Bi-Partisan Gun Safety Reform Reached By Senators

[B-Man]

 

 

Actual information.

 

 

(Opinion)

 

I want to be fair here because, in a vacuum, most of those measures are not objectionable. I believe there’s ample evidence that red flag laws are largely useless and exist to make people feel better, not actually prevent mass casualty events. We’d also need a lot more details on what “deeper checks” means.

 

Overall, though, if this bill truly doesn’t include any actual anti-gun policies (i.e. bans and confiscation), that makes it far more palatable, even if I think a few of the measures are ineffective. The red flag laws will apparently remain at the state level, and they can be challenged in court if necessary. I don’t really have a problem with deeper background checks either, as long as that doesn’t translate to “universal background checks” being used as a national gun registry. Gun dealers do actually need more information, including juvenile and mental health records, when selling guns.

 

 

Further, I doubt anyone is against funding for mental health and school security, since those have been the two chief alternatives to gun control offered by conservatives, with me among that number.

 

Given all that, why do I still say Republicans are being suckers here? To clarify, it’s not because of anything specifically in this bill, assuming the reporting on what’s in it is accurate. Rather, I think the GOP is walking into a trap because they have done nothing to assert that this bill is the end of the road.

 

Here’s the thing. There is going to be another mass shooting. No matter how many laws we pass, evil people will get their hands on the tools necessary to commit evil acts. When that mass shooting occurs, Democrats are going to scream about how the last “gun safety” bill wasn’t enough and how we must “do something.”

 

That “do something” will include confiscation and outright bans on common weaponry. By compromising now without laying a marker down they are willing to stand by, they are simply handing Democrats the leverage to take the whole pie the next time around.

 

 

https://redstate.com/bonchie/2022/06/12/republicans-prepare-to-play-the-sucker-after-gun-safety-bill-is-revealed-n577646

 

 

 

[Tiberius]

 

[B-Man]

 

 

Senate Gun Deal Looks OK 

by John Hinderaker

 

A bipartisan group of senators have announced an agreement on gun legislation. I am not sure whether their deal has been reduced to legislative language, and I don’t know whether it will get through the Senate, or whether Democrats in the House will vote for it. (If I were a Democrat, I would think that the deal is extremely weak, and its main effect may be to take gun control off the table in November.)

 

As summarized by the senators’ press release (link above), the deal sounds pretty good to me. There is no foolishness about “assault weapons.” It includes a focus on mental health, recognizing the fact that our country is essentially without a mental health care system since the institutions were emptied and closed several decades ago:

 

 

More at the link: https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2022/06/senate-gun-deal-looks-ok.php

 

 

.

[Doc]

Something needs to be done.

[Irv]

15 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

He’s very much on edge lately. Lots of name calling and rage. I hope he’s okay. I’ve asked, but all you get as a response lately is more and more hate. 

 

He overbleached his taint.  What a mess.  

[reddogblitz]

18 hours ago, B-Man said:

That “do something” will include confiscation and outright bans on common weaponry. By compromising now without laying a marker down they are willing to stand by, they are simply handing Democrats the leverage to take the whole pie the next time around.

 

 

I could see another "assault rifle" ban passed by congress at some point.  But how would "confiscation" work?  House to house search?

 

This is a NRA canard.  And it works.  They're going to take away our guns.  Quick, go buy some more before they do. 

 

Works every time.  Don't fall for it.

Edited June 14, 2022 by reddogblitz

[Doc Brown]

17 hours ago, B-Man said:

 

 

Senate Gun Deal Looks OK 

by John Hinderaker

 

A bipartisan group of senators have announced an agreement on gun legislation. I am not sure whether their deal has been reduced to legislative language, and I don’t know whether it will get through the Senate, or whether Democrats in the House will vote for it. (If I were a Democrat, I would think that the deal is extremely weak, and its main effect may be to take gun control off the table in November.)

