BillsFanNC Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 Many democrats have stated in their own words that they want no restrictions on abortion.
ChiGoose Posted August 9, 2023 Author Posted August 9, 2023 9 minutes ago, Pokebball said: Seems to me the simple solution for you lefties is to take 3rd semester abortions off the table in policy. If it's a crock of BS like you say, why won't pro abortion folks simply agree? What do you suppose the reason to continue to fight against banning 'em is? Because right wingers like to pretend that the word “abortion” means elective abortion when that’s clearly not the case. The treatment for miscarriages and non-viable pregnancies is abortion. So banning third trimester abortions means telling people who want a baby but whose pregnancies are not viable that they have to deliver even if it risks their health and future fertility. The reason liberal oppose those laws is because those laws are stupid as hell and they trust the individuals to navigate that situation without the interference of the government.
Pokebball Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 20 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Because right wingers like to pretend that the word “abortion” means elective abortion when that’s clearly not the case. The treatment for miscarriages and non-viable pregnancies is abortion. So banning third trimester abortions means telling people who want a baby but whose pregnancies are not viable that they have to deliver even if it risks their health and future fertility. The reason liberal oppose those laws is because those laws are stupid as hell and they trust the individuals to navigate that situation without the interference of the government. Doesn't sound to me like it's BS then.
ChiGoose Posted August 9, 2023 Author Posted August 9, 2023 1 minute ago, Pokebball said: Doesn't sound to me like it's BS then. So if you or someone you know wants a baby and has been pregnant for 6+ months, only to find the pregnancy is not viable and the doctors recommend termination as the safest option, you think the government should intervene and force them to carry to term even if it makes them ill, results in infertility, or even risks their life?
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 7 hours ago, BillsFanNC said: Students attending commie training ground universities vote like commies? Well golly gee, and water is wet. Wait. Did't you write that you are a molecular biologist that sells tech to professors at prestigious Universities in NC? Do you call your customers commies to their face? How do you mask the contempt, anger and resentment? Why do MAGA's need to lie and cheat all the time? 1
All_Pro_Bills Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 9 hours ago, ChiGoose said: The whole third trimester abortions line is such a crock of BS. Bad faith actors like to pretend that the country is rife with people who are pregnant for 8 months without knowing whether or not they want a kid. Third trimester abortions are people who want a kid, probably have a room made and name picked out, but then end up getting devastating news that their pregnancy isn’t viable. You can think up a host of scenarios such as the one above that any reasonable person, meaning the majority of Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, would agree with but defining a specific set of "rules" around abortion for what is and isn't allowed and passing legislation isn't the problem. The problem is an issue resolved is no longer an issue. The political parties get lots of mileage out of pro and anti abortion positions and rhetoric. And eliminating that rallying cry issue from the political landscape by Federally legislating a solution would deprive politicians of valuable political capital. What politicians and many organizations on both sides of the debate that enjoy social influence while making a decent living prefer is an endless debate on pro-life and pro-choice which is what we've got.
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 18 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: You can think up a host of scenarios such as the one above that any reasonable person, meaning the majority of Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, would agree with but defining a specific set of "rules" around abortion for what is and isn't allowed and passing legislation isn't the problem. The problem is an issue resolved is no longer an issue. The political parties get lots of mileage out of pro and anti abortion positions and rhetoric. And eliminating that rallying cry issue from the political landscape by Federally legislating a solution would deprive politicians of valuable political capital. What politicians and many organizations on both sides of the debate that enjoy social influence while making a decent living prefer is an endless debate on pro-life and pro-choice which is what we've got. Red Ohio just proved it's not political capitol for R's. 1
B-Man Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 10 hours ago, ChiGoose said: Because right wingers like to pretend that the word “abortion” means elective abortion when that’s clearly not the case. The treatment for miscarriages and non-viable pregnancies is abortion. So banning third trimester abortions means telling people who want a baby but whose pregnancies are not viable that they have to deliver even if it risks their health and future fertility. The reason liberal oppose those laws is because those laws are stupid as hell and they trust the individuals to navigate that situation without the interference of the government. This has been disproven time and time again. Repeating it will not make it true. A miscarriage is a "spontaneous" abortion, the treatment for that is a D&C. Your "right wingers" are against surgical abortion after the baby is viable, you knew that. or perhaps in your warped mind you believe the nonsense about making miscarriages illegal. ALL, repeat ALL, pro-life laws being passed make an exception for non viable babies, how and when is left up to the woman and her doctor, not the democrat legislature. Your propaganda is transparent. . 1
