Name some good outside cornerbacks with sub 30 inch arms.

[NewEra]

I’ve been searching and I’m coming up blank.  There are some good slot corners, but I don’t know of any outside guys.  If you know of any, list them.  Please and thanks.  
 

There were 2 corners drafted with sub 30 inch arms last year.  Elijah Molden and Avery Williams.  Both slots.  

4 DB prospects in the 2020 draft.  Some may be safeties.  Don’t think any are in the nfl

 

i think there were 2 in 2019 draft-  neither of which are in the nfl I don’t think.  

6 DBs in the 2018 draft. A few of them are safeties, including Jordan Whitehad.  Donte Jackson was the only first rd pick in 2018-2021.  He’s just been average. I wouldn’t consider him good. 

 

 

 

Edited April 27, 2022 by NewEra

[Virgil]

Deja vu

[Buffalo716]

@NewEraThe closest I could find would be Antoine Winfield 30 1/8 

 

Mcduffie is 29 3/4 

 

So that is like 3/8 off 

 

Not a lot of people honestly... 

 

But his almost 40 inch vertical could also make up some room

Edited April 26, 2022 by Buffalo716

[BillsFanForever19]

Here we go again...

 

McDuffie is a player who didn't allow a single TD in his final two seasons of College Football. Where he surely lined up against many 6 foot plus WR's who play or will play in the NFL. Yes, he has sub 30" arms. But it's a quarter inch under 30.

 

Also, you have to keep in mind he has a 38.5" vertical leap at his Pro day. This would have put him in 5th among all CB's at the Combine. This ability makes up for outstretched arm length on contested balls when leaving his feet. 

 

He is still considered a top prospect at the position despite less than ideal measurables for his technique, football IQ, and his play. There have been players at other positions who have succeeded because of their proficiency in other aspects while having weaknesses in others. I remember all the talk of Ed Oliver's lack of ideal measurements heading into the Draft. But his proficiency on field outweighed that. The same could be the case with McDuffie.

 

There was a time when a QB under 6 foot couldn't succeed in this league. It's why Russell Wilson wasn't drafted until Round 3. Now the league is drafting Kyler Murray 1st overall. Sometimes there are outliers to the rule. Looking back through the years, I can't really find many, if any, instances of a top Draft Prospect at Cornerback with his measurements. But that doesn't discount everything he's done to this point or completely dismiss that he can be an outlier to the rule.

 

Ultimately, we'll find out this weekend if this is as big of a concern to teams is it is to some of you on this board. I weigh what is seen watching a player play much more than measurements. If Beane selects him, both he and McDuffie have my total faith.

Edited April 26, 2022 by BillsFanForever19

[Bill from NYC]

Great post, but we can't let little things like that stop us from drafting a first round defensive back. I mean.....forget Josh Allen. He is already good. Why waste picks on blockers and/or receivers?

We have history to fall back on. Donte Whitner (the 2nd ranked safety in 2006) had arms that were 30.63 inches. I lost count of the games that he won for the Bills! Levy and Jauron didn't want desperately needed help on both lines. Of course not, as long as there was an undersized defensive back to grab in round 1 and pay 36 million dollars to. 

[GolfandBills]

7 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Great post, but we can't let little things like that stop us from drafting a first round defensive back. I mean.....forget Josh Allen. He is already good. Why waste picks on blockers and/or receivers?

We have history to fall back on. Donte Whitner (the 2nd ranked safety in 2006) had arms that were 30.63 inches. I lost count of the games that he won for the Bills! Levy and Jauron didn't want desperately needed help on both lines. Of course not, as long as there was an undersized defensive back to grab in round 1 and pay 36 million dollars to. 

I don’t think it’s a little thing.  History shows most of those guys struggle in the NFL

[BillsFanForever19]

15 minutes ago, GolfandBills said:

I don’t think it’s a little thing.  History shows most of those guys struggle in the NFL

 

I think more than anything, history shows that there haven't been top prospects that have those measurements. Going back a number of years, those that have had those measurements did not perform at the level of McDuffie in College. Their skill was not at his level. Therefore, them underperforming in the Pros was not surprising.

 

The closest I could find that was a top prospect was Damon Arnette at an even 30, as opposed to McDuffie's 29.75. He was still taken 19th overall. Unfortunately, between injuries and his own idiocy, we never got to see if he could overcome this supposed sure fire death blow to his potential everyone is making arm length out to be.

[Bill from NYC]

24 minutes ago, GolfandBills said:

I don’t think it’s a little thing.  History shows most of those guys struggle in the NFL

Sorry that my sarcasm wasn't evident.

[freddyjj]

@NewEraHere is a hall of famer with 30.5 in arms and a very poor RAS.  55 career INTs, 8 pro bowls and 3 time 1st team all pro.  Went 59th overall which was #4 pick in 3rd round in 1991.  Aeneas Williams, Cards. I realize arms > 30 but shows metrics can be wrong

 

As for Trent Mcduffie his RAS IS 9.49.

from Yahoo Sports:

The biggest concern with McDuffie is his sub-30” arms (29.75”), which puts him in the fifth-percentile for length. Per PFF’s Austin Gayle, the only corners with sub-30” arms to play 400-plus snaps in any season since 2017 are Ross Cockrell, Donte Jackson, Cameron Sutton, Troy Hill and Avonte Maddox. And while he looked good in his press-man opportunities, McDuffie played a lot of zone coverage in college

 

RAS scores for listed players above:

Jackson 7.04

Cockrell 3.04

Sutton 6.06

Troy Hill 2.91

Maddox 8.86

 

Last note of interest, Cockrell and Maddox were Pitt Panthers and Bills and Carolina drafted each respectively.  Bills have met with Damarri Mathis from Pitt - 9.72 RAS with 4.39 speed and 31.5 in arms.  He is my 4th rd sleeper for the Bills who have Jackson and Hamlin from Pitt already. 

