Seems like Lamar Jackson isn't pleased with the Ravens tonight

[DCofNC]

13 hours ago, The Wiz said:

Is he seriously referring to himself in the 3rd person?

Yep, with amazing punctuation as well.

[Rico]

1 hour ago, LeGOATski said:

You think Murray is better than Jackson?

Yeah, I’d rather have Lamar than a midget QB, especially after seeing Murray against the Rams in the playoffs last year. 

[benderbender]

1 hour ago, LeGOATski said:

I bet they'd take the trade straight up.

If I was Arizona, I would do it in a heartbeat. Ravens letting Lamar twist in the wind despite being their presumptive franchise QB who has delivered more than Murray. Take the hail mary out of his resume and what has Murray done? Has Murray done charitable work? Did he humbly sign autographs for opposing fans after the biggest defeat of his career? Murray was publicly demanding an extension before he was actually able to do so, Lamar was a league MVP. Murray is rumored to be selfish and immature. Which is to be expected for his age, but not for his position. If we're calling their physical talents equal (exceptional runner, middling passer) then the tie breaker would be experience and locker room presence. 

[Rico]

33 minutes ago, benderbender said:

If I was Arizona, I would do it in a heartbeat. Ravens letting Lamar twist in the wind despite being their presumptive franchise QB who has delivered more than Murray. Take the hail mary out of his resume and what has Murray done? Has Murray done charitable work? Did he humbly sign autographs for opposing fans after the biggest defeat of his career? Murray was publicly demanding an extension before he was actually able to do so, Lamar was a league MVP. Murray is rumored to be selfish and immature. Which is to be expected for his age, but not for his position. If we're calling their physical talents equal (exceptional runner, middling passer) then the tie breaker would be experience and locker room presence. 

True. Other than the Hail Mary, Lamar is FAR more clutch. I like clutch players.

[Doc]

Glad it's them and not us.  Finally.

[LeviF]

Lamar has a strong case to make after the Watson deal. They have a similar playoff record and only one has an MVP under his belt. 
 

I’m not saying I’d give it to him. But I am saying that he’s not being entirely unreasonable based solely on the counting stats. 
 

https://stathead.com/tiny/HjBk2

[The Wiz]

1 hour ago, LeviF said:

Lamar has a strong case to make after the Watson deal. They have a similar playoff record and only one has an MVP under his belt. 
 

I’m not saying I’d give it to him. But I am saying that he’s not being entirely unreasonable based solely on the counting stats. 
 

https://stathead.com/tiny/HjBk2

My only argument, if you're going to go by stats alone:

 

His tds have been down since mvp season,  ints have been up and he average 100 yards less per game passing than Watson.

 

I know he's more electric as a runner but in a passing league he's not going to do himself any favors, or any receiver that plays for him, by trying to be a one man running show.  

Edited May 29, 2022 by The Wiz

[wjag]

I really think this is a make or break year for him.  And it's not just because of the contract status.  He has been knocked out of the last two seasons.  And that narrative is out there.  Can he play that way and stay healthy enough to complete a 20 game season?  He was concussed in Buffalo to end one season and had a deep bone bruise on his ankle last year.  Should be interesting to see how his game evolves.

[nosejob]

I think Lamar...regardless of what any of us think of him, needs an agent like Drew R. Like the old saying goes..."He who represents himself, has a fool for an attorney" ....and I think he can go farther than Murray. I also think that being used the way he is may be weighing on his mind as to how long he will last, and I don't blame him.

 

I'll give Roman credit for what he's done, but it ain't sustainable. All I can currently fault Lamar for is lack of common sense. Ma Ma Ma Ma Mamma says.....

Edited May 30, 2022 by nosejob

[ganesh]

22 hours ago, nosejob said:

I think Lamar...regardless of what any of us think of him, needs an agent like Drew R. Like the old saying goes..."He who represents himself, has a fool for an attorney" ....and I think he can go farther than Murray. I also think that being used the way he is may be weighing on his mind as to how long he will last, and I don't blame him.

 

I'll give Roman credit for what he's done, but it ain't sustainable. All I can currently fault Lamar for is lack of common sense. Ma Ma Ma Ma Mamma says.....

I think it really comes down to what are Lamar's aspirations and what the Ravens are willing to pay him.

 

The Raven's organization would have to understand that the market for elite QBs is $45M per year now with about 150 to 200M guaranteed.    They would also have to thank Cleveland Browns for guaranteeing the 250M for Watson as now that becomes the barometer to gauge. 

 

Lamar needs to understand the value of signing a deal in this ballpark and move on with his career as winning a SuperBowl should be most important. 

 

The real questions are:

* What does Lamar want ?