ChiGoose Posted August 9, 2023 Author Posted August 9, 2023 2 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said: You can think up a host of scenarios such as the one above that any reasonable person, meaning the majority of Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, would agree with but defining a specific set of "rules" around abortion for what is and isn't allowed and passing legislation isn't the problem. The problem is an issue resolved is no longer an issue. The political parties get lots of mileage out of pro and anti abortion positions and rhetoric. And eliminating that rallying cry issue from the political landscape by Federally legislating a solution would deprive politicians of valuable political capital. What politicians and many organizations on both sides of the debate that enjoy social influence while making a decent living prefer is an endless debate on pro-life and pro-choice which is what we've got. Nah, the problem is that the GOP is pushing a very unpopular position on the issue, and instead of moderating, is doubling down on it, even to the extent of trying to override the will of the people. The frustrating thing about the abortion issue is that if the GOP wanted to look at root causes (i.e. why people have abortions), they could push for policies to address those issues and the Dems would by and large support those policies. But the GOP opposes addressing the root causes of abortion and instead pushes unpopular laws that harm people. It makes it hard to believe that curbing abortions is really their goal. 1
Tiberius Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, B-Man said: This has been disproven time and time again. Repeating it will not make it true. A miscarriage is a "spontaneous" abortion, the treatment for that is a D&C. Your "right wingers" are against surgical abortion after the baby is viable, you knew that. or perhaps in your warped mind you believe the nonsense about making miscarriages illegal. ALL, repeat ALL, pro-life laws being passed make an exception for non viable babies, how and when is left up to the woman and her doctor, not the democrat legislature. Your propaganda is transparent. . You guys are sucking on a big time losing position you are stuck with. Losing on the issues, losing ground bigly demographically and nominating a criminal for president. You guys suck 1
ChiGoose Posted August 9, 2023 Author Posted August 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, B-Man said: ALL, repeat ALL, pro-life laws being passed make an exception for non viable babies, how and when is left up to the woman and her doctor, not the democrat legislature. . This is blatantly false.
B-Man Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: This is blatantly false. No it is not. Speaking as someone who has caught a 12 week old miscarriage in his hands from a patient in for something else. You cannot face the truth, it is not my problem. Edited August 9, 2023 by B-Man
BillsFanNC Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 More @ChiGoose hand waving BS... Multiple democrats when asked if they support ANY restrictions on third trimester abortions say unequivocally that they don't, to the King that means they are only talking about non viable pregnancies and situations where the mothers life is at risk.. The King!!! 1
ChiGoose Posted August 9, 2023 Author Posted August 9, 2023 Just now, B-Man said: No it is not. Speaking as someone who has caught a 12 week old miscarriage in his hands from a patient in for something else. You cannot face the truth, it is not my problem. The beginning of this thread cites several examples of people being denied care until their life is in danger because of these laws. Prior to the laws, the patient and doctor could decide to terminate the non-viable pregnancy. Now the government gets a say and they end up having to wait until the woman is sick enough to treat. Are you saying those are just fake news? Made up? 1
SoCal Deek Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: The beginning of this thread cites several examples of people being denied care until their life is in danger because of these laws. Prior to the laws, the patient and doctor could decide to terminate the non-viable pregnancy. Now the government gets a say and they end up having to wait until the woman is sick enough to treat. Are you saying those are just fake news? Made up? Goose, as I mentioned repeatedly when the Supreme Court’s decision came down, it’s going to take a bit of time to unwind the clock after decades of unfettered abortion. Unlike you I’m actually amazed at how LITTLE turmoil has resulted from this ‘sky is falling’ left-centric tantrum. Seems like the American public is figuring it out as they go. 1 1 2
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 23 minutes ago, B-Man said: Speaking as someone who has caught a 12 week old miscarriage in his hands from a patient in for something else. How is that a qualification to pontificate on abortion law? 16 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Goose, as I mentioned repeatedly when the Supreme Court’s decision came down, it’s going to take a bit of time to unwind the clock after decades of unfettered abortion. Unlike you I’m actually amazed at how LITTLE turmoil has resulted from this ‘sky is falling’ left-centric tantrum. Seems like the American public is figuring it out as they go. good thing you aren't kin to anyone in the early examples.
Pokebball Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 11 hours ago, ChiGoose said: So if you or someone you know wants a baby and has been pregnant for 6+ months, only to find the pregnancy is not viable and the doctors recommend termination as the safest option, you think the government should intervene and force them to carry to term even if it makes them ill, results in infertility, or even risks their life? Like I said, it doesn't sound like its BS as you represented 1
All_Pro_Bills Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 26 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Nah, the problem is that the GOP is pushing a very unpopular position on the issue, and instead of moderating, is doubling down on it, even to the extent of trying to override the will of the people. The frustrating thing about the abortion issue is that if the GOP wanted to look at root causes (i.e. why people have abortions), they could push for policies to address those issues and the Dems would by and large support those policies. But the GOP opposes addressing the root causes of abortion and instead pushes unpopular laws that harm people. It makes it hard to believe that curbing abortions is really their goal. What else is the DNC going to base their 2024 campaign strategy on other than protecting abortion rights and the dangers of white supremacist MAGA extremists and systemic racism? Other than that, what else they got?
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