Rd 2, Pick 63 (31): RB James Cook, Georgia

[BADOLBILZ]

4 hours ago, MasterStrategist said:

 

You list WR, LT, DE, S, and G.  That's all i need to know about your misguided opinion. 

 

 

 

Who is your backup LT?    Quessenberry?  The guy who allowed the most sacks of any tackle in the NFL playing RIGHT TACKLE last year? 

 

Who is the backup outside receiver behind Diggs and Davis?   Jake Kumerow.   That's who.   The 5th round rookie with 29" arms is not really a big catch radius deep threat on paper.    They are set at slot receiver though.........got 3 of them.

 

Who backs up Hyde and Poyer?    Are Hamlin and Johnson better prospects than Lee and Griffin and McCloud at CB?    They are just as unproven.   Athletically McCloud has the same raw speed and athletic traits as Kaiir Elam.   It's not like they had nobody with any athletic potential to play a CB position that is protected by scheme.

 

If Rodger Saffold misses 300 snaps again this year.......who backs him up?    Cody Ford?  Mancz?   I mean if players of that level were all that was needed they could have done the same thing at zone CB. 

 

Sorry if you don't think talent is needed on the OL but protecting the only reason they are a SB contender............Josh Allen............is job #1.

 

 It's a luxury to have a loaded defense...........it's a necessity to have a healthy QB.

 

 

[Logic]

6 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Watching his video, that's what I think, too.  But someone said if you watch Dalvin in college, he looks a lot like James.   So, we'll see.   If the Bills just drafted Dalvin Cook in the second round (after trading down twice!), Beane is the GM of the decade.  

 

I think the Bills just got a really good #2 back who could possibly become a #1.  

I see a Darren Sproles/Austin Ekeler type. Or Eric Metcalf without the return ability. I think he’ll always be part of a committee throughout his career, but he’ll be the best and most electrifying part of that committee.

 

There will always be a Singletary or Moss around to do the dirty work — even the Saints platoon Kamara with another guy — but the most exciting stuff out of the backfield will be coming from Cook.

[Ralonzo]

James won’t be a lead back or a bell cow but what differentiates him from 90% of backs is that he is not limited in the passing game to “release and present numbers” routes. Most of what Georgia did with him looks like what the Saints do with Kamara - most of the time. Run him on quick hitters, or have him release to the flat as an outlet. (That may have something to do with QB limitations too)

 

But once in a while, they’ll use ‘em in a place that you don’t see RBs pre-snap, like wide on the boundary. Each of those guys can run routes like receivers, track the ball like receivers, catch like receivers. That’s the X-factor with Cook or Kamara. You leave them isolated on a LB at the boundary, that’s a tremendous mismatch, unlike, say, Patrick DiMarco on a wheel route.

 

I was a proponent of Cook in the 3rd or 4th pre-draft, I hoped for Andersen in the 2nd and Cook in the 3rd as the draft developed, but I’m not going to be put off of what I saw as Cook’s possibilities in this offense due to a perceived reach on draft value.

[Shaw66]

6 minutes ago, Logic said:

I see a Darren Sproles/Austin Ekeler type. Or Eric Metcalf without the return ability. I think he’ll always be part of a committee throughout his career, but he’ll be the best and most electrifying part of that committee.

 

There will always be a Singletary or Moss around to do the dirty work — even the Saints platoon Kamara with another guy — but the most exciting stuff out of the backfield will be coming from Cook.

Agreed, if he pans out.  

 

He's the kind of guy that playoff contenders can afford to draft in the second round.   If you're coming off several 6-10 to 8-8 seasons, you're taking a bread-and-butter guy you need to be a full-time starter soon.   If you're a contender with a good offense, you're looking for a guy who can add a little juice.   And the guy is available precisely because so many other teams can't afford to be buying juice when they need bread. 

[MasterStrategist]

32 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Who is your backup LT?    Quessenberry?  The guy who allowed the most sacks of any tackle in the NFL playing RIGHT TACKLE last year? 

 

Who is the backup outside receiver behind Diggs and Davis?   Jake Kumerow.   That's who.   The 5th round rookie with 29" arms is not really a big catch radius deep threat on paper.    They are set at slot receiver though.........got 3 of them.

 

Who backs up Hyde and Poyer?    Are Hamlin and Johnson better prospects than Lee and Griffin and McCloud at CB?    They are just as unproven.   Athletically McCloud has the same raw speed and athletic traits as Kaiir Elam.   It's not like they had nobody with any athletic potential to play a CB position that is protected by scheme.

 

If Rodger Saffold misses 300 snaps again this year.......who backs him up?    Cody Ford?  Mancz?   I mean if players of that level were all that was needed they could have done the same thing at zone CB. 

 

Sorry if you don't think talent is needed on the OL but protecting the only reason they are a SB contender............Josh Allen............is job #1.

