PFF 10 top coaches...LOL

[GunnerBill]

13 hours ago, Doc said:

But no team has tried to hire him as their GM since so...

 

 

He has interviewed for 3 jobs, and been a finalist for two... so while I think it is safe to say his reputation isn't super high around the league it is higher than on this forum. 

[Mr. WEO]

11 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Wow, great, 1 winning season in Cleveland.  They went back to 5-11 the following year with the same guys...

 

So you're saying he didn't get lucky with Brady?

 

SO what?  They still made the playoffs with that crew.  After taking the Bills to the playoffs, McD went 6-10 the next year with #7 pick "raw" "prospect JA (with a #2 Defense).

 

Brady wasn't exactly fully formed as an NFL HOFer when Bellichick lucked into him was he doc?  You said BB could have won those first 3 SB with "half a dozen" other QBs---yet he won them with a "raw" prospect.  With the 199th pick and second year benchwarmer starting  NE won 11 games and then ran the table for a SB. 

7 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He has interviewed for 3 jobs, and been a finalist for two... so while I think it is safe to say his reputation isn't super high around the league it is higher than on this forum. 

 

 

It's likely box checking

[Mr. WEO]

6 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

SO what...if he made the playoffs one time in his 5 years in Cleveland (in his 4th year no less, when he more than enough time to get his players_ and then went back to being a losing coach?  

 

So you're agreeing with me that the first 3 SBs could have been won by a half dozen QBs?  Which is it?

 

He made it one time with an awful team in an awful organization.  Name "half a dozen" other HC's who get 11 games out of that lineup.

 

I'm disagreeing while simultaneously pointing out that you are contradicting yourself--claiming both that Brady was some mediocre QB that the genius of BB could have at least as much success with another such or better QB...and that BB's genius is the result of pure luck--in the form of one of a kind talent in Brady.

[Doc]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

He made it one time with an awful team in an awful organization.  Name "half a dozen" other HC's who get 11 games out of that lineup.

 

I'm disagreeing while simultaneously pointing out that you are contradicting yourself--claiming both that Brady was some mediocre QB that the genius of BB could have at least as much success with another such or better QB...and that BB's genius is the result of pure luck--in the form of one of a kind talent in Brady.

 

So you're saying that because he went 11-5 with a bad roster, in the 4th year of being a HC and when he had ample time to get his players, and then reverted back to a losing record...it proves he was good there?  OK.

 

And you're also contradicting yourself and agreeing with me if you're saying that it was mostly Belicheat and not Brady and that Belicheat could have won with other QBs.  Never mind the cheating...

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

So you're saying that because he went 11-5 with a bad roster, in the 4th year of being a HC and when he had ample time to get his players, and then reverted back to a losing record...it proves he was good there?  OK.

 

And you're also contradicting yourself and agreeing with me if you're saying that it was mostly Belicheat and not Brady and that Belicheat could have won with other QBs.  Never mind the cheating...

 

 

Is BB a great HC or "a great defensive coach" who "got lucky with Brady"?

[Doc]

47 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Is BB a great HC or "a great defensive coach" who "got lucky with Brady"?

 

Good question.  I guess we'll see over the next few years.

[FilthyBeast]

On 6/10/2022 at 10:57 AM, NewEra said:

So because of the way last year ended, you think McD may be incapable of winning a super bowl?  

 

Yes and I've been 100% transparent about that if anything because I feel the '13 seconds' debacle is a microcosm of his coaching shortcomings over his 5 year body of work in Buffalo.

 

Obviously I would love to be wrong and that may still happen but it's the 'attention to detail' so to speak that just isn't there with McDermott or his staff in crucial big moments despite JA17 now currently owning the highest passer rating in postseason history based on minimum attempts which is also very telling.

[ColoradoBills]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Is BB a great HC or "a great defensive coach" who "got lucky with Brady"?

 

Great defensive and special teams coach that got lucky with Brady.

Also add a mediocre GM who got lucky with Brady.

[NewEra]

15 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

Yes and I've been 100% transparent about that if anything because I feel the '13 seconds' debacle is a microcosm of his coaching shortcomings over his 5 year body of work in Buffalo.

