Tiberius Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 4 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: FBI… Trump has been mostly accused of things, but never really proven guilty… And even the things he has been accused of, the Left has done those very things they accuse Trump of… I want consistency under the law… If Trump goes to jail, then so should Hillary and Biden at the very least… Well they get checked by DOJ, the courts and the media so... No, Trump is a criminal, but Hillary and Biden are not. See how that works?
JaCrispy Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 3 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Well they get checked by DOJ, the courts and the media so... No, Trump is a criminal, but Hillary and Biden are not. See how that works? While I do not know all of Trumps actions, it may be true that down the line he may be proven to have committed a crime… However, I disagree with that last statement…Hillary and Biden have been proven to have committed crimes, and have been protected by the Feds and media for years…Hillary with Benghazi and her emails, and Joe with his blackmailing of Ukraine to monetarily benefit him and his family… 1
Tiberius Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 2 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: While I do not know all of Trumps actions, it may be true that down the line he may be proven to have committed a crime… However, I disagree with that last statement…Hillary and Biden have been proven to have committed crimes, and have been protected by the Feds and media for years…Hillary with Benghazi and her emails, and Joe with his blackmailing of Ukraine to monetarily benefit him and his family… Bull sh it 1
ChiGoose Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 3 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: While I do not know all of Trumps actions, it may be true that down the line he may be proven to have committed a crime… However, I disagree with that last statement…Hillary and Biden have been proven to have committed crimes, and have been protected by the Feds and media for years…Hillary with Benghazi and her emails, and Joe with his blackmailing of Ukraine to monetarily benefit him and his family… What crimes have Biden and Hillary been proven to have committed?
JaCrispy Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Bull sh it If you follow media other than establishment news, you would know this to be true… FBI Director Comey even gave a press conference on all the criminal things Hillary did- but then said they chose not to charge her because “he” didn’t think a prosecutor would take the case…Lol Edited August 14, 2022 by JaCrispy
ChiGoose Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 3 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: If you follow media other than establishment news, you would know this to be true… You do know that the whole Biden - Ukraine thing is false, right? The prosecutor in question was pro-corruption, was not investigating Hunter, and removing him was not just US policy, but supported by our European allies.
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 13 hours ago, Niagara Bill said: Ghetto is not disrespectful. It accurately describes the policies of government that have created the class system, particularly the left. Give aways created this class, but your class must now have policies that undo the past 75 years of food stamps. The US is a very socialist country and the divide must be bridged, but you and trump will never be capable. Like you I do not do drugs, not even pot, but your 1/6 folks may, or maybe moonshine. In any regards Lenny, move off all the right wing nonsense and do something to unite. Whatever you’re going through, prayers up. This too shall pass.
JaCrispy Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 18 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: You do know that the whole Biden - Ukraine thing is false, right? The prosecutor in question was pro-corruption, was not investigating Hunter, and removing him was not just US policy, but supported by our European allies. That’s the Establishment narrative…And the Establishment stretches across the entire West, not just America… In 2015 The Guardian rated Ukraine the most corrupt nation in Europe…https://amp.theguardian.com/news/2015/feb/04/welcome-to-the-most-corrupt-nation-in-europe-ukraine That was roughly the same time the prosecutor was investigating corruption in the country, including Burisma, where Hunter Biden was on the Board (without any knowledge of the oil industry, I might add) Biden withholding the money wasn’t because the prosecutor was “pro corruption”, as the Establishment would want us to believe…But rather because an investigation by the prosecutor posed a threat to the business dealings that the Bidens, and the Western Establishment, in general, had going on in a corrupt Ukraine… Edited August 14, 2022 by JaCrispy
B-Man Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 Victor Davis Hanson On Trump Raid: ‘The FBI is Beyond Redemption’ by Mike LaChance The writer and historian Victor Davis Hanson is one of the most serious thinkers of our time. When he says something, people should listen. Following the raid on Trump’s Florida home, Hanson is saying that the FBI is beyond redemption. That it cannot and should not be saved in its current form. To hear Hanson saying this should alarm people. He is not the type of man who engages in outrageous talk. https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/08/victor-davis-hanson-trump-raid-fbi-beyond-redemption-video/ .