 

 It's a luxury to have a loaded defense...........it's a necessity to have a healthy QB.

 

 

1. Backup LT: Spencer Brown, they will either plug Quesenberry in at RT, or if Doyle progresses then Tommy.

 

2. Backup Outside WR: not sure why this is so complicated, we can bump Shakir and/or Crowder outside, not full time but 20-30% snaps per game.  In addition, we split out a TE or RB to the "1" position alot in our empty sets.  Same as last year when Manny was around, Shakir/Crowder will fill his role.  Then yes, Jake will get some time if needed.

 

3.  Backup S: Yes, IMO, Hamlin could be our starter in another year or so.  He and Johnson certainly capable of filling in, not all pro, but Dane Jackson level talent. So yes better than the DBs you listed.

 

4. Backup G: this is the one position I agree I'm concerned with depth, however Beane specifically mentioned Cody in his post-draft presser as a player they expect to improve this season.  I'm still not investing in a Rd 1/2 G though.  Sweet spot would have been Round 3, but they liked Bernard.  Quesenberry can kick inside to G as well.  New coaches want "their guys", so I trust Kromer had plenty of say in what he needs up front.  Potentially Boetgger is ready midway through season as well.

 

5.  Zone CB philosophy: we've "managed" the CB position in past years, but that hasn't got us over the top. We need talent at both corner spots against top tier QBs, plain and simple.

 

You should go back and watch the Kc game, then listen to Beane and McD post season presser and pre-draft presser.  All point to this team needing more "speed and versatility", and continuing to get after the QB upfront.  Which is exactly what they achieved, via FA and draft.

[Shaw66]

44 minutes ago, Ralonzo said:

 

But once in a while, they’ll use ‘em in a place that you don’t see RBs pre-snap, like wide on the boundary. Each of those guys can run routes like receivers, track the ball like receivers, catch like receivers. That’s the X-factor with Cook or Kamara. You leave them isolated on a LB at the boundary, that’s a tremendous mismatch, unlike, say, Patrick DiMarco on a wheel route.

 

 

This states the receiving part of the equation really well.  Patrick DiMarco, or even Devin Singletary.  Cook looks like a true receiver.  

 

And I think the flip side is equally true.  He's a true running back.  When he lines up in the backfield, it's different from putting McKenzie back there and asking him to make plays. 

 

I think the Bills really wanted Cook, and I'm a little surprised they traded back twice before taking him.  

[Shaw66]

14 minutes ago, MasterStrategist said:

1. Backup LT: Spencer Brown, they will either plug Quesenberry in at RT, or if Doyle progresses then Tommy.

 

2. Backup Outside WR: not sure why this is so complicated, we can bump Shakir and/or Crowder outside, not full time but 20-30% snaps per game.  In addition, we split out a TE or RB to the "1" position alot in our empty sets.  Same as last year when Manny was around, Shakir/Crowder will fill his role.  Then yes, Jake will get some time if needed.

 

3.  Backup S: Yes, IMO, Hamlin could be our starter in another year or so.  He and Johnson certainly capable of filling in, not all pro, but Dane Jackson level talent. So yes better than the DBs you listed.

 

4. Backup G: this is the one position I agree I'm concerned with depth, however Beane specifically mentioned Cody in his post-draft presser as a player they expect to improve this season.  I'm still not investing in a Rd 1/2 G though.  Sweet spot would have been Round 3, but they liked Bernard.  Quesenberry can kick inside to G as well.  New coaches want "their guys", so I trust Kromer had plenty of say in what he needs up front.  Potentially Boetgger is ready midway through season as well.

 

5.  Zone CB philosophy: we've "managed" the CB position in past years, but that hasn't got us over the top. We need talent at both corner spots against top tier QBs, plain and simple.

 

You should go back and watch the Kc game, then listen to Beane and McD post season presser and pre-draft presser.  All point to this team needing more "speed and versatility", and continuing to get after the QB upfront.  Which is exactly what they achieved, via FA and draft.

No pun intended, but let's back up a second here.  

 

When you have a relatively loaded roster, which the Bills have - some true stars and plenty of above average starters, there's always going to be what looks like a big drop off in depth.   The guys who would look like decent backups for Poyer and Hyde, for example, are guys who are good enough to starters on rebuilding teams.  They don't want to be backups when they can start, and they can get paid more starting somewhere.  

 

Every team wants offensive linemen, starters and backups.  Why take backup money in Buffalo when you can get starter money someplace else?

 

Plus, good teams like the Bills have a lot of money wrapped up in their QBs, and if they're lucky, they've committed money to a Diggs and a Miller.   So, the Bills just don't have the luxury of having overpriced backups sitting around.  

