Reported Bills UDFA signing - 11 signed, 3 Camp Invites *Updated* 09:32 (4 open spots)

[Buffalo Barbarian]

On 4/30/2022 at 6:55 PM, Allen2Diggs said:

This is why NFL Europe was great. Teams could let their prospects get real game experience and give them time to develop.

 

Fred Jackson played for the Rhein Fire and probably wouldn't have had an NFL career without having that opportunity after going undrafted.

 

maybe the USFL  will fill that spot.

 

 

Edited May 2, 2022 by Buffalo Barbarian

[MrEpsYtown]

Travon Fuller seems pretty interesting as well. Graduate transfer from Texas A&M.

 

 

 

[RocCityRoller]

if that was Alec Lindstrom I would be excited

[BillsFanForever19]

19 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

I want Ford gone because of how horrible he has been and the fact we didn't draft DK Metcalf instead. In reality id like him to succeed but i highly doubt it, a coach can only do so much.

 

Kromer will determine that this summer. He's not going anywhere until after he's been through Training Camp and the Preseason, at least.

[BADOLBILZ]

15 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

Travon Fuller seems pretty interesting as well. Graduate transfer from Texas A&M.

 

 

 

 

 

6'1" + 32 3/4" arms + 4.52..............good PS guy who they might be able to bulk up.

 

Good zone trait CB's are to the late rounds and UDFA as money is to the banana stand.

 

[Rhode Island Red]

Blackshear and Fuller both interesting; both Smurfs, too…

[Doc]

8 minutes ago, Rhode Island Red said:

Blackshear and Fuller both interesting; both Smurfs, too…

 

Fuller is 6'1" and 180#.

[Rhode Island Red]

7 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Fuller is 6'1" and 180#.

My bad…he looked freaking tiny to me…??

 

Meanwhile, Blackshear is only 5’9”, but he’s 194… pretty sure that’s not ‘smurf’ territory, either so guess I should just shut up and go to bed…

 

Edited May 2, 2022 by Rhode Island Red

[BillsFanForever19]

7 hours ago, Mopreme said:

I don’t understand why Bills won’t pull trigger on Justyn Ross. Yes, injury concerns but at this point he would just be undrafted free agent with minimal financial impact. Am I missing something? A couple of years ago they look a change on that tackle who had horrid medicals. Yes, didn’t work out for him but why not take a chance on a first round talent? 

 

Spinal injuries and surgeries are a much bigger issue than knees. From the sounds of it, there's questions as to whether Clemson should have cleared him and whether an NFL team would have. The fact that he was not only not drafted but that no one will sign him speaks volumes.

 

And comparing Doug Whaley deciding to take a chance on Cyrus Kouandjio's knees to Brandon Beane deciding on whether or not to take a chance on Justyn Ross' spine is the ultimate apples to oranges comparison.

Edited May 2, 2022 by BillsFanForever19

[78thealltimegreat]

Lack of depth at TE really opens the door for Jalen Wydermyer. Goes from the projected no 1 TE to undrafted in less then a year…He tested so poorly this off season but you watch him play and think there’s no way he can be this bad. At the very least gets a chance to make up for it in camp. 

[Richard Noggin]

On 4/30/2022 at 8:27 PM, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

For the Love of Little Pink Penquins, What the ***** is our plan at OG?

 

This seems like an uncharacteristically..."concerned" post from you.

 

On 4/30/2022 at 8:57 PM, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Mancz is the equivalent of Jeremiah Sirles.........who half the board had no idea he was on the team.............and Ike tore his achilles this past season and even the homer Sal Capaccio says he isn't sure if Boettger will be healthy enough to make the team in September. 

 

This IS before injuries and covid list(which is still a thing in sports).

 

Their depth is VERY suspect at interior OL depth.

 

You're ignoring Ford and Quessenberry (and of course I recognize that many fans don't rate these two favorably). 