 

Obviously I would love to be wrong and that may still happen but it's the 'attention to detail' so to speak that just isn't there with McDermott or his staff in crucial big moments despite JA17 now currently owning the highest passer rating in postseason history based on minimum attempts which is also very telling.

That stance, imo, says that coaches are stagnant and they are what they are.  That they cannot improve and make adjustments to better themselves.
 

 If you truly believe that McD will be the same coach 5 years from now as he is today, you’re greatly mistaken.  He’s improved immensely as a HC since 2017 imo.  I fully expect a man with his passion and drive to succeed to continue to improve and evolve.  The negative stain on your brain doesn’t allow you to see the obvious.  While he made a huge mistake and lost that game in the final 13 seconds, he’s been adapting year after year and improving as a HC.  

[Doc]

2 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

Yes and I've been 100% transparent about that if anything because I feel the '13 seconds' debacle is a microcosm of his coaching shortcomings over his 5 year body of work in Buffalo.

 

Obviously I would love to be wrong and that may still happen but it's the 'attention to detail' so to speak that just isn't there with McDermott or his staff in crucial big moments despite JA17 now currently owning the highest passer rating in postseason history based on minimum attempts which is also very telling.

 

Farwell screwed up the squib call by not telling Bass.  As for the defense during those last 13 seconds, I'll bet he left it up to Frazier and it bit him in the ass.  Hopefully he's learned from it. 

[Mr. WEO]

6 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Good question.  I guess we'll see over the next few years.

 

You have an opinion on this, was just trying to nail down which one it is.

 

6 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Great defensive and special teams coach that got lucky with Brady.

Also add a mediocre GM who got lucky with Brady.

 

How good was Brady in his first year off the bench?

[Doc]

58 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

You have an opinion on this, was just trying to nail down which one it is.

 

Likewise. 

[Mr. WEO]

12 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Likewise. 

 

No need to scratch your pate over this one.  You know my opinion. BB is the greatest HC in NFL history.  Brady is the GOAT.  

 

HOF HC's and QBs are occasionally found together for their careers. Most of the time, the QB is a top college QB, not a 6th round benchwarmer that the HC has to bring along...

 

 

[T master]

McD has a over .600 winning percentage & made it to the play offs the last 3 yrs while the AZ coach made it to the wild card game & got bounced yet Kingsbury is higher than McD yah that sounds about like this guy needs to put down the pipe before he writes his articles .

[CookieG]

On 6/8/2022 at 11:54 AM, SoTier said:

PFF likes to pretend that it's "objective"  but this list demonstrates that the group is hardly less biased than any group of knowledgeable NFL fans polled as to their choices as best coaches.   Ding, ding, PFF ... winning is important, winning playoff games is more important, and winning the Super Bowl is "priceless".  

 

Kliff Kingsbury has been HC of the Cards for 3 seasons in which his teams have gone 24-24-1 with 1 winning season, 1 playoff appearance, and 0 playoff wins.  His teams have demonstrated a tendency to start off hot and then tail off as the season progresses.   In 2019, the Cards started the season 3-3-1 and finished 2-7 (5-10-1).   In 2020, they started 5-2 and finished 3-6 (8-8).   In 2021, they started 7-0 and finished 4-6 (11-6).   They got soundly beaten 34-11 by the Rams in the WC round. 

 

How the hell can anyone claim that Kingsbury is currently the fourth best HC in the NFL behind three HCs destined for the HOF?   Good grief, Kingsbury isn't even as good as two HCs in his own division, Shanahan and McVay.  He's 3-3 versus the 49ers.   Shanahan has taken the 49ers to the NFC Championship twice and once to the Super Bowl in the 2 seasons that he's had Garropolo as his QB for most of the season.

 

Kingsbury is 1-6 against McVay's Rams, including the 2021  WC loss.   NFL HCs have significant influence over their team's roster, and it's disingenuous to penalize HCs who are good at talent evaluation and management because it's a key part of the job!  Both Kingsbury and McVay inherited losing squads.  Kingsbury got to hand pick his QB in Kyler Murray.  McVay inherited Jared Goff, and made the Super Bowl with him in his second season as HC.   McVay has been HC of Rams for 5 seasons in which his teams have gone 55-26 with 5 winning seasons, 4 double digit win seasons, 4 playoff appearances, 7 playoff wins in 10 games, 2 Super Bowl appearances and 1 Super Bowl win.    McVay is collecting HOF credentials.  Kingsbury may be job hunting in 2023 if the Cardinals suffer another second half of the season swoon.