* What are the Ravens offering. ? 

* How far apart are those two things.

 

Josh Allen took the first contract offered as his focus is to win the SB.  Taking a little less also allows Beane to surround Allen with better talent.  Allen has chose the way of Brady and Rothlisberger so that his team remains competitive every year.  Lamar needs to find that same soft spot that will help the Ravens be competitive. 

[badassgixxer05]

On 5/27/2022 at 11:52 AM, Nextmanup said:

Yeah, but that's true of any position, any style of player, any play.

There is no real evidence to suggest that QB who runs = injury risk.

 

A QB could lose the season standing in the pocket and getting his ankle rolled by his own lineman.

 

 

The more contact you are taking the more risk for injury. That's just physics. True you can get hurt on any play, but why raise the risk? Running QBs are at higher risk. Why do you think RB life in football is so short? They get worn down faster from the extra contact. They dont have the bigger bodies of a lineman to sustain.

[RocCityRoller]

Interesting question here.... If I had to choose between these QBs today.

 

Lamar Jackson vs Kyler Murray....

Both are goofy on how they are handling their next contract.

Jackson - representing himself and not even talking

Murray - a year early, coming off a terrible playoff showing, going public

 

I would take Murray by the smallest of margins. He does have a nice pass, and I think he is a bit more football smart (complicated passing schemes).

Jackson has taken some hits and abuse, and one wonders if Jackson today will equal prior years.

I can drop Murray into most standard passing offenses, Jackson maybe not.

 

Jackson seems the better leader though... that counts at QB. Murray has some growing up to do.

 

Oof. Happy to have Josh Allen.

[4merper4mer]

4 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

Interesting question here.... If I had to choose between these QBs today.

 

Lamar Jackson vs Kyler Murray....

Both are goofy on how they are handling their next contract.

Jackson - representing himself and not even talking

Murray - a year early, coming off a terrible playoff showing, going public

 

I would take Murray by the smallest of margins. He does have a nice pass, and I think he is a bit more football smart (complicated passing schemes).

Jackson has taken some hits and abuse, and one wonders if Jackson today will equal prior years.

I can drop Murray into most standard passing offenses, Jackson maybe not.

 

Jackson seems the better leader though... that counts at QB. Murray has some growing up to do.

 

Oof. Happy to have Josh Allen.

I get that people can have varying opinions on this but I’m baffled that anyone would take Murray over Jackson.  
 

Although unusual, there is nothing unprofessional about how Jackson is handling his contract.  Murray is not being a professional.

 

On the field Murray has had repeated failures in big games and moments.  Yes he is still young and that could change, but Jackson is also young.  Jackson has had injury concerns and isn’t perfect by any stretch but he has also had some big wins, including playoff games.  When the going gets tough is is visually obvious that Murray wilts while Jackson gives max effort.  Jackson 100 times out of 100 for me.

[The Wiz]

40 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

I get that people can have varying opinions on this but I’m baffled that anyone would take Murray over Jackson.  
 

Although unusual, there is nothing unprofessional about how Jackson is handling his contract.  Murray is not being a professional.

 

On the field Murray has had repeated failures in big games and moments.  Yes he is still young and that could change, but Jackson is also young.  Jackson has had injury concerns and isn’t perfect by any stretch but he has also had some big wins, including playoff games.  When the going gets tough is is visually obvious that Murray wilts while Jackson gives max effort.  Jackson 100 times out of 100 for me.

Professional or not, we've seen hundreds of players act the same way Murray has when they want to get paid. 

 

Lamar's stance is just odd.  They want to work with him but he's silent.  Sounds like he's not happy about where he is now than how much he wants to get paid. 

 

Either that or he is getting the offer from the ravens and just not responding because he thinks he's worth more which you could also consider unprofessional. 

[RocCityRoller]

2 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

I get that people can have varying opinions on this but I’m baffled that anyone would take Murray over Jackson.  
 

Although unusual, there is nothing unprofessional about how Jackson is handling his contract.  Murray is not being a professional.

 

On the field Murray has had repeated failures in big games and moments.  Yes he is still young and that could change, but Jackson is also young.  Jackson has had injury concerns and isn’t perfect by any stretch but he has also had some big wins, including playoff games.  When the going gets tough is is visually obvious that Murray wilts while Jackson gives max effort.  Jackson 100 times out of 100 for me.

 

Difference of opinion here, and I understand it. I don't like either situation TBH.

 

I might ditch both and bring in Mayfield. If I am the Cardinals or Ravens why not?

I think Mayfield has been humbled publicly and dealt with it petty well.

Mayfield has a better chance of being a 'Brees light' who was scorned by his drafted team and then went on to be very good QB IMO than Jackson or Murray.