 

13 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That would not be a bad idea at all, but I'm guessing the Quessenberry signing is their Guard/T Williams replacement

 

Quite possibly Williams is still hoping to get closer to the salary he was due to receive from the Bills, or at least Saffold-level pay

 

 

It makes me nervous when I find myself agreeing with you, but this is pretty much how I see it.

 

A counter-point is that the Chiefs had a stronger need for a complete OL rebuild.  In 2020, the Chiefs lost their LT to an Achilles tear, and their center was not All That.    So it made sense for them to invest in LT (trade) and C (draft)

 

2021 was arguably Morse' best year, and prior to 2021, the Bills appeared to be set at LT (Dawkins) and RT (Williams)

 

The big difference IMHO was the KC investment in a top FA guard (Thuney) while the Bills did not make that investment last year or this year.  Of course, the Chiefs also invested a late draft pick at a talented G who fell in the draft due to medical concerns.  The Bills invested a mid-round and late pick on OL, but they have made NO comparable investments at IOL.

 

Something tells me you're concerned about the level of investment in the IOL (lol)? 

 

Thing about investing is, it's judged primarily by the return. If it works, that's the bottom line. 

 

We can presumably see the Bills taking a leaner approach to the IOL portion of their roster portfolio than we'd prefer, but it doesn't actually mean we're staked to a losing position. Maybe they believe in the horses they have, and believe in them enough at least to allow for the more aggressive allocation elsewhere. After all, it's about how the overall product performs.

 

(I think I effing HATE this extended metaphor. Apologies.) Nevertheless, Bates and Saffold are, at the most skeptical end of the spectrum, average fits for an outside zone scheme (I think, and have thought for more than a year, that Bates is a hidden gem). That's fine if your LT and C are above average fits, and your RT has potential to be average-to-above-average. Would one more high-end IOL prospect be better? Eff yes. But maybe we can wait for one more year and then replace Saffold with Bates and replace Bates with a TALENTED G?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, Richard Noggin said:

Something tells me you're concerned about the level of investment in the IOL (lol)? 

 

Thing about investing is, it's judged primarily by the return. If it works, that's the bottom line. 

 

We can presumably see the Bills taking a leaner approach to the IOL portion of their roster portfolio than we'd prefer, but it doesn't actually mean we're staked to a losing position. Maybe they believe in the horses they have, and believe in them enough at least to allow for the more aggressive allocation elsewhere. After all, it's about how the overall product performs.

 

Ha.  Well, to continue your analogy - every prospectus has some small print saying "past performance does not guarantee future results".   Of course it doesn't, but nonetheless, investors use past results of various kinds to predict what the future performance of that investment may be.

 

So what are the Bills past investment results on the OL under Beane?

2018: horrible.  Beane said after the season, he was cap limited but he could have done more, he should have done more

2019: significant improvement under Bobby Johnson.  our run game improved and Josh had more time to throw, most games.  but we improved from a low bar to a meh bar IMHO.  Traded Wyatt Teller just before the season.

2020: stronger pass pro with Darryl Williams solidifying the RT position, but Trouble in the Run Game teepee with zone blocking

2021: run game follies continued.  we re-instituted more gap and pin and pull plays in the run game.  Bobby Johnson left after the season.  FA additions such as Forrest Lamp and Jamil Douglas did not prove out.  Extensive OL remodeling during the season to attempt to find a lineup that worked.

 

Bottom line, over the last 4 years IMO the management, the talent acquisition, and the results on OL have all been suspect.  So while you may be right that the Bills believe in the "horses they have", past performance leads one to question the basis for that believe and its soundness

[transplantbillsfan]

Without searching for it did we cut anyone? Yesterday this thread said we were at 90 already. Was that inaccurate?

[BADOLBILZ]

20 minutes ago, Richard Noggin said:

 

This seems like an uncharacteristically..."concerned" post from you.

 

 

You're ignoring Ford and Quessenberry (and of course I recognize that many fans don't rate these two favorably). 

 

 

 

I'm not ignoring them........I am discounting them.    I have no faith in Cody Ford,  he has only gone from bad to worse each season. 

