95yo Former Vikes Coach- Rule Change Ideas

[Mr. WEO]

8 hours ago, Doc said:

Not that I would want this either, but how about just eliminating the kneel-down?  Make teams have to run a real play.

 

7 hours ago, RyanC883 said:

 

just had it off to a big back, or run a screen play, etc.  

 

 

 

What would be the point of any of this?

[frostbitmic]

14 hours ago, Dan Darragh said:

The kneel down has never struck me as one of football's glaring problems screaming for a solution.

 

However, when it comes to rule changes that ruined the game, the worst-ever may be the "tackle box" rule.  I don't know why they ever made this rule except to give a competitive advantage to the offense.  I say intentional grounding is intentional grounding.

 

Wow, I've kept that inside for a long time.  What a relief!

Spiking the ball to stop the clock should be intentional grounding as well ...

A. The QB is between the tackles

B. The ball isn't being thrown to a receiver

C. The ball doesn't make it to the line of scrimmage.

D. The ball is being intentionally grounded

Edited May 23, 2022 by frostbitmic

[Mickey]

10 hours ago, CA OC Bills Fan said:

I was thinking similarly to Mickey regarding the 1 yard rule. Do you really think that at the end of the game the rules should change just to let the team that couldn't win otherwise have a better chance to come back at the end? Or, if that's the rule for the entire game, what does that do to the length of the game? The NFL over time has made efforts to keeping the game moving, not make it longer. One rule they changed several years back (which is different at the end of each half by the way) is that they used to stop the clock whenever the ball carrier went out of bounds. They changed it to stopping the last 2 minutes of the 1st half and last 5 of the 2nd half, the rest of the game they stop it just until the ball is spotted (usually takes 5 seconds or less).

It is even worse when you play it out down by down. 

 

First Down: Winning team dives into the line ending in a huge pile of very large bodies. The refs stop the clock to pull the mosh pit apart, one by one.  Unable to see much of anything, the refs do their best to spot the ball. It is too close to call so they bring out the 1 yard chain and measure. They are short of a yard by a fly speck or two so the clock stops. But wait, the winning team challenges the spot, off we go to replay review land. Replay is useless, no good angles, the call stands and fans will  be blasting hate against the NFL, the refs and the vagaries of fate for years to come over the clearly erroneous spot.  Commercials consumed: 18

 

Second Down:  Rinse, lather, repeat only this time the winning team gets the bogus spot in its favor. After all the measuring and reviewing and choking to death on the piles and piles of commercials, we move to third down.  Commercials consumed: 21

 

Third Down:  Same as First Down only 30 minutes later.  Total commercials consumed: 47

 

Thank goodness we thought of a way not to waste that last 27 seconds.

[Mr. WEO]

8 hours ago, stuvian said:

omitting his CFL knowledge and experience is wasteful and short sighted

 

Grant, Marv and Gil Brandt should do a podcast.  Their combined 272 years of lifer experience could really change the game as we know it.

[billsfan89]

The arena football league used to have the one yard rule, it just resulted in a bunch of QB sneaks. I don't hate the idea of under two minutes kneel downs leading to a clock stoppage but I am sure that adds much excitement. 

[eball]

The “must gain 1 yard” rule is interesting, but in order to be put into practice it would need to be drafted carefully.  I think it would have to be “must make an effort to advance the football” language rather than a specific yardage amount, to avoid ridiculous pauses to determine whether a yard was gained.  The offense simply has to “try.”  If a QB throws the ball away it stops the clock regardless.

 

There’s also the issue of plays at the end of the 1st half.  If a team has the ball on their own 20 with 10 seconds to go they have to run a meaningful play?

 

The other two suggestions by Grant are indeed worthy of discussion.

 

[Dan Darragh]

21 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

You have history backwards. The QB could get rid of the ball to escape a sack anywhere in the past. They established the tackle box to benefit the defense. If the defense successfully rushes the passer the QB no longer can just toss the ball anywhere to avoid a sack.

Revisionist history. 

 

It was enacted in 1993 to keep the QB from getting hit. I remember it.

Edited May 24, 2022 by Dan Darragh

[Orlando Buffalo]

15 hours ago, frostbitmic said:

Spiking the ball to stop the clock should be intentional grounding as well ...

A. The QB is between the tackles

B. The ball isn't being thrown to a receiver

C. The ball doesn't make it to the line of scrimmage.

D. The ball is being intentionally grounded

The rule was put into place in about 1990 to give the team an extra timeout basically, it costs a down but the rule was created as an exception to your point.

[Orlando Buffalo]

2 hours ago, Dan Darragh said:

Revisionist history. 

 

It was enacted in 1993 to keep the QB from getting hit. I remember it.

During that general time frame I remember Jim Kelly running almost out of bounds and just lofting the ball out of the back of the endzone and then getting an intentional grounding call. I had thought the rule change was more recent but intentional grounding used to be anywhere of field but the new rule was enacted to protect QBs when out of pocket.

[Talley56]

In reviewing the reactions, it looks like I'm in the minority here, but I don't understand why so many people have a problem with kneeling to run out the clock.  The opposing team had all game to outscore you.  If you've gotten the stop with the lead and the opportunity to run out the clock, you've earned the right to just take a knee and run it out.  If you get sacked or don't gain a yard at any other time in the game the clock will run so that shouldn't change at the end.  I just don't understand why that is such an issue for people.  I hope they don't change this because it wouldn't just be a bad idea it would be a rancid idea.  The fans already got their money's worth.  Who cares if they are leaving in the last minute or two.

