe a WR to develop.

 

If you look at that list though if they add someone like Breshard Perriman after cuts I think it’s a solid group.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Buffalo_Stampede

[FLFan]

48 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Let’s stop this bickering and actually look at the top Super Bowl contenders. Some of these WRs like Godwin, Allen, Kupp, and Smith-Schuster are going to run out the slot the majority of the time but can play all over.

 

The Bills definitely could use another WR, especially comparing to the league. That 3rd guy is weak. Top 2 guys I’m taking the Bills over Chiefs, Packers, 49ers, Cowboys, Colts, Broncos, and Ravens. So top 2 we’re good. Upgrade needed at #3. Now I know Crowder can play, but he’s like Beasley. A slot only guy.

 

Bills - Stefon Diggs, Gabe Davis, Jake Kumerow

 

Bucs - Mike Evans, Chris Godwin, Julio Jones/Russel Gage

 

Chiefs - JuJu Smith Schuster, Marquez Valdes-Scantling, Mecole Hardman, 

 

Packers - Adam Lazar, Sammy Watkins, Christian Watson

 

Rams - Cooper Kupp, Allen Robinson, Van Jefferson

 

Chargers - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Josh Palmer

 

49ers - Deebo Samuel, Brandon Aiyuk, Danny Gray

 

Cowboys - Ceedee Lamb, Michael Gullup, Jalen Tolbert

 

Colts - Michael Pittman, Alec Pierre, Paris Campbell

 

Broncos - Cortland Sutton, Jerry Juedy, Tim Patrick 

 

Ravens - Rashod Bateman, Devin Duevernay, James Proche

 

Bengals - JaMarr Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd

Kumerow is not the Bills number 3 WR.  That looks to be either Crowder or McKenzie at this point.  Kumerow is 6 or 7 in reality.  I get the point at outside depth and the choices made in DL vs WR investment people are trying to make but the situation is not as dire as some are making it out to be.  The Bills had excellent production from that number 3 spot last year and have the potential to be better there this year.  

 

If Hodgins, or Stevenson, or Shakir do not prove to be decent enough outside depth during camp then I would not be surprised at a depth signing late but that remains to be seen.  If the Bills lose Diggs for an extended period it will be trouble surely, but that is the same for any team on that above list, where none of the number threes listed has a chance of adequately replacing the number one guy.  The Bills have worked on making their offense more versatile this year as a priority.  We will have to see how that factors into the situation as well.  

[Buffalo_Stampede]

10 minutes ago, FLFan said:

Kumerow is not the Bills number 3 WR.  That looks to be either Crowder or McKenzie at this point.  Kumerow is 6 or 7 in reality.  I get the point at outside depth and the choices made in DL vs WR investment people are trying to make but the situation is not as dire as some are making it out to be.  The Bills had excellent production from that number 3 spot last year and have the potential to be better there this year.  

 

If Hodgins, or Stevenson, or Shakir do not prove to be decent enough outside depth during camp then I would not be surprised at a depth signing late but that remains to be seen.  If the Bills lose Diggs for an extended period it will be trouble surely, but that is the same for any team on that above list, where none of the number threes listed has a chance of adequately replacing the number one guy.  The Bills have worked on making their offense more versatile this year as a priority.  We will have to see how that factors into the situation as well.  

Oh I know. We choose quickness over height and length. At least the last 2/3 years. X and Z WRs tend to be taller and longer. We’ve done it with smaller WRs.
 

Knox can also lineup at the X and Z. If anything I would say he’d see more time split out wide with an injury. Top TEs like Kelce and Waller already do that. We could see more of this from Knox.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Buffalo_Stampede

[H2o]

This won't help Tommy Boy have time to get the ball to Julio if it turns out bad.

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/07/28/ryan-jensen-carted-off-the-field-with-knee-injury/

Quote

The Buccaneers may have a significant injury concern along their offensive line early in training camp. According to multiple reporters on the Bucs beat, center Ryan Jensen went down with an apparent lower left leg injury. He was down for a while as teammates took a knee when the cart came out. Jensen did not put much weight on his left leg as he was helped into the cart and driven off.

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

12 minutes ago, H2o said:

This won't help Tommy Boy have time to get the ball to Julio if it turns out bad.

