Deshaun Watson admits under oath that Ashley Solis cried at the end of the massage

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, Big Turk said:

Regretting something after the fact does not make it illegal if it was consented to while it happened.

 

This is true. But how do you know this is what happened? Feels like wild speculation. 

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

6 hours ago, Big Turk said:

Regretting something after the fact does not make it illegal if it was consented to while it happened.

 

 

oh so now it was consensual?!
 

You keep changing what you think happened as more evidence, new accusers, and even his lawyer admitting “non-guilt” comes out.
 

But you always seems to give Watson as much or more benefit of the doubt that any reasonable person could. 

At this point I have gathered enough evidence as to make a decision on your morality

[Big Turk]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

This is true. But how do you know this is what happened? Feels like wild speculation. 

 

I don't but based on the number of cases "piling on" seems like a good bet 

[BillsFan4]

1 hour ago, Big Turk said:

 

I don't but based on the number of cases "piling on" seems like a good bet 

A good bet based on what? One of the 2 new women that came forward is only seeking the bare minimum compensation, so not for money (at least in her case).

 

So basically the more women that come forward the less likely you are to believe them?

 

Why are you so willing to give one guy the benefit of the doubt but not 24 women? Why is the word of one guy worth more than 24 women to you? A guy who was constantly seeking out new women on Instagram to give him a “massage”, mind you. A guy who admitted he made a woman cry during the massages. A guy who’s lawyer just said that attempting to get a happy ending and saying + doing creepy things to massage therapists isn’t illegal…

[Big Turk]

15 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

A good bet based on what? One of the 2 new women that came forward is only seeking the bare minimum compensation, so not for money (at least in her case).

 

So basically the more women that come forward the less likely you are to believe them?

 

Why are you so willing to give one guy the benefit of the doubt but not 24 women? Why is the word of one guy worth more than 24 women to you? A guy who was constantly seeking out new women on Instagram to give him a “massage”, mind you. A guy who admitted he made a woman cry during the massages. A guy who’s lawyer just said that attempting to get a happy ending and saying + doing creepy things to massage therapists isn’t illegal…

 

The more money the person being accused has, the more stringently I look at the possible motives behind the accusers.  When a potential settlement gets to an amount more than many of them have ever seen in their life, that gives quite the incentive to pile on, wouldn't you think? People constantly want to pretend money isn't a strong enough motive for people to fudge the truth, but time and again we have seen it IS, and in amounts far less than what is being bandied about here.

Edited June 6, 2022 by Big Turk

[BarleyNY]

7 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

A good bet based on what? One of the 2 new women that came forward is only seeking the bare minimum compensation, so not for money (at least in her case).

 

So basically the more women that come forward the less likely you are to believe them?

 

Why are you so willing to give one guy the benefit of the doubt but not 24 women? Why is the word of one guy worth more than 24 women to you? A guy who was constantly seeking out new women on Instagram to give him a “massage”, mind you. A guy who admitted he made a woman cry during the massages. A guy who’s lawyer just said that attempting to get a happy ending and saying + doing creepy things to massage therapists isn’t illegal…

Let’s not be naive.  The timing of the filing of the last two suits was planned by Buzbee.  The purpose was to keep the suits in the news.  By doing so it keeps pressure on Watson to settle the cases, which is his overarching goal.

 

Please note that I am not speaking to the legitimacy of any of the cases, I’m just pointing out the lawyer’s strategy. 

[Big Turk]

2 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

Let’s not be naive.  The timing of the filing of the last two suits was planned by Buzbee.  The purpose was to keep the suits in the news.  By doing so it keeps pressure on Watson to settle the cases, which is his overarching goal.

 

Please note that I am not speaking to the legitimacy of any of the cases, I’m just pointing out the lawyer’s strategy. 

 

They are looking for settlements of over 100K for each woman...that's "huge money" to many of them, and it's kind of like a once a lifetime opportunity for them to get it.  It is extremely naïve for people not to recognize this is a huge payday opportunity that will likely never come around again for them.

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

Let’s not be naive.  The timing of the filing of the last two suits was planned by Buzbee.  The purpose was to keep the suits in the news.  By doing so it keeps pressure on Watson to settle the cases, which is his overarching goal.

 

Please note that I am not speaking to the legitimacy of any of the cases, I’m just pointing out the lawyer’s strategy. 

