Is there any circumstances you would move on from McDermott after 2022?

[Alphadawg7]

14 minutes ago, HomeskillitMoorman said:

 

So in your eyes...the Lombardi would elevate McD's standing as a coach but not winning it with a SB caliber roster doesn't take him down any notches. Interesting. 

 

I don't see it quite that way, for me it's evaluating him regardless. If McD gags in the biggest moments for a 3rd postseason in a row but #17 bails him out and we win it all, as he almost did this past January, I don't think that elevates McD somehow. Just like if McD becomes a great in-game decision maker this season and has a great postseason but we lose for a different reason, I do think that would still elevate him. I can't agree at all that a guy that's made horrible in-game decisions in the playoffs two years in a row is a top 5 coach as it stands.

 

But for you it seems like this only moves one way and there's really no accountability for him. We're all fans so it doesn't really matter in the end but it's just a strange philosophy to me. And yeah Allen is only 25...but these are still precious years and it is a big deal when a coach blows a great chance at a SB. I think you need at least a little bit of luck in terms of things like team health, being in the kind of zone Josh was in at the right time, etc and this postseason was one where everything had really lined up. 

I’ve seen people like you put Reid on this coaching elite pedestal but he was the Bills 2.0 in Philly where he went to 4 straight NFC Chmoionship games, losing 3 of them though and making one SB, also a loss.  
 

I’ve seen you people put McVay BEFORE this SB victory on the same pedastel.  
 

I’ve seen you people put Sean Payton on the same pedastel despite frequently MISSING the playoffs with a 5000 yard passing prime Brees and only reaching the big dance once.

 

So the point is, that it’s NOT easy to make the SB, just ask McCarthy, LaFluer, Payton, Schottenheimer, Reid, etc who had tons of elite QB play and couldn’t get there most seasons or even at all.  

In fact Andy Reid is 1-2 in SBs, and 3-8 in Conference Championship games.  
 

So yeah, I think any coach who gets a SB ring will have some elevation in status perception.  But just because you don’t win one doesn’t also mean you’re downgraded as a coach that needs to be replaced.  

 

McD is one of the best coaches in the NFL right now and many teams would fire their existing coach to hire him if he was suddenly available.  And a SB ring doesn’t make him a great coach, it makes him get the recognition he already deserves as a great coach.  
 

Edited May 17, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

If the Bills lose again to the chiefs in the playoffs, McD will have to go.

 

He will have hit his ceiling as a coach

[todd]

I’m convinced that some people aren’t happy unless they are miserable. Nothing to complain about? Manufacture something!

 

That sums up this stupid poll and thread.

Edited May 17, 2022 by todd

[HomeskillitMoorman]

4 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I’ve seen people like you put Reid on this coaching elite pedestal but he was the Bills 2.0 in Philly where he went to 4 straight NFC Chmoionship games, losing 3 of them though and making one SB, also a loss.  
 

I’ve seen you people put McVay BEFORE this SB victory on the same pedastel.  
 

I’ve seen you people put Sean Payton on the same pedastel despite frequently MISSING the playoffs with a 5000 yard passing prime Brees and only reaching the big dance once.

 

So the point is, that it’s NOT easy to make the SB, just ask McCarthy, LaFluer, Payton, Schottenheimer, Reid, etc who had tons of elite QB play and couldn’t get there most seasons or even at all.  

In fact Andy Reid is 1-2 in SBs, and 3-8 in Conference Championship games.  
 

So yeah, I think any coach who gets a SB ring will have some elevation in status perception.  But just because you don’t win one doesn’t also mean you’re downgraded as a coach that needs to be replaced.  

 

McD is one of the best coaches in the NFL right now and many teams would fire their existing coach to hire him if he was suddenly available.  And a SB ring doesn’t make him a great coach, it makes him get the recognition he already deserves as a great coach.  
 

 

This is a pretty amateur and childish response. I haven't mentioned any of those names, which just made up like 80% of your post. Manufacturing something and throwing someone in it as "people like you" or "you people" in direct response to someone who didn't say any of that is what people do in those really immature political conversations. If you look at my response, I actually read what you said and responded directly to your thoughts, I didn't create a different argument and lump you in with something you haven't said. 