BillsFanNC Posted August 14, 2022 Author Posted August 14, 2022 14 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: That’s the Establishment narrative…And the Establishment stretches across the entire West, not just America… In 2015 The Guardian rated Ukraine the most corrupt nation in Europe…https://amp.theguardian.com/news/2015/feb/04/welcome-to-the-most-corrupt-nation-in-europe-ukraine That was roughly the same time the prosecutor was investigating corruption in the country, including Burisma, where Hunter Biden was on the Board (without any knowledge of the oil industry, I might add) Biden withholding the money wasn’t because the prosecutor was “pro corruption”, as the Establishment would want us to believe…But rather because an investigation by the prosecutor posed a threat to the business dealings that the Bidens, and the Western Establishment, in general, had going on in a corrupt Ukraine… You can keep showing this video... And they'll keep telling you but that's different.
ChiGoose Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 14 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: That’s the Establishment narrative…And the Establishment stretches across the entire West, not just America… In 2015 The Guardian rated Ukraine the most corrupt nation in Europe…https://amp.theguardian.com/news/2015/feb/04/welcome-to-the-most-corrupt-nation-in-europe-ukraine That was roughly the same time the prosecutor was investigating corruption in the country, including Burisma, where Hunter Biden was on the Board (without any knowledge of the oil industry, I might add) Biden withholding the money wasn’t because the prosecutor was “pro corruption”, as the Establishment would want us to believe…But rather because an investigation by the prosecutor posed a threat to the business dealings that the Bidens, and the Western Establishment, in general, had going on in a corrupt Ukraine… It’s the establishment narrative because it’s the truth. You are taking small bits of facts (Biden got the prosecutor fired and Hunter worked for Burisma) and connecting them with falsehoods. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/10/21/fact-check-joe-biden-leveraged-ukraine-aid-oust-corrupt-prosecutor/5991434002/ Ukraine had a ton of corruption but their prosecutor wasn’t doing much about it. The Obama administration and our European Allie’s wanted Shokin gone so that someone could come in and actually prosecute corruption. At that time, Hunter was not under investigation so removing the prosecutor would have no impact on him. If anything, it would increase the chances he would be investigated. Hunter seems like a real piece of crap, and if he broke the law he should pay for it, but this narrative about the Ukrainian prosecutor has no basis in reality.
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 7 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: That’s the Establishment narrative…And the Establishment stretches across the entire West, not just America… In 2015 The Guardian rated Ukraine the most corrupt nation in Europe…https://amp.theguardian.com/news/2015/feb/04/welcome-to-the-most-corrupt-nation-in-europe-ukraine That was roughly the same time the prosecutor was investigating corruption in the country, including Burisma, where Hunter Biden was on the Board (without any knowledge of the oil industry, I might add) Biden withholding the money wasn’t because the prosecutor was “pro corruption”, as the Establishment would want us to believe…But rather because an investigation by the prosecutor posed a threat to the business dealings that the Bidens, and the Western Establishment, in general, had going on in a corrupt Ukraine… Ja, I don’t recall folks suggesting what Biden did was criminal, or impeachment-worthy. The argument imo is that while Trump was being hounded for all sorts of issues that were reported on a second or third hand basis (something that continues to this day), Biden oafishly brags about shaking down an ally to bend them to his will. The larger point was that what happens everyday in Washington establishment circles suddenly became a major national crisis that stunned insiders. I agree with you about the establishment version of Biden’s actions, and the preposterous take that his son and his good fortune were completely incidental to the big picture. Bottom line….family members riding the coattails of their powerful relatives and getting special treatment is nothing new at all. Rs,Ds, Is all do it. 2
ChiGoose Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 1 minute ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Ja, I don’t recall folks suggesting what Biden did was criminal, or impeachment-worthy. The argument imo is that while Trump was being hounded for all sorts of issues that were reported on a second or third hand basis (something that continues to this day), Biden oafishly brags about shaking down an ally to bend them to his will. The larger point was that what happens everyday in Washington establishment circles suddenly became a major national crisis that stunned insiders. I agree with you about the establishment version of Biden’s actions, and the preposterous take that his son and his good fortune were completely incidental to the big picture. Bottom line….family members riding the coattails of their powerful relatives and getting special treatment is nothing new at all. Rs,Ds, Is all do it. Ok, so I literally just laid out why this is wrong and also not what the Left is saying but you went with a straw man anyway because it makes you feel good or whatever. At this point, I can’t tell if the Trumpists here are just acting in bad faith or have serious reading comprehension problems.