 

Edited April 26, 2022 by freddyjj

[John from Riverside]

If you can play you can play

[GunnerBill]

I don't think anyone has suggested the arm length will stop McDuffie being able to play in the NFL. I actually think he is very unlikely to be a bust. At worst I think he will be a very good slot corner. The point on McDuffie is I do see a ceiling limitation based on both his measurables and his play style. I don't think he will ever be a true high level #1 outside corner. I see him more as a good #2 corner on the outside or a top end slot. Then your question becomes is that worth a top 25 pick in the NFL draft? 

 

To me the answer is still, no. 

Edited April 26, 2022 by GunnerBill

[machine gun kelly]

Era, if you have the time to research arm length In recent history for outside CB’s, god bless ya.

[Thurman#1]

Antoine Winfield Sr.

 

Who was pretty damn good.

 

I just thought back real quick, "short corners, short corners ... ah, Winfield."

 

29 3/4s. Which is familiar from somewhere, isn't it?

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

I don't think anyone has suggested the arm length will stop McDuffie being able to play in the NFL. I actually think he is very unlikely to be a bust. At worst I think he will be a very good slot corner. The point on McDuffie is I do see a ceiling limitation based on both his measurables and his play style. I don't think he will ever be a true high level #1 outside corner. I see him more as a good #2 corner on the outside or a top end slot. Then your question becomes is that worth a top 25 pick in the NFL draft? 

 

To me the answer is still, no. 

Mckduffie always reminded me of an Antone Winfield type If mckduffie can get to that level I have no problem using the 25th pick on him

[NewEra]

7 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

Here we go again...

 

McDuffie is a player who didn't allow a single TD in his final two seasons of College Football. Where he surely lined up against many 6 foot plus WR's who play or will play in the NFL. Yes, he has sub 30" arms. But it's a quarter inch under 30.

 

Also, you have to keep in mind he has a 38.5" vertical leap at his Pro day. This would have put him in 5th among all CB's at the Combine. This ability makes up for outstretched arm length on contested balls when leaving his feet. 

 

He is still considered a top prospect at the position despite less than ideal measurables for his technique, football IQ, and his play. There have been players at other positions who have succeeded because of their proficiency in other aspects while having weaknesses in others. I remember all the talk of Ed Oliver's lack of ideal measurements heading into the Draft. But his proficiency on field outweighed that. The same could be the case with McDuffie.

 

There was a time when a QB under 6 foot couldn't succeed in this league. It's why Russell Wilson wasn't drafted until Round 3. Now the league is drafting Kyler Murray 1st overall. Sometimes there are outliers to the rule. Looking back through the years, I can't really find many, if any, instances of a top Draft Prospect at Cornerback with his measurements. But that doesn't discount everything he's done to this point or completely dismiss that he can be an outlier to the rule.

 

Ultimately, we'll find out this weekend if this is as big of a concern to teams is it is to some of you on this board. I weigh what is seen watching a player play much more than measurements. If Beane selects him, both he and McDuffie have my total faith.

Here I go again…..making completely valid points…..MY BAD.  
 

yet there isn’t ONE good cornerback in the nfl with sub 30 inch arms.  Sounds like we should take Mcduffie….if we want to be stubborn idiots.  Maybe this ONE cornerback will be great….while no other have been. In round one, no thanks. 

6 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

I think more than anything, history shows that there haven't been top prospects that have those measurements. Going back a number of years, those that have had those measurements did not perform at the level of McDuffie in College. Their skill was not at his level. Therefore, them underperforming in the Pros was not surprising.

 

The closest I could find that was a top prospect was Damon Arnette at an even 30, as opposed to McDuffie's 29.75. He was still taken 19th overall. Unfortunately, between injuries and his own idiocy, we never got to see if he could overcome this supposed sure fire death blow to his potential everyone is making arm length out to be.

History shows that…..Trent McDuffie is the only good short armed cb in history.   He must truly be a superstar.  

4 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

If you can play you can play

But there’s never been one that can…. Interesting 

4 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

Era, if you have the time to research arm length In recent history for outside CB’s, god bless ya.

Google search is hard.  “insert draft year here” combine measurements.  Scroll.  Takes about a minute or 2 per draft class.  

[NewEra]

3 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

Antoine Winfield Sr.

 

Who was pretty damn good.

 

I just thought back real quick, "short corners, short corners ... ah, Winfield."

 

29 3/4s. Which is familiar from somewhere, isn't it?

Thanks.  There’s 1!

[CookieG]

Ok.  You have some who emphasize arm length.  Some who emphasize RAS.

 

Fine.  Don't take any chances.

 

Zyon McCollum

CB Sam Houston State

Height: 6-2 | Weight: 199 | RAS: 10

 

Arms 30 3/4"

 

Take him in the 3rd after taking McDuffie in the 1st.

 

God, I'm turning into DIck Jauron...excuse me while I go upchuck.

[Shake_My_Head]

4 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

Antoine Winfield Sr.

Here's the rest of Winfield's measurables:

 

https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=4911

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

Should wingspan also be considered in this case? If McDuffie has a wider chest/shoulders it would increase his wingspan.

[Shake_My_Head]

Here's a really neat source of historic combine mesurables data that's sortable by position:

 

https://nflcombineresults.com/nflcombinedata_expanded.php?year=all&pos=CB&college=

 

McDuffie's 29.75" arms appear to be a real liability based on all the other CBs drafted over time.   Outside of Winfield (29.75"), Arron Glenn (30.0"), Cam Sutton (30.0"), Will Allen (30.0") or even LEODIS F'n MCKELVIN! (30.125") I don't recognize many standout players with shorter arms, let alone first round picks.