 

Finally, if the only problem worth talking about in Buffalo is the quality of the backups, that means there's a lot stuff to be happy about.  

[John from Riverside]

23 minutes ago, MasterStrategist said:

1. Backup LT: Spencer Brown, they will either plug Quesenberry in at RT, or if Doyle progresses then Tommy.

 

2. Backup Outside WR: not sure why this is so complicated, we can bump Shakir and/or Crowder outside, not full time but 20-30% snaps per game.  In addition, we split out a TE or RB to the "1" position alot in our empty sets.  Same as last year when Manny was around, Shakir/Crowder will fill his role.  Then yes, Jake will get some time if needed.

 

3.  Backup S: Yes, IMO, Hamlin could be our starter in another year or so.  He and Johnson certainly capable of filling in, not all pro, but Dane Jackson level talent. So yes better than the DBs you listed.

 

4. Backup G: this is the one position I agree I'm concerned with depth, however Beane specifically mentioned Cody in his post-draft presser as a player they expect to improve this season.  I'm still not investing in a Rd 1/2 G though.  Sweet spot would have been Round 3, but they liked Bernard.  Quesenberry can kick inside to G as well.  New coaches want "their guys", so I trust Kromer had plenty of say in what he needs up front.  Potentially Boetgger is ready midway through season as well.

 

5.  Zone CB philosophy: we've "managed" the CB position in past years, but that hasn't got us over the top. We need talent at both corner spots against top tier QBs, plain and simple.

 

You should go back and watch the Kc game, then listen to Beane and McD post season presser and pre-draft presser.  All point to this team needing more "speed and versatility", and continuing to get after the QB upfront.  Which is exactly what they achieved, via FA and draft.

LOL if you think Spencer Brown is not the starter at RT.......I got some land to sell ya

[MrEpsYtown]

4 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

LOL if you think Spencer Brown is not the starter at RT.......I got some land to sell ya

 

I think he meant that if Dion goes down they would flip Brown to the other side and bring in a RT, which is something they did last year when Dion was out. 

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

I think he meant that if Dion goes down they would flip Brown to the other side and bring in a RT, which is something they did last year when Dion was out. 

if that is the case then my bad.  Not a fan of bumping Brown to LT in injury situation.......have a swing OT for that

[MrEpsYtown]

25 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

if that is the case then my bad.  Not a fan of bumping Brown to LT in injury situation.......have a swing OT for that

 

Yeah I agree. I think a young developing guy is way better just kind of staying on one side, at least as a tackle. For me a guard doesn't matter as much. 

[DapperCam]

A little bit of a reach in my opinion, and we probably could have gotten a little bit more positional value out of this pick.

 

I think he'll be our 3rd down back if he shows that he can be a good pass blocker. I expect 5 or so runs per game and 3-5 targets (that's about 15% of the offensive plays). I'm thinking screen passes, slants, wheel routes, etc. Singletary will still be the every down back IMO. If he shows he's really dangerous, I could see carries and targets increasing as the year goes on.

 

Singletary is in the last year of his contract, and Cook will be given the chance to take over the #1 role next year.

[MasterStrategist]

 

3 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

LOL if you think Spencer Brown is not the starter at RT.......I got some land to sell ya

Yes, only if Dion goes down.  I'm not advocating for Brown as our swing tackle.

 

He's our 2nd best LT on the roster

Edited May 2, 2022 by MasterStrategist

[Sierra Foothills]

8 hours ago, H2o said:

Now the question will be who sticks at RB on the roster? After Cook, Singletary is a lock. He's not going anywhere. Taiwan Jones was resigned for ST purposes. I don't see them cutting him, though it could possibly happen depending on how the ST group shakes out. I think both Moss and Johnson are on the roster bubble at this point. We usually only have 2 active RB's on game day because of how they use Taiwan. The 3rd guy is really going to have to stand out and I believe Johnson will show more value than Moss. 

 

It's a fair question as to which running backs are active on game day but we have to remember that we have a new OC. There's tons of speculation that Dorsey will use more 12 personnel, possibly 21 personnel. We can't assume that there will only be 3 running back active on game day.

 

That said I agree that either Moss or Duke Johnson will make the team but not both.

 

7 hours ago, junior said:

Singletary started performing much better once he became the #1 guy, who got the overwhelming majority of touches out of the backfield. He never seemed to get into a groove when he and Moss were 1A and 1B. Not saying it can't be done with Cook, but I'm not holding out hope that Singletary will perform like he did the back half of the year if he's in a near-equal timeshare with Cook.

 

With Singletary on the last year of his contract, he'd better perform regardless of the time share or he'll be replaced. A team can't carry a player who can only perform well under certain circumstances... the tail doesn't wag the dog.