Doc Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 7 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: It’s the establishment narrative because it’s the truth. You are taking small bits of facts (Biden got the prosecutor fired and Hunter worked for Burisma) and connecting them with falsehoods. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/10/21/fact-check-joe-biden-leveraged-ukraine-aid-oust-corrupt-prosecutor/5991434002/ Ukraine had a ton of corruption but their prosecutor wasn’t doing much about it. The Obama administration and our European Allie’s wanted Shokin gone so that someone could come in and actually prosecute corruption. At that time, Hunter was not under investigation so removing the prosecutor would have no impact on him. If anything, it would increase the chances he would be investigated. Hunter seems like a real piece of crap, and if he broke the law he should pay for it, but this narrative about the Ukrainian prosecutor has no basis in reality. Yes and Burisma, a proven corrupt company, still survived and thrived and Ukraine was still incredibly corrupt and needed an election to vote-out the corrupt regime years later. If you bought that line, I've got beach front property to sell you for $1.
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 2 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Ok, so I literally just laid out why this is wrong and also not what the Left is saying but you went with a straw man anyway because it makes you feel good or whatever. At this point, I can’t tell if the Trumpists here are just acting in bad faith or have serious reading comprehension problems. You laid it all out? 😂 Check out the time stamp, and settle down Mr. AntsInpants. 1
B-Man Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 New Media Conspiracy Drops Surrounding Trump Raid, This Time About 'Surveillance Footage' https://redstate.com/bonchie/2022/08/14/new-media-conspiracy-drops-surrounding-trump-raid-this-time-about-surveillance-footage-n611995
JaCrispy Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 9 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Ok, so I literally just laid out why this is wrong and also not what the Left is saying but you went with a straw man anyway because it makes you feel good or whatever. At this point, I can’t tell if the Trumpists here are just acting in bad faith or have serious reading comprehension problems. How come anyone who disagrees with the Establishment is a Trumper or MAGA? The Establishment has been around long before Trump and will be around long after Trump… You don’t have to be a supporter of Trump to see what’s happening…Many progressives and liberals feel the same way- And they can’t stand Trump… But I know, I know- you need a name and a face to represent the opposition, regardless…This is why anyone who opposes the Establishment is called a Nazi or white supreacist, whether they are black or progressive…👍 3 1 2
Doc Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 3 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: How come anyone who disagrees with the Establishment is a Trumper or MAGA? The Establishment has been around long before Trump and will be around long after Trump… You don’t have to be a supporter of Trump to see what’s happening…Many progressives and liberals feel the same way- And they can’t stand Trump… But I know, I know- you need a name and a face to represent the opposition, regardless…This is why anyone who opposes the Establishment is called a Nazi or white supreacist, whether they are black or progressive…👍 Like I said before, it's the same playbook, just a different boogeyman. But this boogeyman will last for a long time, even years after his death. He broke them. 2 1
All_Pro_Bills Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, JaCrispy said: How come anyone who disagrees with the Establishment is a Trumper or MAGA? The Establishment has been around long before Trump and will be around long after Trump… You don’t have to be a supporter of Trump to see what’s happening…Many progressives and liberals feel the same way- And they can’t stand Trump… But I know, I know- you need a name and a face to represent the opposition, regardless…This is why anyone who opposes the Establishment is called a Nazi or white supreacist, whether they are black or progressive…👍 My observations of how the establishment functions and why it does what it does are based on a conclusion there are two Americas. One is the country. The other is the Empire. The country was established after the American Revolution. The Empire was established after WW2 when the US was the strongest and least impacted major country. This coincided with the Bretton Woods agreement that transferred the reserve currency role from the British Pound to the US dollar. The role of world empire was transferred