Simms Concludes his top 40 qb's. Allen top dog.

[Patrick Duffy]

37 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I imagine a great deal.

Either way, can't really argue but so much with anyone that puts Allen #1 

[Warcodered]

 

[GoBills808]

44 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Either way, can't really argue but so much with anyone that puts Allen #1 

Not really sure what you're saying, sorry.

[Thurman#1]

11 hours ago, mannc said:

Simms is not real high on Josh’s supporting cast on offense…I tend to agree, and think many here overrate our offensive weapons. Josh makes them look better than they really are…

 

 

I think he really underestimated them. Took him till near the end to even mention Knox. I think he underestimates Knox and Davis.

 

Yeah, Josh does make them look better. So do the other top ten QBs do the same to their offensive weapons. IMO we're going to see a major dip in production for the cheetah this year for example.

[Thurman#1]

2 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Your missing the point… the offense without Allen and with Keenum would struggle to be middling IMO…. They lack depth offensively and will be in “Josh has to do everything” mode with a couple injuries due to that lack of depth…. Find it funny people are clamoring for Tavon Austin to make the roster and see playing time. 😅

 

And you saw in Brady’s last year in NE him fall off due to the ***** receivers they put around him.

 

 

I think some people forgot that stretch of pretty damn bad offensive play last season against Indy, Jax, and NE….

 

 

Oh, please.

 

Where was the Stefon Diggs on that New England team? Even their TEs were crap.

 

There is no comparison between the 2019 NE groups of receivers and pass catchers and this year's Bills group.

 

Our skill position guys outside QB aren't top three. But they're well above middling.

 

 

 

Edited June 16, 2022 by Thurman#1

[mannc]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

I think he really underestimated them. Took him till near the end to even mention Knox. I think he underestimates Knox and Davis.

 

Yeah, Josh does make them look better. So do the other top ten QBs do the same to their offensive weapons. IMO we're going to see a major dip in production for the cheetah this year for example.

Knox and Davis have a lot of potential, but neither is a proven, top level player yet.  It’s reasonable to think one or both will break out this year, but it’s far from a certainty.

[Thurman#1]

Just now, mannc said:

Knox and Davis have a lot of potential, but neither is a proven, top level player yet.  It’s reasonable to think one or both will break out this year, but it’s far from a certainty.

 

Disagree. Knox is probably a top ten TE right now.

 

And Davis near the end of the year was starting to look like a good #2.

 

Top five? Nah, you're clearly right if that's what you meant by "top level."

[eball]

10 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Your missing the point… the offense without Allen and with Keenum would struggle to be middling IMO…. They lack depth offensively and will be in “Josh has to do everything” mode with a couple injuries due to that lack of depth…. Find it funny people are clamoring for Tavon Austin to make the roster and see playing time. 😅

 

And you saw in Brady’s last year in NE him fall off due to the ***** receivers they put around him.

 

 

I think some people forgot that stretch of pretty damn bad offensive play last season against Indy, Jax, and NE….

 

I think when you bring up the first BUF-NE game last season as evidence of anything offensively you’ve lost a good bit of credibility.

 

I get it.  You’re the contrarian, the worrier, the guy making sure we all know the house of cards could collapse at any moment.  It’s what you do.

 

Josh Allen may be the best QB in the game.  To suggest it’s a “problem” that he elevates his teammates and sometimes single-handedly leads his team to victories is pretty funny.  It’s fine, you and others can bemoan the “middling” playmakers the Bills have while most outside observers disagree.

 

You be you.

 

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

10 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Your missing the point… the offense without Allen and with Keenum would struggle to be middling IMO…. They lack depth offensively and will be in “Josh has to do everything” mode with a couple injuries due to that lack of depth…. Find it funny people are clamoring for Tavon Austin to make the roster and see playing time. 😅

 

And you saw in Brady’s last year in NE him fall off due to the ***** receivers they put around him.

 

 

I think some people forgot that stretch of pretty damn bad offensive play last season against Indy, Jax, and NE….

I'm with you that I wish they had prioritized stocking up at WR more than they did but "they'd be middling with Case Keenum playing all year" is a weird way to go about saying that.

 

Case Keenum at QB is a crappy situation. To say they'd be average with a low-end starting quarterback is a huge compliment to everyone involved.

 

In your scenario everyone around Keenum is so good that they elevate him.

 

In the modern NFL you're supposed to lose when the other team has better quarterback play. QB is really, really important.

[Son of a K-Gun]

12 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I agree with much of what you said.........but "ok pass blocking"??

 

No.

 

The Bills OL was the worst pass blocking unit in the NFL in terms of pressures and sacks allowed.

 

That's why they had to turn him into Mike Alstott 2.0 down the stretch to get into the playoffs.

 

Uhm, Buffalo actually allowed the second fewest sacks in the NFL last season with 27 (Tampa allowed 23) and they were tied for second with KC in sack % at 4%.  Granted this is as much (or more) a Josh Allen stat as it is an OL stat, but your statement that "The Bills OL was the worst pass blocking unit in the NFL in terms of pressures and sacks allowed" is simply false.  The pressure rate was not good at 25.5%, but they were 25th in league...bottom third but far from "worst".  The Bills were middle of the pack in pocket time at 2.4 seconds, so again not the best but by no means the worst.