Yeah, as soon as the article had Kingsbury at #4, you can stop reading. 

 

As they were getting blown out by the Rams in the playoffs, the network put up stats on his record after week 7, (both NFL and college) and it was striking.

 

 

 

As bad as Kyler Murray was playing in that game, I almost think they put it up to say, "Hey, this isn't all on Kyler Murray".  His second half of the season record isn't something that makes someone a great coach.  And most certainly not No. 4 in the NFL. 

 

Edited June 14, 2022 by CookieG

[Doc]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

No need to scratch your pate over this one.  You know my opinion. BB is the greatest HC in NFL history.  Brady is the GOAT.  

 

HOF HC's and QBs are occasionally found together for their careers. Most of the time, the QB is a top college QB, not a 6th round benchwarmer that the HC has to bring along...

 

So if he brought him along, that means that what I said about half a dozen QBs being able to win those first 3 SBs wasn't wrong, eh?  They just had to be willing to go along with all the cheating.  And I said that Brady became an elite passer in 2007 so yeah, he lucked into a HOF QB in the 6th round. 

[FilthyBeast]

On 6/13/2022 at 10:15 AM, NewEra said:

That stance, imo, says that coaches are stagnant and they are what they are.  That they cannot improve and make adjustments to better themselves.
 

 If you truly believe that McD will be the same coach 5 years from now as he is today, you’re greatly mistaken.  He’s improved immensely as a HC since 2017 imo.  I fully expect a man with his passion and drive to succeed to continue to improve and evolve.  The negative stain on your brain doesn’t allow you to see the obvious.  While he made a huge mistake and lost that game in the final 13 seconds, he’s been adapting year after year and improving as a HC.  

 

To be honest, we could fire McDermott in the next few years and then he follows his mentors path and wins a SB with his 2nd team.

 

Nobody really knows. I think what he does this year though after the KC debacle and how this organization moves on as a whole will be very telling in terms of what his future will be in Buffalo anyway.

22 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Farwell screwed up the squib call by not telling Bass.  As for the defense during those last 13 seconds, I'll bet he left it up to Frazier and it bit him in the ass.  Hopefully he's learned from it. 

 

Regarding Farwell - he should have been fired immediately to send a message, but he wasn't.

 

And if he truly left it up to Frazier that also raises questions many questions as well.

[Doc]

1 minute ago, FilthyBeast said:

Regarding Farwell - he should have been fired immediately to send a message, but he wasn't.

 

And if he truly left it up to Frazier that also raises questions many questions as well.

 

I don't think McD wanted to make a spectacle of the situation by firing Farwell and letting everyone know it was him.  So he let him leave quietly.

 

As for Frazier, if my hunch is correct (about calling the plays), I think McD did it to help him with HC'ing prospects.  Again I hope he's learned from both.

[FilthyBeast]

3 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I don't think McD wanted to make a spectacle of the situation by firing Farwell and letting everyone know it was him.  So he let him leave quietly.

 

As for Frazier, if my hunch is correct (about calling the plays), I think McD did it to help him with HC'ing prospects.  Again I hope he's learned from both.

 

I agree with this because if anything it seems to be McD's character.

 

But again, that's my biggest problem here. IMO you must send a clear message to the lockerroom and entire organization that type of mistake is simply unacceptable especially if you believe you could have went all the way to a championship like a lot of fans and media believe.

 

Either way it's over and done with now and agree that best we can hope for is McD learning and evolving going forward.

[Doc]

5 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

I agree with this because if anything it seems to be McD's character.

 

But again, that's my biggest problem here. IMO you must send a clear message to the lockerroom and entire organization that type of mistake is simply unacceptable especially if you believe you could have went all the way to a championship like a lot of fans and media believe.

 

Either way it's over and done with now and agree that best we can hope for is McD learning and evolving going forward.

 

I'm sure the team got the message when Farwell was, for all intents and purposes, fired.  Whether they would rather McD pin the blame on Farwell and fire him publicly, I have no idea.