 

We can agree to disagree, I'll move on to a more mature conversation. 

[Matt_In_NH]

17 hours ago, ChevyVanMiller said:

*Is there any circumstances you would move on from McDermott after 2022?

 

*Are (the noun is plural)

 

 

Then it would have said “our”

[HomeskillitMoorman]

13 minutes ago, Seoulofstone said:

 

 

 

No, not necessarily a skeptic, but the "no matter what" part I think is what's even more bold than anything I've said. Like if he made a series of horrible moves that led to another playoff loss, you wouldn't even question if he's the right person to move forward with? My point was more that "no matter what" is basically saying there's no accountability or expectation for McD when we have an elite QB that leaves everything out there and has the ability to win a SB, multiple even. If that's the case, then yes, I think Josh's greatness is being really under appreciated or not being acknowledged. 

 

The second part you raise some solid questions. Obviously neither I or anyone here would have those answers and certainly some of those things would have to play in. Like I wouldn't want to lose Beane, for instance. There would have to be belief that a coach they possibly have in mind could be a leader for this group. I get that it's not straightforward. But I also don't think that means we should ultimately hang on to what we have "no matter what", in fear of that, if he continues to gag in these big games. 

 

[Alphadawg7]

22 minutes ago, HomeskillitMoorman said:

 

This is a pretty amateur and childish response. I haven't mentioned any of those names, which just made up like 80% of your post. Manufacturing something and throwing someone in it as "people like you" or "you people" in direct response to someone who didn't say any of that is what people do in those really immature political conversations. If you look at my response, I actually read what you said and responded directly to your thoughts, I didn't create a different argument and lump you in with something you haven't said. 

 

We can agree to disagree, I'll move on to a more mature conversation. 

I didn’t mean it disrespectful.  You also misunderstood what I meant by “people like you”.  I didn’t say YOU said those things about those other coaches.  I said people like you, as in people who want to be more critical of McD because he hasn’t gotten us to a SB yet.  And that’s accurate, not childish.  But I can see how you could take it differently, so sorry for not being more clear.

 

But I would bet big money that if I asked you before my post if you thought Andy Reid was a great coach that you would have said yes, as would most people, because he is. 
 

Yet Reid had lost a SB and 5 championship games before he finally won one much later in his career.  And he has since lost another SB and another Championship game as well.  
 

He went to 4 straight championship games, and a total of 5 in Philly and lost all of them but one, which resulted in a lost SB.  In KC he has gone to 4 straight championship games again but only one SB ring to show for it.  
 

But I would bet you think he’s a top tier coach who should not be fired.  Which he absolutely is.  And if you also think so, then you need to rethink your stance on McD and evaluate what he’s done to get us to this point and not hang as much weight on not YET getting the SB on his resume.

Edited May 17, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I only see two routes to the Bills missing the playoffs:

 

1 - Josh gets a serious injury (crossing everything that he doesn't) in which case all bets are off;

2 - The oline sinks us - which I would put at Brandon Beane's door. It is the one area where I just don't think he has done enough. 

 

Last season the only thing I didn't like about the Bills chances was the prevailing attitude that the season was all about avenging the loss to the Chiefs.

 

It permeated from the front office.......who chose to run it back........down to the fans.......who felt the season was just an annoying formality on their way back to the AFCCG.

 

And it showed with the players..........they had problems with focusing on opponents.........got pumped up to play KC,  which carried over to the game in TN.........and then from there until halftime of the Tampa game they seemed often disinterested.    Fortunately they had as many weaklings on their schedule as they did.......teams whose first priority was evaluating their own roster,  trying to win was a secondary consideration.

 

 It took a string of terrible losses and then Tom Brady kicking sand in their faces again for two quarters for them to realize that they needed to start playing up to the hype or miss the playoffs entirely.

 

It was only fitting that the opportunities that they wasted lead to them getting beaten........yet again.......in KC.

 

Hopefully the players (and fans for that matter) learned something from wasting what was probably their clearest path to a SB title since the early 90's.

 

I expect this season that this team will be focused from day one and that the goal will be home field advantage and that attitude will not fluctuate based on how KC is playing(which appeared to be the case at times last season).    