 

Sorry, but I'm really not seeing the metrics you are using to say that the Bills OL was the worst pass blocking unit in the league.  Maybe your eye-test/bias is telling you something that isn't backed up by statistics?

 

[eball]

13 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Josh Allen’s #1 supporter in Chris Simms agrees with that sentiment… but either way, at this point they have Diggs, Knox and the inconsistent Gabe Davis…. I never put much stock into what the “outside observers” suggest. 

 

Yes, and folks on here immediately called him out on it.  I didn't even watch the segment because it doesn't interest me.  You think the Bills' offense sucks after Diggs and Knox and would plummet without Josh.  I think they're still probably a playoff team, just not dominant.  Hopefully we will never have to find out.

 

[JÂy RÛßeÒ]

I think the most accurate thing he talked about was actually Dorsey.  "One of the most under-the radar storylines of the NFL season.  I don't know what to expect.  This is first time in this position"

 

I think it's gonna take a while for anybody (including other teams) to know what to expect.

 

A little remiss to leave out Knox til the end.

Edited June 16, 2022 by JÂy RÛßeÒ

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

The crack team at OBD is on the job

 

 

 

And by crack team, I meant ON Crack

[YattaOkasan]

I was surpised he didnt bring up the pressure rate and sack rate numbers.  Thats a big reason I think josh does "more with less" than anyone else.

[Airseven]

Allen was so inconsistent last year. Couldn’t complete a pass against Jags, Jets. May be the most overrated player in the league. 

[YattaOkasan]

5 minutes ago, Airseven said:

Allen was so inconsistent last year. Couldn’t complete a pass against Jags, Jets. May be the most overrated player in the league. 

We should probably trade him for someone better.  Who you got in mind?

[Chandler#81]

On 6/15/2022 at 11:01 AM, gjv said:

It's interesting that Simms think Allen has the least support of any of the other top QB's. Claims Allen is asked to do more and carry the Bills Offense on his shoulders, not to mention his arm and legs. 

It’s no secret Offense is secondary to Defense with McBeane draft strategy. Our only other star player on O we traded for. We take D players #1 in the Draft -Hell, we took a LB #1 the same season we drafted Josh. I agree with Simms that Davis hasn’t proven enough to be considered very good. He couldn’t even break the starting lineup last year. Crowder? Howard?? Gimme a break. A hodgepodge of afterthoughts on the OLine hasn’t changed since McDermott arrived. Faces have, quality hasn’t.

[Thurman#1]

27 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

It’s no secret Offense is secondary to Defense with McBeane draft strategy. Our only other star player on O we traded for. We take D players #1 in the Draft -Hell, we took a LB #1 the same season we drafted Josh. I agree with Simms that Davis hasn’t proven enough to be considered very good. He couldn’t even break the starting lineup last year. Crowder? Howard?? Gimme a break. A hodgepodge of afterthoughts on the OLine hasn’t changed since McDermott arrived. Faces have, quality hasn’t.

 

 

First, we don't have only one other star player on offense. Only one other top five at his position? OK, fair enough. But Knox is top ten, as is Dawkins. As was Beasley before he regressed, shown by his All-Pro year.

 

And the evidence doesn't show that the offense is secondary to the defense in the draft. It could just as easily be that they're going BPA. Out of 18 players picked by this FO in the first three rounds, nine were on offense. And those numbers only look that even if you leave out the 1st rounder we traded for Diggs. Include it as you should, and this FO has used picks from the first three rounds to select 10 players on offense and 9 on defense.

 

And yes, they traded for Diggs. They traded a draft pick. Not a player. Like it or not they acquired Diggs with a pick, not a player-for-player deal.

 

And while there certainly are some afterthoughts on the OL, Dawkins and Morse are both quality player, and while Ford certainly hasn't been good, he wasn't an afterthought, he was a 2nd round pick. Nor is Saffold an afterthought.

 

You're spinning like a dervish.

 

Davis "couldn't even make the starting lineup last year," you say. More spin. He started several games, including the last three.

 

They're far from the be-all and end-all, but PFF had Davis as one of their top 101 players last year. Not receivers, players. Specifically #93. They said, "Davis began the season buried on the Bills depth chart and was barely a factor for most of the year. But the more the team used him, the bigger an impact he made. His season culminated with an absolute destruction of the Kansas City secondary, where he caught eight of the 10 passes thrown his way for 201 yards and four touchdowns. He caught 11 touchdowns from only 74 targets, with passes thrown his way generating an absurd passer rating of 131.3."

 

That is probably too high, but they're right that he's a good player, likely a good solid #2.

 

 

 

 

 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

Both Davis and Knox look like breakout candidates for this upcoming season. The talent is there. They just need to get the snaps and targets consistently. If I had to pick one to breakout it would be Davis. His snap count and targets should double maybe even more than double. Knox probably won't see more snaps but may see more targets, but not as big of a jump as Davis will see.

[gobills404]

1 minute ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

Both Davis and Knox look like breakout candidates for this upcoming season. The talent is there. They just need to get the snaps and targets consistently.

You are 100% correct