 

Agree. The TV interviews, then the two new suits... they are part of the litigation strategy and they are ramping up the pressure on the Watson camp. 

 

And I associate myself with your comments about legitimacy too. 

 

[BillsFan4]

8 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

Let’s not be naive.  The timing of the filing of the last two suits was planned by Buzbee.  The purpose was to keep the suits in the news.  By doing so it keeps pressure on Watson to settle the cases, which is his overarching goal.

 

Please note that I am not speaking to the legitimacy of any of the cases, I’m just pointing out the lawyer’s strategy. 

I don’t know about the 24th woman (I haven’t read anything in her yet), but the 23rd woman who just came forward said she did so after seeing the real sports interview where Watson’s lawyer said watson had no remorse. So I don’t think buzbee was just sitting on this lawsuit. I believe her that she came forward because of the reason she stated. And she’s only seeking whatever the minimum compensation is so why would she agree to put her name out there publicly and face all the backlash just so Buzbee could use her?

10 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

The more money the person being accused has, the more stringently I look at the possible motives behind the accusers.  When a potential settlement gets to an amount more than many of them have ever seen in their life, that gives quite the incentive to pile on, wouldn't you think?

So what have you seen from these new women that makes you question their motives? Especially the 23rd who filed for the mimimum compensation.

Edited June 6, 2022 by BillsFan4

[Big Turk]

12 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

I don’t know about the 24th woman (I haven’t read anything in her yet), but the 23rd woman who just came forward said she did so after seeing the real sports interview where Watson’s lawyer said watson had no remorse. So I don’t think buzbee was just sitting on this lawsuit. I believe her that she came forward because of the reason she stated. And she’s only seeking whatever the minimum compensation is so why would she agree to put her name out there publicly and face all the backlash just so Buzbee could use her?

So what have you seen from these new women that makes you question their motives? Especially the 23rd who filed for the mimimum compensation.

 

Turning down 100K settlement offer for starters.  If the motive wasn't money, that is a pretty large sum Watson was offering to make it all go away, and since this is only a civil trial and not a criminal trial, what other motive is there other than money?

Edited June 6, 2022 by Big Turk

[BarleyNY]

8 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

I don’t know about the 24th woman (I haven’t read anything in her yet), but the 23rd woman who just came forward said she did so after seeing the real sports interview where Watson’s lawyer said watson had no remorse. So I don’t think buzbee was just sitting on this lawsuit. I believe her that she came forward because of the reason she stated. And she’s only seeking whatever the minimum compensation is so why would she agree to put her name out there publicly and face all the backlash just so Buzbee could use her?

 

This is what I meant by not being naive.  Yes, of course, the narrative has to be something like that.  What else are they going to say?  Incidentally, what’s “minimum compensation”?  $1 and an apology?  I suspect it’s a bit more than that.  More optics.  Again, this is completely independent of the legitimacy of the suit.  This is strategy and pressure.

[BillsFan4]

10 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Turning down 100K settlement offer for starters.  If the motive wasn't money, that is a pretty large sum Watson was offering to make it all go away, and since this is only a civil trial and not a criminal trial, what other motive is there other than money?

The new women suing him didn’t turn down any settlement money offered, and the 23rd woman is only seeking the minimum. So again I ask what have you seen that makes you doubt them?

 

Do you feel the same way about every person who sues another person for damages? Or just women suing rich men?

 

and at the time that money was offered wasn’t there still pending criminal cases?

 

edit - also, Watson wanted the women to sign a very aggressive non disclosure agreement. 

Edited June 6, 2022 by BillsFan4

[BillsFan4]

15 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

This is what I meant by not being naive.  Yes, of course, the narrative has to be something like that.  What else are they going to say?  Incidentally, what’s “minimum compensation”?  $1 and an apology?  I suspect it’s a bit more than that.  More optics.  Again, this is completely independent of the legitimacy of the suit.  This is strategy and pressure.

I agree that the real sports interviews were done to put pressure on the NFL, and on Watson.

 

But I haven’t seen anything from the new women that makes me believe they were just waiting months and months to come forward in order to allow Buzbee to keep pressure on Watson to settle. I also don’t find it hard to believe that seeing Watson say he has no remorse made them want to come forward.