along with the currency. This marked the origins of the establishment. While the official government serves the needs of the citizens the establishment serves to address the needs of the Empire. Political parties are irrelevant to the establishment. Being in one or the other doesn't automatically include or exclude anyone. But every 2 and 4 years politicians' campaign with promises and positions to sever the country but most of them when elected serve the empire and the establishment. As long as politicians serve the establishment they are looked upon as "patriots" and "virtuous". Anyone putting the needs of American the country before the needs of the Empire is labeled and isolationist or worse, an agent of foreign powers. The reason the establishment hates, and fears Trump is simple. It has nothing to do with a few boxes of documents and the forever excuse of "national security" or his role with 1/6. If he served the establishment these transgressions would be overlooked and brushed aside. But he's the only President to get elected since WW2 that has vowed to serve the interests of America the nation rather than the needs of America the Empire. America First. There it is! Not engage in foreign adventures not maintaining 300 military bases worldwide, not to defend the far reaches of the world and vital interest of elites and globalists. This American First threat must be eliminated through whatever means necessary. But the bigger threat to the establishment is the 80 million and growing number of citizens that view it as the problem. To address this threat the propaganda mill and the intelligence state run 24/7 demonizing anyone that dares to defy the empire. All Empires rise and fall and America's will be no different. My guess is what we've been experiencing the last 6+ years is the first couple innings of the falling process. Edited August 14, 2022 by All_Pro_Bills 1 1 1
JaCrispy Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 2 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said: My observations of how the establishment functions and why it does what it does are based on a conclusion there are two Americas. One is the country. The other is the Empire. The country was established after the American Revolution. The Empire was established after WW2 when the US was the strongest and least impacted major country. This coincided with the Bretton Woods agreement that transferred the reserve currency role from the British Pound to the US dollar. The role of world empire was transferred along with the currency. This marked the origins of the establishment. While the official government serves the needs of the citizens the establishment serves to address the needs of the Empire. Political parties are irrelevant to the establishment. Being in one or the other doesn't automatically include or exclude anyone. But every 2 and 4 years politicians' campaign with promises and positions to sever the country but most of them when elected serve the empire and the establishment. As long as politicians serve the establishment they are looked upon as "patriots" and "virtuous". Anyone putting the needs of American the country before the needs of the Empire is labeled and isolationist or worse, an agent of foreign powers. The reason the establishment hates, and fears Trump is simple. It has nothing to do with a few boxes of documents and the forever excuse of "national security" or his role with 1/6. If he served the establishment these transgressions would be overlooked and brushed aside. But he's the only President to get elected since WW2 that has vowed to serve the interests of America the nation rather than the needs of America the Empire. America First. There it is! Not engage in foreign adventures not maintaining 300 military bases worldwide, not to defend the far reaches of the world and vital interest of elites and globalists. This American First threat must be eliminated through whatever means necessary. But the bigger threat to the establishment is the 80 million and growing number of citizens that view it as the problem. To address this threat the propaganda mill and the intelligence state run 24/7 demonizing anyone that dares to defy the empire. All Empires rise and fall and America's will be no different. My guess is what we've been experiencing the last 6+ years is the first couple innings of the falling process. Absolutely! In addition, after WW2, the NSA and CIA were created, which in turn, created a “break away civilization” of federal bureaucracies that were not beholden to constitutional oversights and limitations…This is the beginning of what people today refer to as the Deep State… I also wonder if assassination of JFK and attempted assassination of Reagan were because they were not part of the Establishment?
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