 

As summarized by the senators’ press release (link above), the deal sounds pretty good to me. There is no foolishness about “assault weapons.” It includes a focus on mental health, recognizing the fact that our country is essentially without a mental health care system since the institutions were emptied and closed several decades ago:

 

 

More at the link: https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2022/06/senate-gun-deal-looks-ok.php

 

 

.

This is where it doesn't go far enough but I'll take anything at this point.

 

Under 21 Enhanced Review Process

● For buyers under 21 years of age, requires an investigative period to review juvenile and mental health records, including checks with state databases and local law enforcement.

 

Not much of a chance for a criminal record when you're a minor.  Raise the age to purchase a gun of any kind to 21 and then do a thorough review for gun purchases.    That seems to be the new adulthood age anyways as you can't even legally have a beer until then.  Make an exception for those under 21 who join the military who are trained on how to use a weapon.  

[SoCal Deek]

4 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

This is where it doesn't go far enough but I'll take anything at this point.

 

Under 21 Enhanced Review Process

● For buyers under 21 years of age, requires an investigative period to review juvenile and mental health records, including checks with state databases and local law enforcement.

 

Not much of a chance for a criminal record when you're a minor.  Raise the age to purchase a gun of any kind to 21 and then do a thorough review for gun purchases.    That seems to be the new adulthood age anyways as you can't even legally have a beer until then.  Make an exception for those under 21 who join the military who are trained on how to use a weapon.  

I couldn’t agree more. Just raise the age to 21…no exceptions. It takes virtually no government oversight. We already did that for purchasing alcohol in my lifetime and WAY MORE people drink alcohol than own a gun. (And no exception for the military. Heck they’ll generally be 21 within a few weeks of getting out anyway.)

[ArdmoreRyno]

8 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

I could see another "assault rifle" ban passed by congress at some point.  But how would "confiscation" work?  House to house search?

 

This is a NRA canard.  And it works.  They're going to take away our guns.  Quick, go buy some more before they do. 

 

Works every time.  Don't fall for it.

 

Would NEVER happen for several reasons. First, most sheriff departments would never do that... where I'm from (Oklahoma) the vast majority of sheriff's wrote letters to newspapers (pretty much said the same thing) that they would never do anything to take away our 2A rights, including confiscation of any firearm. The bigger problem, you could see another civil war with the idea of anyone coming door-to-door to take away the 25-30,000,000 'type of gun' they they deem illegal. MANY people would never hand over their firearms. 

[Niagara Bill]

All just smoke and mirrors. Little chance it stops violent acts like we gave seen.

Drugs and gangs need to be faced up to if any gun legislation is to have an effect. Restrictions just makes money for gangs and gun shows. 

Cannot fix one problem with out solving them all.

[SoCal Deek]

You pass all the legislation you want but until you attack the root cause of the gun violence you’re only swatting at flies. 

[ArdmoreRyno]

2 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

You pass all the legislation you want but until you attack the root cause of the gun violence you’re only swatting at flies. 

 

AMEN

[Andy1]

I think the proposed legislation took a good approach to this issue. It focused on preventing people who shouldn’t have weapons from getting them. I’d be fine with raising the age to 21, but enhance background checks is the right direction. I suspect that people on both sides won’t be happy, but that’s a good sign. While it won’t stop all mass killing events, if it stops just a few, it will be worth it. 
 

Bans on assault weapons won’t work. I would support expanded government buy back programs to get unwanted guns out of peoples homes and off the street. 

[LeGOATski]

10 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

You pass all the legislation you want but until you attack the root cause of the gun violence you’re only swatting at flies. 

This legislation seems like an attempt to do that. Where this path leads, who knows.

[SoCal Deek]

7 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

This legislation seems like an attempt to do that. Where this path leads, who knows.

The root cause of gun violence is not guns. (And I always mention when I post in these threads that I’m not a gun owner.)

[Irv]

I love the way these morons point their finger at the NRA.  Guess what.  The NRA is made up of American citizens.  Five million of them.  And just like AARP, they are backed by big corporations and they are in the ass of every crooked politician in DC.  Does anybody ***** on AARP?  What a mess.  