 

and i don’t know what the minimum compensation is. I was wondering the same thing myself. I tried to Google it but didn’t find anything 

Edited June 6, 2022 by BillsFan4

[WotAGuy]

17 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Turning down 100K settlement offer for starters.  If the motive wasn't money, that is a pretty large sum Watson was offering to make it all go away, and since this is only a civil trial and not a criminal trial, what other motive is there other than money?

Haven’t you ever had anything wrong done to you and want to make it known so others might be able to avoid a similar wrong?  
 

Perhaps (at least) some of these women are sick of being abused and disrespected by men and are seizing an opportunity to draw a line in the sand, and do it with the support of other victims so they aren’t out on an island?

[Mr. WEO]

14 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

Did you lose your song book?  Because this is very different than the tune you were singing about Bob Kraft.

Nope.Kraft did the same.  
 

He had a competent lawyer, however.

 

 

[Big Turk]

11 minutes ago, WotAGuy said:

Haven’t you ever had anything wrong done to you and want to make it known so others might be able to avoid a similar wrong?  
 

Perhaps (at least) some of these women are sick of being abused and disrespected by men and are seizing an opportunity to draw a line in the sand, and do it with the support of other victims so they aren’t out on an island?

 

That is what criminal trials are for, not civil trials.  There is a much lower burden of proof for civil trials. Hence one cannot be used to do the work of the other.

[BarleyNY]

18 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

I agree that the real sports interviews were done to put pressure on the NFL, and on Watson.

 

But I haven’t seen anything from the new women that makes me believe they were just waiting months and months to come forward in order to allow Buzbee to keep pressure on Watson to settle. I also don’t find it hard to believe that seeing Watson say he has no remorse made them want to come forward.

 

and i don’t know what the minimum compensation is. I was wondering the same thing myself. I tried to Google it but didn’t find anything 

You think this woman got some new information from the HBO special?  I didn’t see it, but I know Watson didn’t do an interview for it.  So it’s kinda odd how - even though he wasn’t on it - she suddenly felt he had no remorse.  Also it’s worth noting that Buzbee has been saying for weeks that there could be more cases.  The timing and narrative are completely strategic.  Whether or not the 23rd accuser actually felt the way that has been stated is immaterial.  This is how the game is played. 

[WotAGuy]

10 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

That is what criminal trials are for, not civil trials.  There is a much lower burden of proof for civil trials. Hence one cannot be used to do the work of the other.

If the crime happened in a private setting with no tangible evidence, the grand jury is not going to indict. So the recourse for the victim is a civil trial. 
 

Ever hear of the OJ civil case?  There are instances when a wrong isn’t proven in court but it’s still a wrong and a civil case gives an opportunity for the victims to seek justice/retribution. 

[Big Turk]

28 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Nope.Kraft did the same.  
 

He had a competent lawyer, however.

 

 

 

Kraft did not really do the same...he went to a known place where that type of behavior was expected and welcomed. There was no "forcing" those women to do that, they knew that is what they were there for.  He was facing a criminal trial, NOT a civil trial.

7 minutes ago, WotAGuy said:

If the crime happened in a private setting with no tangible evidence, the grand jury is not going to indict. So the recourse for the victim is a civil trial. 
 

Ever hear of the OJ civil case?  There are instances when a wrong isn’t proven in court but it’s still a wrong and a civil case gives an opportunity for the victims to seek justice/retribution. 

 

Proving that someone is "more likely to have done something versus not done something" is a far, far lower standard than proving "beyond a reasonable doubt". If you don't understand the difference and why that matters, you should go read up on the law.

Edited June 6, 2022 by Big Turk

[BillsFan4]

9 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

You think this woman got some new information from the HBO special?  I didn’t see it, but I know Watson didn’t do an interview for it.  So it’s kinda odd how - even though he wasn’t on it - she suddenly felt he had no remorse.  Also it’s worth noting that Buzbee has been saying for weeks that there could be more cases.  The timing and narrative are completely strategic.  Whether or not the 23rd accuser actually felt the way that has been stated is immaterial.  This is how the game is played. 

They played a clip of Watson saying he had no remorse during the real sports segment. Then at the end of the segment Watson’s lawyer was interviewed and she reiterated that Watson has no regrets for any of his actions.

 

so yes, I believe it’s possible that girl didn’t decide to come forward until she saw the real sports segment.