This will motivate him, like college. If I am a team with an unsettled QB situation Mayfield is an easy 2nd round pick and pay the $18M.

That is mid level QB pay today, and Mayfield is that.

 

But if the question is Jackson vs Murray as of today, right now, who do I commit to for 4 yrs?

 

Murray.

 

I can drop Murray into any passing offensive scheme and Murray will get it and produce. He isn't top 10 in passing, but neither is Jackson.

I think I can get Murray to understand an E-P or Coryell scheme better than Jackson. I have to modify my offense less for Murry than Jackson.

Murray's game lasts longer than Jackson IMO.

 

Jackson is like Mike Vick. You have to change the offense to make it work. When he is 'on' it is special, really special. But the situation has to be right.

Baltimore is about 5-10 yrs behind the modern offense. It will take 2-3 yrs to recover without Jackson. That is why they need Jackson to commit to them.

 

With Murray I can drop him into any basic NFL offense, and go forward year one, even if he is a douche bag.

 

I don't like Murray at all. But this isn't a popularity contest. Murray is a better passer than Jackson, that is what I need my QB to do.

[ganesh]

3 hours ago, The Wiz said:

Professional or not, we've seen hundreds of players act the same way Murray has when they want to get paid. 

 

Lamar's stance is just odd.  They want to work with him but he's silent.  Sounds like he's not happy about where he is now than how much he wants to get paid. 

 

Either that or he is getting the offer from the ravens and just not responding because he thinks he's worth more which you could also consider unprofessional. 

The Ravens also could be low-balling hin... THey might be offering a $30M a year contract!

[The Wiz]

Just now, ganesh said:

The Ravens also could be low-balling hin... THey might be offering a $30M a year contract!

I know. It's awful. 

 

[ganesh]

4 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

I get that people can have varying opinions on this but I’m baffled that anyone would take Murray over Jackson.  
 

Although unusual, there is nothing unprofessional about how Jackson is handling his contract.  Murray is not being a professional.

 

On the field Murray has had repeated failures in big games and moments.  Yes he is still young and that could change, but Jackson is also young.  Jackson has had injury concerns and isn’t perfect by any stretch but he has also had some big wins, including playoff games.  When the going gets tough is is visually obvious that Murray wilts while Jackson gives max effort.  Jackson 100 times out of 100 for me.

Agreed.  Lamar is a much better player than Murray.  Lamar won an MVP throwing 36 TD passes.   Also, Murray is just "One Season" younger than the 2018 draft pick.

[4merper4mer]

2 hours ago, RocCityRoller said:

 

Difference of opinion here, and I understand it. I don't like either situation TBH.

 

I might ditch both and bring in Mayfield. If I am the Cardinals or Ravens why not?

I think Mayfield has been humbled publicly and dealt with it petty well.

Mayfield has a better chance of being a 'Brees light' who was scorned by his drafted team and then went on to be very good QB IMO than Jackson or Murray.

This will motivate him, like college. If I am a team with an unsettled QB situation Mayfield is an easy 2nd round pick and pay the $18M.

That is mid level QB pay today, and Mayfield is that.

 

But if the question is Jackson vs Murray as of today, right now, who do I commit to for 4 yrs?

 

Murray.

 

I can drop Murray into any passing offensive scheme and Murray will get it and produce. He isn't top 10 in passing, but neither is Jackson.

I think I can get Murray to understand an E-P or Coryell scheme better than Jackson. I have to modify my offense less for Murry than Jackson.

Murray's game lasts longer than Jackson IMO.

 

Jackson is like Mike Vick. You have to change the offense to make it work. When he is 'on' it is special, really special. But the situation has to be right.

Baltimore is about 5-10 yrs behind the modern offense. It will take 2-3 yrs to recover without Jackson. That is why they need Jackson to commit to them.

 

With Murray I can drop him into any basic NFL offense, and go forward year one, even if he is a douche bag.

 

I don't like Murray at all. But this isn't a popularity contest. Murray is a better passer than Jackson, that is what I need my QB to do.

We disagree pretty much across the board..  That’s fine.  To me Baker and Murray both have a narrow path left to success because they are self absorbed and wilt under pressure.  Murray for sure….Baker I think so but he was playing hurt so maaaaaaaybe….but I’m not rolling those dice.  They both have to change their approach /personality.  Very few do that.  
 

Jackson is a team player and high effort guy.  He gives a chance to his team in any given game.  The odds of him winning 4 playoff games in a row are probably low but his team and he will both keep trying until the end.  The two other guys are clownish and have had teammate issues.  That outweighs any scheme adjustment advantages they may bring.

Edited June 1, 2022 by 4merper4mer

[Warcodered]