 

 

Edited June 15, 2022 by Irv

[T master]

On 6/12/2022 at 3:32 PM, Tiberius said:

I expect people on the internet to know how to use the internet. 

 

You don't think it's idiotic to ask about something they can easily reference for themselves? Yes or no? 

 

It's almost as idiotic as always asking a question to end a reply ... 

Edited June 15, 2022 by T master

[Tiberius]

31 minutes ago, Irv said:

I love the way these morons point their finger at the NRA.  Guess what.  The NRA is made up of American citizens.  Five million of them.  And just like AARP, they are backed by big corporations and they are in the ass of every crooked politician in DC.  Does anybody ***** on AARP?  What a mess.  

 

 

Yup, just like the ACLU, supported by millions of Americans 

[T master]

On 6/13/2022 at 8:14 AM, B-Man said:

 

 

Actual information.

 

 

(Opinion)

 

I want to be fair here because, in a vacuum, most of those measures are not objectionable. I believe there’s ample evidence that red flag laws are largely useless and exist to make people feel better, not actually prevent mass casualty events. We’d also need a lot more details on what “deeper checks” means.

 

Overall, though, if this bill truly doesn’t include any actual anti-gun policies (i.e. bans and confiscation), that makes it far more palatable, even if I think a few of the measures are ineffective. The red flag laws will apparently remain at the state level, and they can be challenged in court if necessary. I don’t really have a problem with deeper background checks either, as long as that doesn’t translate to “universal background checks” being used as a national gun registry. Gun dealers do actually need more information, including juvenile and mental health records, when selling guns.

 

 

Further, I doubt anyone is against funding for mental health and school security, since those have been the two chief alternatives to gun control offered by conservatives, with me among that number.

 

Given all that, why do I still say Republicans are being suckers here? To clarify, it’s not because of anything specifically in this bill, assuming the reporting on what’s in it is accurate. Rather, I think the GOP is walking into a trap because they have done nothing to assert that this bill is the end of the road.

 

Here’s the thing. There is going to be another mass shooting. No matter how many laws we pass, evil people will get their hands on the tools necessary to commit evil acts. When that mass shooting occurs, Democrats are going to scream about how the last “gun safety” bill wasn’t enough and how we must “do something.”

 

That “do something” will include confiscation and outright bans on common weaponry. By compromising now without laying a marker down they are willing to stand by, they are simply handing Democrats the leverage to take the whole pie the next time around.

 

 

https://redstate.com/bonchie/2022/06/12/republicans-prepare-to-play-the-sucker-after-gun-safety-bill-is-revealed-n577646

 

 

 

 

I wouldn't have any problem with making new laws but if a politician is involved which they always are usually there is little or no common sense involved in the thought process & then there is the fact that no matter what a politician will most genuinely abuse a law for their own agenda or purpose .

 

There were a ton of evidence that the kid in Uvalde was a lose cannon and just waiting to go off so there were plenty of red flags but what was done to look into his past and stop him .

 

To add to that i have a family member that is a cop & has had training in the field for the same type of situation that happened in Uvalde with a active shooter & he said that in that situation he has always been taught to run toward gun fire to do what ever needs done to stop the shooter .

 

This being my opinion for that many cops to sit for over 45 minutes and not do any thing in some way shape or form to stop that maniac was totally chicken S**T on their part especially seeing as there were children involved & the 911 calls plus gun fire but that's just me . And i'm sure the OP will disagree in some way .

 

There is plenty of blame to go around but those always pushing for more gun laws will be all over anything like a tragedy of this proportion to blame the guns & not the true cause being the maniac's that pull the trigger .

 

But if this law is filled with common sense & will stop any tragedy like this from happening again in the future i'm all for it !! 

 

[Niagara Bill]

12 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

This legislation seems like an attempt to do that. Where this path leads, who knows.

I think the path is short and only smoke screen. There are cultural issues and extremely huge crime issues that are the root causes.