Jim Kelly on the all time passing list

[Marlton Bills]

Jim Kelly currently sits at number 29 on the all time passing list. Had Fitzy played this year (or even most of last year) he likely would have passed him. Dalton is right behind him as well.  When I look at the list of top passers I marvel at Jim because he did it in 11 years. Has he played in 1983, 1984 and 1985, I always assume about another 10,000 yards. Do you all think that would be a reasonable amount of yards to add?  It would put him in the top 20. 

[LeGOATski]

Sure!

[Neo]

Add another 10,000 had he not played a decade with two touchdown leads and Thurman Thomas.   Kelly was a quarterback.   Marino was a passer.

[dollars 2 donuts]

50 minutes ago, Marlton Bills said:

Jim Kelly currently sits at number 29 on the all time passing list. Had Fitzy played this year (or even most of last year) he likely would have passed him. Dalton is right behind him as well.  When I look at the list of top passers I marvel at Jim because he did it in 11 years. Has he played in 1983, 1984 and 1985, I always assume about another 10,000 yards. Do you all think that would be a reasonable amount of yards to add?  It would put him in the top 20. 

 

i like sliding in his 11,000+ yards from the useless just to have a total profession yards cume that is slightly higher.

[Kirby Jackson]

Hot take: Kelly was a very good QB, not an elite QB. He belongs in the HOF because of his winning. He is in the Fouts/Moon/Aikman/Griese/Warner tier of HOF QBs not the Brady/Montana/Peyton/Elway/Marino tier.

 

 

[Marlton Bills]

23 minutes ago, Neo said:

Add another 10,000 had he not played a decade with two touchdown leads and Thurman Thomas.   Kelly was a quarterback.   Marino was a passer.

Interesting…I also think the length of qb careers has gotten ridiculously long because you can’t touch them. Guys like Kelly got the ***** kicked out of them and I think it would be impossible for them to pay 15-20 years.  Do you agree with Kirby’s hot take?

[Neo]

5 minutes ago, Marlton Bills said:

Interesting…I also think the length of qb careers has gotten ridiculously long because you can’t touch them. Guys like Kelly got the ***** kicked out of them and I think it would be impossible for them to pay 15-20 years.  Do you agree with Kirby’s hot take?

I agree with Kirby, but I’d drop Marino from his list.   Marino is not Brady, Montana, Payton, Elway …

[eball]

37 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Hot take: Kelly was a very good QB, not an elite QB. He belongs in the HOF because of his winning. He is in the Fouts/Moon/Aikman/Griese/Warner tier of HOF QBs not the Brady/Montana/Peyton/Elway/Marino tier.

 

 

I think it’s splitting hairs to a degree.  I do believe having Thurman for most of his career was a limiting factor on Kelly’s stats.  He was an elite thrower of the football and there was no QB tougher.  Great leader as well (at least on the field).

 

[Artful Dodger]

48 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Hot take: Kelly was a very good QB, not an elite QB. He belongs in the HOF because of his winning. He is in the Fouts/Moon/Aikman/Griese/Warner tier of HOF QBs not the Brady/Montana/Peyton/Elway/Marino tier.

 

 

 

This may be a bit unfair.  As we saw last year in several games, Buffalo weather is not kind to quarterbacks.  If he played in San Diego or Miami, he would have had a lot more passing yards.

[Kirby Jackson]

3 minutes ago, eball said:

 

I think it’s splitting hairs to a degree.  I do believe having Thurman for most of his career was a limiting factor on Kelly’s stats.  He was an elite thrower of the football and there was no QB tougher.  Great leader as well (at least on the field).

 

The flip side is that those elite weapons elevated him some. They did a ton after the catch. He was great and belongs in the HOF. If you include the guys not yet in though, I’m not sure if he is top 25 all-time. 

[Greg S]

Expect many of the greats to continue to drop in the standings (stats wise) now that we have a 17 game season which eventually will turn into an 18 game season. Assuming he stays healthy Allen will have every single Bills passing record and it won't be close. It will knock Kelly from #1 to #2 as the greatest Bills QB with Kemp and Ferguson dropping to #3 and #4 respectively on the Bills QB list.

[Kirby Jackson]

3 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

This may be a bit unfair.  As we saw last year in several games, Buffalo weather is not kind to quarterbacks.  If he played in San Diego or Miami, he would have had a lot more passing yards.

I’m not so much worried about the passing yards (although that’s a fair point). At the same time, a lot of the yards that he got were after the catch. Andre Reed is one of the best after the catch that I’ve ever seen. He wouldn’t have had that in SD or Miami. 
 

I’m not trashing him in any sense. I just think that we look at him, and history looks at him, as a more dominant player than he was. He was excellent. He belongs in the HOF. Kelly just isn’t in that special room in the HOF. FWIW, I think Allen has a chance to be in that room.