 

And Quessenberry doesn't rate favorably because he allowed the most sacks in the NFL in 2021...........ELEVEN.........that is why he was available.   He is basically Jordan Mills-level in pass pro.

 

I like Aaron Kromer a lot............I gave him tons of credit for the Roman offense's..........which I was one of the few posters around here who appreciated because the majority were just hate-watching Tyrod Taylor and cared little about anything else even though they were leading the NFL in rushing and a very good scoring team.

 

But I don't like playing fast and loose with the pass protection for my elite QB.

[NickelCity]

I believe the Kerstetter kid can play all 5 positions on the line.... Don't know how well of course but it seems very Bates-esque

[Richard Noggin]

35 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Ha.  Well, to continue your analogy - every prospectus has some small print saying "past performance does not guarantee future results".   Of course it doesn't, but nonetheless, investors use past results of various kinds to predict what the future performance of that investment may be.

 

So what are the Bills past investment results on the OL under Beane?

2018: horrible.  Beane said after the season, he was cap limited but he could have done more, he should have done more

2019: significant improvement under Bobby Johnson.  our run game improved and Josh had more time to throw, most games.  but we improved from a low bar to a meh bar IMHO.  Traded Wyatt Teller just before the season.

2020: stronger pass pro with Darryl Williams solidifying the RT position, but Trouble in the Run Game teepee with zone blocking

2021: run game follies continued.  we re-instituted more gap and pin and pull plays in the run game.  Bobby Johnson left after the season.  FA additions such as Forrest Lamp and Jamil Douglas did not prove out.  Extensive OL remodeling during the season to attempt to find a lineup that worked.

 

Bottom line, over the last 4 years IMO the management, the talent acquisition, and the results on OL have all been suspect.  So while you may be right that the Bills believe in the "horses they have", past performance leads one to question the basis for that believe and its soundness

 

Difficult to disagree with anything here. Maybe it's about what you're omitting, then?

 

For starters: Bates. He's a fine young starting-caliber IOL piece with tons of flex and plenty of athleticism to fit the zone-heavy scheme he'll be in. 

 

Next: Saffold. We can sidestep his pro bowl status last season in favor of something like this: aging LG with history of high-end zone run blocking and declining average-ish pass blocking. Probably a solid one-year stop-gap on-the-field and a vital resource for installing Kromer's wide-zone scheme. 

 

Depth is underwhelming with respect to starting pipeline management, but we shouldn't ignore Ford's adequate replacement performances late in the season, or Quessenberry's value with RT/RG flex. Of course we'd prefer a 3rd starting-caliber OG. I don't know much at all about Mercz (or even if I'm spelling his name correctly). And Boettger would represent SOLID OG depth if he hadn't torn his achilles last year. 

[Buffalo Barbarian]

3 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Kromer will determine that this summer. He's not going anywhere until after he's been through Training Camp and the Preseason, at least.

 

Yeah he still sucks, kromer going to find out real quick

4 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Neither, Old Norse 💪💪

 

 

Edited May 2, 2022 by Buffalo Barbarian

[GreggTX]

If any of these UDFA OL are any good, they have a real shot at this roster. We have 3 solid OL on the roster (Dawkins, Saffold & Morse) but after that, nothing much to speak of. The talent level drops off precipitously. If any of those top 3 OL go down, things could get really ugly. I figure at least 1 or 2 rookie OL can make the final 53.

[Garrett Williams]

47 minutes ago, NickelCity said:

I believe the Kerstetter kid can play all 5 positions on the line.... Don't know how well of course but it seems very Bates-esque

Not at the same time

 

 

[GreggTX]

4 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

I want Ford gone because of how horrible he has been and the fact we didn't draft DK Metcalf instead. In reality id like him to succeed but i highly doubt it, a coach can only do so much.

 

 

Agreed, but right now he's still the 2nd best G on the roster after Saffold. I hope 1 of these rookie OL turns out to be the steal of the year.