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/07/28/ryan-jensen-carted-off-the-field-with-knee-injury/

 

How’s their center depth? 🤫

[ColoradoBills]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

How’s their center depth? 🤫

 

Robert Hainsey came in to replace Jensen at center after the injury. He was a third-round pick last year and appeared in nine games. He played 31 offensive snaps and 35 special teams snaps.

[NewEra]

I hate making KC threads, so I’ll drop it here.  Chiefs sign Carlos Dunlap.  
 

https://nfltraderumors.co/chiefs-signing-de-carlos-dunlap-for-one-year-up-to-8m/

 

eager to see what the minimum of this deal is worth.  

4 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

You can’t possibly believe they did everything they possibly could.… they took a CB,  RB, and LB with their first three picks. It was possible to take a WR or trade up/down for one with those picks? 
 

Give me a break. They didn’t because it wasn’t a priority. 
 

And you act like the defensive line rotation is a must… it’s a must because that’s how McD wants it and they chose that at the expense of other positions… namely offensive starters/depth.

Which WRs would you have taken in rd 1, 2 or 3 based on how the draft fell?

[Chicken Boo]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Let’s stop this bickering and actually look at the top Super Bowl contenders. Some of these WRs like Godwin, Allen, Kupp, and Smith-Schuster are going to run out the slot the majority of the time but can play all over.

 

The Bills definitely could use another WR, especially comparing to the league. That 3rd guy is weak. Top 2 guys I’m taking the Bills over Chiefs, Packers, 49ers, Cowboys, Colts, Broncos, and Ravens. So top 2 we’re good. Upgrade needed at #3. Now I know Crowder can play, but he’s like Beasley. A slot only guy.

 

Bills - Stefon Diggs, Gabe Davis, Jake Kumerow

 

Bucs - Mike Evans, Chris Godwin, Julio Jones/Russel Gage

 

Chiefs - JuJu Smith Schuster, Marquez Valdes-Scantling, Mecole Hardman, 

 

Packers - Adam Lazar, Sammy Watkins, Christian Watson

 

Rams - Cooper Kupp, Allen Robinson, Van Jefferson

 

Chargers - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Josh Palmer

 

49ers - Deebo Samuel, Brandon Aiyuk, Danny Gray

 

Cowboys - Ceedee Lamb, Michael Gullup, Jalen Tolbert

 

Colts - Michael Pittman, Alec Pierre, Paris Campbell

 

Broncos - Cortland Sutton, Jerry Juedy, Tim Patrick 

 

Ravens - Rashod Bateman, Devin Duevernay, James Proche

 

Bengals - JaMarr Chase, Tee Higgins, Tyler Boyd

 

Solid post and I agree completely.  

 

Reports have the Rams really liking what they see from Robinson and sounds like McVay will be moving him around like they do with Kupp.  For me, that is the biggest and most underrated signing of the off-season. 

 

Allen Robinson is experiencing the same "unchaining" that Stafford did a season ago.  

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Too bad we didn’t land Jarvis Landry instead of Crowder. They said the Bills were in on it. He didn’t get much. 

1 minute ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

Solid post and I agree completely.  

 

Reports have the Rams really liking what they see from Robinson and sounds like McVay will be moving him around like they do with Kupp.  For me, that is the biggest and most underrated signing of the off-season. 

 

Allen Robinson is experiencing the same "unchaining" that Stafford did a season ago.  

Robinson is a legit Wr1. I don’t know how much better he is than a healthy Robert Woods, but they definitely won’t lose anything with Robinson.

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

 

Robinson is a legit Wr1. I don’t know how much better he is than a healthy Robert Woods, but they definitely won’t lose anything with Robinson.

 

Scheme agnostically (think I have invented a term) I think Robinson is an upgrade from Woods for sure. Woods was a perfect fit in that scheme and for how they used him though. 

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

I personally liked Pickens, Moore, and Tolbert… I would’ve loved to see Pickens here in the environment with Diggs and Allen. …but it doesn’t matter what I think… the Bills weren’t taking a WR high in this draft… it was common knowledge when McDermott basically said as much in February when talking about Gabe Davis.

 

The good news is I think they will take one high next year on the basis that they always seem to take the position I think they should have taken high one year high the next year..... 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

7 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

wouldn’t surprise me…. I think it will be more evident that WR is a need as the season evolves.

And why is that?

 

For me it’s a developmental need, future. 3-4 years down the road we need someone ready to step in.

 

You make it sound as if they will need an instant upgrade next year.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Buffalo_Stampede