[DCofNC]

58 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Hot take: Kelly was a very good QB, not an elite QB. He belongs in the HOF because of his winning. He is in the Fouts/Moon/Aikman/Griese/Warner tier of HOF QBs not the Brady/Montana/Peyton/Elway/Marino tier.

 

 

Yep, I agree completely.  In todays world, I’d have him right there with a Matt Stafford, really good, but not in the conversation for “best”.

[uticaclub]

Look where he was when we retired, not now. When he played you could still kill QBs and take the heads of WRs. Different era

[Doc]

6 minutes ago, uticaclub said:

Look where he was when we retired, not now. When he played you could still kill QBs and take the heads of WRs. Different era

 

This.  Had Kelly been protected like QBs have since the early 2000s, he'd have played another 6-7 years.  And with the more wide open offenses, he would have racked up the stats.

[Greg S]

14 minutes ago, uticaclub said:

Look where he was when we retired, not now. When he played you could still kill QBs and take the heads of WRs. Different era

 

Good point. Back then defenses could play defense. Now we get the ref saying "15 yards for unnecessary giving him a mean look and making him cry call." I get player safety and trying to limit injuries but some of these "roughing" calls are BS.

[Albany,n.y.]

28 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

This.  Had Kelly been protected like QBs have since the early 2000s, he'd have played another 6-7 years.  And with the more wide open offenses, he would have racked up the stats.

Kelly was 37 when he retired.  No way he'd be playing at 43 or 44.  

[DCofNC]

49 minutes ago, uticaclub said:

Look where he was when we retired, not now. When he played you could still kill QBs and take the heads of WRs. Different era

This is ALWAYS a point to consider when talking stats.  The eras were so different.  It would have been fun to see Kelly in place of Warner with the Rams.   I feel like that would have been something special, it was a similar offense to the K-Gun, but in an era where passing started to take off.   The Rams even had a similar team make up in that time Bruce, Holt, Faulk would be the modern equivalent of Reed, Lofton, Thurman.  
 

In todays world, he would be putting up 4500+ yards a year without getting beat up, it would be different for sure.  I take nothing away from Kelly, but I still feel he was always in the “really good” category, not the “elite” group.  That said, I put most guys in that group.  To me, Brady has now officially created his own category, hate him, but nobody has done what he has done, period, end of discussion.  Then you have the All-Time Greats, the Montana, Marino, etc.  Then there are the HoF guys that we superb, that’s where I find Kelly, Aikmen, etc.   In context, I also see Rodgers in that group because of his proficiency of choking in the Playoffs.  Right now, there’s 3, maybe 4 guys in the league that even show me potential to be considered the elite, Maholmes, Allen, Burrow and Herbert, they all have to show sustained success to get anywhere near the real elite level.  Maholmes’ start of his career is insane, hate all you want, but what he has done in such a short time is incredible.  Allen looks to be catching up, but wins ultimately make a difference.  Burrow is one hell of a QB without all the athletic traits you would love and has also started out really hot.  Herbert , athletic freak, looks the part and has to make the team better, stats are eye popping.

[Greg S]

7 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

This is ALWAYS a point to consider when talking stats.  The eras were so different.  It would have been fun to see Kelly in place of Warner with the Rams.   I feel like that would have been something special, it was a similar offense to the K-Gun, but in an era where passing started to take off.   The Rams even had a similar team make up in that time Bruce, Holt, Faulk would be the modern equivalent of Reed, Lofton, Thurman.  
 

In todays world, he would be putting up 4500+ yards a year without getting beat up, it would be different for sure.  I take nothing away from Kelly, but I still feel he was always in the “really good” category, not the “elite” group.  That said, I put most guys in that group.  To me, Brady has now officially created his own category, hate him, but nobody has done what he has done, period, end of discussion.  Then you have the All-Time Greats, the Montana, Marino, etc.  Then there are the HoF guys that we superb, that’s where I find Kelly, Aikmen, etc.   In context, I also see Rodgers in that group because of his proficiency of choking in the Playoffs.  Right now, there’s 3, maybe 4 guys in the league that even show me potential to be considered the elite, Maholmes, Allen, Burrow and Herbert, they all have to show sustained success to get anywhere near the real elite level.  Maholmes’ start of his career is insane, hate all you want, but what he has done in such a short time is incredible.  Allen looks to be catching up, but wins ultimately make a difference.  Burrow is one hell of a QB without all the athletic traits you would love and has also started out really hot.  Herbert , athletic freak, looks the part and has to make the team better, stats are eye popping.

 

As far as QB's go its going to be really fun watching the AFC this year. Aside from Bills games I am looking forward to watching the AFCW this year. Mahomes, Herbert, Wilson, and Carr. Those divisional games are going to be exciting.

[Matt_In_NH]

He had a short NFL career due to the USFL start and probably a little too much partying/not enough attention to nutrition.  Comparing stats from a  a guy today like Fitz to guys from a previous era should not be done straight up.  Guys from the 70s and 80s would be terrible if they had the stats today they did then.  It has been 39 years since Kelly was drafted.