 

5 hours ago, Ralonzo said:

James won’t be a lead back or a bell cow but what differentiates him from 90% of backs is that he is not limited in the passing game to “release and present numbers” routes. Most of what Georgia did with him looks like what the Saints do with Kamara - most of the time. Run him on quick hitters, or have him release to the flat as an outlet. (That may have something to do with QB limitations too)

 

But once in a while, they’ll use ‘em in a place that you don’t see RBs pre-snap, like wide on the boundary. Each of those guys can run routes like receivers, track the ball like receivers, catch like receivers. That’s the X-factor with Cook or Kamara. You leave them isolated on a LB at the boundary, that’s a tremendous mismatch, unlike, say, Patrick DiMarco on a wheel route.

 

I was a proponent of Cook in the 3rd or 4th pre-draft, I hoped for Andersen in the 2nd and Cook in the 3rd as the draft developed, but I’m not going to be put off of what I saw as Cook’s possibilities in this offense due to a perceived reach on draft value.

 

Excellent point. Cook is not simply a screen pass or swing pass back. He goes out into the pattern like Marshall Faulk. He's THAT kind of receiving back.

 

Those that wanted to see the Bills draft a WR more highly are somewhat missing this point.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

 

5 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Who backs up Hyde and Poyer?    Are Hamlin and Johnson better prospects than Lee and Griffin and McCloud at CB?    They are just as unproven.   Athletically McCloud has the same raw speed and athletic traits as Kaiir Elam.   It's not like they had nobody with any athletic potential to play a CB position that is protected by scheme.

 

I'm unclear on what this sentence means.  Are you asking whether Hamlin and Johnson are better backup safety prospects than Lee, Griffin, and McCloud?

 

 

 

[junior]

33 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

It's a fair question as to which running backs are active on game day but we have to remember that we have a new OC. There's tons of speculation that Dorsey will use more 12 personnel, possibly 21 personnel. We can't assume that there will only be 3 running back active on game day.

 

That said I agree that either Moss or Duke Johnson will make the team but not both.

 

 

With Singletary on the last year of his contract, he'd better perform regardless of the time share or he'll be replaced. A team can't carry a player who can only perform well under certain circumstances... the tail doesn't wag the dog.

 

 

Excellent point. Cook is not simply a screen pass or swing pass back. He goes out into the pattern like Marshall Faulk. He's THAT kind of receiving back.

 

Those that wanted to see the Bills draft a WR more highly are somewhat missing this point.

 

 

So if the running game is slumping Week 12 because we're forcing Singletary into a 1A/1B situation with Cook, what's the plan for the rest of the season and playoffs? To keep doing it because the tail doesn't wag the dog? Or to stick Singletary as the clear cut #1?

 

[BADOLBILZ]

3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

 

 

I'm unclear on what this sentence means.  Are you asking whether Hamlin and Johnson are better backup safety prospects than Lee, Griffin, and McCloud?

 

 

 

 

 

Yes but I meant Cam Lewis........not Lee.

 

None of the reserve CB's or Safeties has played enough defensive snaps to be proven.

 

I'd put Lewis and Hamlin on the same level.........Lewis has been the most notable of the backups in the secondary when he has played..........but Hamlin has better measurables for his position.

 

Jaquan Johnson I just don't think has the ability to step in for several games and not be abused.........he's a 4.70 40 guy and has looked like it when he's played.    He's a special teamer.

 

McCloud's athletic profile is very much like Kaiir Elam.  Similar 4.37 40.......a bit bigger wingspan and hands.   He has nice potential for a zone CB.  He played some defense(briefly) in his 2 games for the Bills last year.

 

Griffin was a 4 star recruit with good size and 4.5 speed.   Very adequate physical traits for the position.

 

Josh Thomas has adequate size and good speed for a safety but like Griffin has not played. 

 

[Sierra Foothills]

50 minutes ago, junior said:

So if the running game is slumping Week 12 because we're forcing Singletary into a 1A/1B situation with Cook, what's the plan for the rest of the season and playoffs? To keep doing it because the tail doesn't wag the dog? Or to stick Singletary as the clear cut #1?

 

 

My answer to you is my answer and a question to you:

 

My answer is that if Singletary can't be effective in a time share then two of Cook, Moss or Duke Johnson had better be.

 

My question is, if you were McDermott would you give Singletary the lion's share of the work (and keep the other RBs on the bench) simply because he can't be effective in a time share?

[FilthyBeast]

Great pick and likely means the end of the Zack Moss experiment for sure so hopefully Beane fleece a team for a late round pick in a trade instead of cutting him outright.

[BobbyC81]

Was out for lunch and the big screen TV had ESPN on.  There was an NFL segment and they were debating whether James Cook was a legitimate contender for Offensive Rookie of the Year.  Sound was off and I couldn’t read CC, but I thought it was interesting that anybody would be even having this discussion.

Edited May 3, 2022 by BobbyC81