[Nextmanup]

The one rule or aspect of current NFL football that I would change if I could is the situation down at the goal line.

 

An offensive player with the ball can jump up in the air, stick his arm out for 1/4 second, and then be pushed back and end up under a pile of humanity at the 4 yard line and it's considered a TD b/c he broke the plain of the goal.

 

Or a player can run for the front corner of the end zone, dive, stick out the ball, touch that pylon, and then fly out of bounds and it's somehow considered a TD.  

 

I HATE that stuff.  I would try to change it so that the idea is the player's body must end up in the end zone at the culmination of the play for it to be a TD.  Otherwise, it's spotted at the 1 inch line.

 

 

[ExiledInIllinois]

On 5/22/2022 at 6:59 PM, Albany,n.y. said:

Who knew the key to a long life is to lose 4 Super Bowls coaching the same team?  Marv 96, Bud 95.  

Seems like it would be common knowledge.   If you got there 4 times and still lost... You are doing something majorly right as opposed to the common thinking that you are doing something wrong. 

 

Everyone... Should know it.

 

Adversity builds strength and longevity.

[quincy]

I like the moving the spot of the kick-off back, especially for the opening kick off and the one to begin the 3rd quarter - just to encourage there to be some kind of genuine guaranteed football activity on that play, as opposed to it being a choreographed sprint with no action 80% of the time.

 

Maybe adopt those suggestions just for 2 kick-off's a game.

 

I am sure there are some games where neither team attempts a kick off return and just takes the guaranteed yardage.

 

If the kick-off is in the field of play (and not through the end zone), a player should be enticed to catch it and take a knee. I hate the kick-off's where the returner barely attempts to even locate the ball and the "no return" hand gestures are given within a second. 

 

There is usually the most attention given to opening kick-off and most of the time there is no play apart from the kick bouncing out through the back of the end zone and then waiting another 3/4 minutes for the next play. Camera flashes and no action!     

[Rochesterfan]

23 hours ago, quincy said:

I like the moving the spot of the kick-off back, especially for the opening kick off and the one to begin the 3rd quarter - just to encourage there to be some kind of genuine guaranteed football activity on that play, as opposed to it being a choreographed sprint with no action 80% of the time.

 

Maybe adopt those suggestions just for 2 kick-off's a game.

 

I am sure there are some games where neither team attempts a kick off return and just takes the guaranteed yardage.

 

If the kick-off is in the field of play (and not through the end zone), a player should be enticed to catch it and take a knee. I hate the kick-off's where the returner barely attempts to even locate the ball and the "no return" hand gestures are given within a second. 

 

There is usually the most attention given to opening kick-off and most of the time there is no play apart from the kick bouncing out through the back of the end zone and then waiting another 3/4 minutes for the next play. Camera flashes and no action!     

 

The question is why would the NFL/NFLPA want to make that change?

 

Kick-offs were always considered one of the most dangerous plays with the most injuries.  That has changed with the new rules - which is exactly what the competition committee, the NFL, and the NFLPA want.  The reduction has been due mostly to the reduced number of returns - so I do not see any way the NFL wants to backtrack that.

 

The newest data coming out (just published this week) is now punt returns are the leading injury play - so although Grant made a suggestion to eliminate the fair catch - I think he is on the wrong side of history here.  The competition committee and NFLPA are looking at ways to decrease punt return injuries and the best way to do that is with more fair catches not fewer.

 

I would expect the NFL to look at ways to decrease the ability of punt returning players to block - like eliminating double teams on the outside and making those 1:1 and then adjusting the formation to include a 2nd person spread out and fewer people that can rush, but they must be within so many yards of the ball.  The idea is to lessen the long runs leading to big hits and have more situations where the returner must call for the fair catch because players are bearing down on him.

 

The NFL gets an additional stoppage and gets additional ad times - so the networks recoup money and the cash rolls in.  They are happy and no one got hurt on the play.

 

 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Rochesterfan

[RyanC883]

On 5/23/2022 at 6:37 PM, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

 

What would be the point of any of this?

 

if the game is close it makes it more interesting than allowing a team to kneel the clock out.  

[Mr. WEO]

24 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

if the game is close it makes it more interesting than allowing a team to kneel the clock out.  

 

The kneel down  rarely comes in a close game--hence: "the victory formation".

 

What if they run a legit play and lose a yard or 2--the clock wouldn't run on plays for losses, only if they gain a yard?

 

This rule would make no sense at all. 

[RyanC883]

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

 

The kneel down  rarely comes in a close game--hence: "the victory formation".

 

What if they run a legit play and lose a yard or 2--the clock wouldn't run on plays for losses, only if they gain a yard?

 

This rule would make no sense at all. 

 

the rule could only apply in a close game.  Figure the team kneeling down is up by less than 8 points.  Otherwise, your right, it makes zero sense.  

[Mr. WEO]

36 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

the rule could only apply in a close game.  Figure the team kneeling down is up by less than 8 points.  Otherwise, your right, it makes zero sense.  

 

what if the QB just runs backwards a yard or 2 then gives himself up?  Also, having a rule only for the end of the game when a team is up X amount of points tends toward absurdity.

 

Both teams have equal opportunity to counter the other's Offense and manage their TO's appropriately.  The loser can't use goofy  rules to salvage a win with seconds left.

 

This would be  a rule change in search of a problem to solve.