 

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

McDermott is not above criticism. I don’t think he’s a top 5 coach personally but he’s in range. 
 

What I find funny are these attempts to insulate him from criticism…like people saying if the team falls short of expectations this season it will somehow be Beane’s fault. This while the Bills are Super Bowl favorites and the roster is absolutely loaded.

 

The only way it is Beane's fault is if the OL disintergrates. If that is what costs us I put that on Beane. I don't think anything else lands at Beane's door, but OL does. Didn't love the standing pat there last year, don't love the moves there this year. If there is under performance from other units (except for major injuries allowing) that is on the coaches and ultimately McDermott. 

[Rico]

No, but I would trade Filthy Beast for Skooby.

[GoBills808]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I’ve seen people like you put Reid on this coaching elite pedestal but he was the Bills 2.0 in Philly where he went to 4 straight NFC Chmoionship games, losing 3 of them though and making one SB, also a loss.  
 

I’ve seen you people put McVay BEFORE this SB victory on the same pedastel.  
 

 

 

Which, it turns out, was entirely accurate.

[dollars 2 donuts]

2 hours ago, Johnnycage46 said:

 

Dude those are awesome...with the exception of the purple-ish black licorice flavored ones. 

 

 

Although we are not of the same thought, please know, Johnny, that I pray for you...every single damn day from here on out.

 

  

[PromoTheRobot]

4 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I think fans want a SB and if the Bills lose another playoff game in similar fashion to how they did last year many  fans will be calling for his head… 

That’s because your standards are low….
 

There is no reason to suggest either should be replaced right now. No reason at all… but suggesting they should retire as Bills is also ridiculously premature. 

 

  Oh, Scott. Your memory is short.  I'll take my chances with McBeane getting long in the tooth over front office/coaching roulette. What's been this franchise's record with GM and head coach hires?

[The Dean]

None of the situations in your poll would come close to justifying firing McD, IMO. 

 

It will take Urbanesque issues to justify his dismissal this year, IMO.

[Mattymafia]

no.

[JimBob2232]

It would take a scandal, a poorly managed external crisis (i.e. Antonio Brown, etc), or team revolt.   No on-field performance will make me change his status in 23 (or 24 for that matter).  He gets a pass for a good long while - unless he and Allen start a spat.  Then Allen wins.

[Nextmanup]

20 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

The cupboard is now fully stocked (DB only real question mark still) and there are no more excuses for him.

 

And the best path for this team in terms of a SB appearance is to play consistent football from start to finish to ensure the road to the SB goes through Buffalo. And to McD's credit he's been great at home in the playoffs the last few years and has never lost a home playoff game.

 

But deep down I still think very poor in game decisions and situation football awareness is something that can be exploited again not just in the playoffs, but against a very tough schedule this year.

He's never been, and is never going to be, an above average in-game decision maker.

 

Whether that holds the team back from winning it all or not remains to be seen.

 

As I keep writing when these types of threads come up, the day WILL come when he has to get it done, or else he should be gone.

 

Is that day THIS YEAR?  Probably not.

 

[Buffalosouth]

I was thinking about this the other day. If they come out and get beat badly on week 1 it's going to be a big hit but not quite enough. If they lose enough games throughout the season from bad coaching the frogs in the water and the stove on. The straw that breaks the camels back for me would be him losing the team. That's what I worry about the most is the message getting old. If the process becomes a problem I wouldn't be too surprised if the Pegulas started having talks. The next question is are Beane and McDermott truly McBeane or would Beane stay? Is he good at drafting for McDermotts system or all around a good talent evaluator? 

 

This is why they need to win. Then I can just think 'Superbowl.'

Edited May 17, 2022 by Buffalosouth

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

A little different circumstances now though… And yea, I wouldn’t trust the Pegulas one bit to get it right with the next hire, but Josh Allen would attract many coaches/GMs… and would make many of them look good.

 

Or ruin him. When you have a good thing going you don't make a bet you can do better. Besides, if as you say Josh will make anyone look good, just stay with what you have.

[blizzardman]

12 seconds and he’d have to go