What is The Weakest Position on The Bills Roster That Pick 25 Would Instantly Make the Team Stronger ?

[Rochesterfan]

Just now, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

No one has come out and said Tre is "ahead of schedule". You have an incredibly optimistic view on this. I HOPE he is ahead of schedule. But again, no one has said that. Just that he is "on schedule" -

 

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2022/3/2/22958602/tredavious-white-on-schedule-in-return-from-injury

 

As the article states, an ACL is a 9-12 week injury. He had his surgery on 12/14/21. 9 months would bring us to 9/14. And that is the soonest he can start PRACTICING. That doesn't mean the second those 9 months are up, they're just going to throw him on the field.

 

Also, 9 months is the soonest doctors recommend. Generally, they recommend an entire year. Studies have shown pushing recovery time puts an athlete at a much greater risk of a second ACL injury -

 

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/2325967120985636

 

Your prognosis of him doing work in Training Camp and starting Week 1 is incorrect.

 

Actually Sal has said it on more than one occasion and when he had Parrino or Jon Scott on the other day - they said the same thing.  
 

They both said everything they have heard was he was ahead of schedule and they were hoping to find out more with him at OTAs, but the Bills did not make him available so far.

 

Players come back all the time now and are playing by 6 to 9 months.  The timeline projected was the one Sal talked about as unlike normal people - Tre has access to 0 stress workout like underwater treadmills where they can regain strength without putting weight on the knee.  They begin working out now much sooner than they could do in the past.

 

They also have increased access to flexibility experts to ensure they have flexibility to regain motion as they are in constant physical therapy.  More and more players are coming back like Amari Rodgers at 6-8 months after surgery.  As long as they are well managed.

 

We will see where it ends up, but unless he has a set back the guys covering the team seem to think he would not hit the IR and would be able to do limited snaps early in the season.

 

Did you read the Buffalo Rumblings article - they put him as back at the end of the Pre-season.  Not starting practice, but that would be his optimal return date.

[BillsFanForever19]

2 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

Did you read the Buffalo Rumblings article - they put him as back at the end of the Pre-season.  Not starting practice, but that would be his optimal return date.

 

The article states "White was injured at the end of November, so even an optimistic return timeline puts him at the end of the preseason".

 

What this article fails to take into account, is (for whatever reason) he waited over two weeks before doing the surgery on 12/14. So you need to add that time to that.

 

And you're reading in between the lines. "Return" does not specifically mean immediately playing games. Return can easily refer to return to practicing with the team. Which is much more likely.

 

If you think that a.) They're going to rush this and risk re-injury or b.) He's going to immediately hit the field at 100% potential and taking 100% snaps - you're not being realistic. And again, even if they did do this, that would put him returning Week 3 or 4.

[Rochesterfan]

25 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

No one has come out and said Tre is "ahead of schedule". You have an incredibly optimistic view on this. I HOPE he is ahead of schedule. But again, no one has said that. Just that he is "on schedule" -

 

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2022/3/2/22958602/tredavious-white-on-schedule-in-return-from-injury

 

As the article states, an ACL is a 9-12 month injury. He had his surgery on 12/14/21. 9 months would bring us to 9/14. And that is the soonest he can start PRACTICING. That doesn't mean the second those 9 months are up, they're just going to throw him on the field.

 

Also, 9 months is the soonest doctors recommend. Generally, they recommend an entire year. Studies have shown pushing recovery time puts an athlete at a much greater risk of a second ACL injury -

 

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/2325967120985636

 

Your prognosis of him doing work in Training Camp and starting Week 1 is incorrect. The best case scenario is we have somewhere around Week 4-6 Worst case scenario we are without him for the majority of the regular season.

 

As for Ike's Achilles - there has been advances in rehabilitation for Achilles that have shortened recovery time over the years. From an article about Ike found here - 

 

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2021/12/28/22855008/buffalo-bills-g-ike-boettgers-achilles-injury

 

 

 

Ike will be interesting - even Buffalo Rumblings expect him to start on PUP - unlike what they said about Tre’.

 

We will see - His last injury took him just about a year to get back when he tore the Achilles last time.

 

We will see how quickly he returns, but even when he got back the first time - it took a long time to regain his strength and ability to plant and set himself.

 

He might be back, but I would expect they are going to let him wait as there is no need to rush a back-up OL back, but Tre’ is a starting CB and if he feels ready - they will get him action as soon as he is cleared.  I don’t expect him to participate much in anything like TC, but I would not be surprised if by week 2 he is getting some snaps.

1 minute ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

The article states "White was injured at the end of November, so even an optimistic return timeline puts him at the end of the preseason".

 

What this article fails to take into account, is (for whatever reason) he waited over two weeks before doing the surgery on 12/14. So you need to add that time to that.

 

And you're reading in between the lines. "Return" does not specifically mean immediately playing games. Return can easily refer to return to practicing with the team. Which is much more likely.

 

If you think that a.) They're going to rush this and risk re-injury or b.) He's going to immediately hit the field at 100% potential and taking 100% snaps - you're not being realistic. And again, even if they did do this, that would put him returning Week 3 or 4.

 

I am not ready anything - I am going off from what people that talk to the team on a regular basis are saying about the timeline.

 

Either way we will find out later on, but since they have some of the best injury management people in the NFL - I will let them figure out when he is ready.

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

5 hours ago, SCBills said:

I wouldn’t say CB, because Tre will be back. 
 

Tre, Dane and Taron is a pretty solid trio and while someone like Booth (if available) might take it to another level, it seems the staff is high on Dane, and for good reason. 
 

Probably RB.  Not saying we should draft one at 25, but Breece Hall’s potential dwarfs anyone we have on the roster. 

 

Dane is a good backup, ok starter.  He can definitely be upgraded and we also don't know how Tre will play even when he is back, let alone knowing when he will actually be back.  

 

CB is without question the weakest unit right now and shallowest.  

[GolfandBills]

4 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Tre is coming off an ACL injury. Won't start the season, may or may not return to top form immediately. Dane Jackson lost the CB2 competition to Levi Wallace last season and underperformed expectations. Taron Johnson is a Nickel Corner.

 

We're heading into the Draft starting the season with Dane Jackson and Cam Lewis on the outside with Practice Squad players for depth and not signing any CB in Free Agency to replace Levi Wallace. Those that are left on the market at this point are on the wrong side of 30, have injury issues, and/or have declined in play. 

 

Outside Cornerback is a HUGE glaring issue.

Underperformed expectations?  He was a 7th round pick 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

There is no answer to the OP question other than CB.  There is no greater need this year.  Even the 5th best CB would be an upgrade over an uncertain Tre and Dane. 

 

I would not extend Edmunds and let him walk after this year. But you are not going to find a MLB at #25 that is vastly better than Edmunds.

 

WR and OL are needs. You can make an argument that a guard at #25 should be an upgrade over Bates and even Saffold this year. But both of them are serviceable for 2022.  If Brown regressed badly than you can make a case for OT at 25 but they will open the season with Brown at RT and hope he gets a little better in pass protection. 

 

[without a drought]

The only sure thing would be a punter

[wppete]

CB, OG, Punter. 

[BillsFanForever19]

17 minutes ago, GolfandBills said:

Underperformed expectations?  He was a 7th round pick 

 

Underperformed expectations following how he looked in spot work during his Rookie season. People thought he was a lock to take over at CB2. He was unable to win the competition and didn't look as good as he did in Year 1 when called upon in Year 2.

Edited April 24, 2022 by BillsFanForever19

[machine gun kelly]

5 hours ago, T master said:

As the draft gets closer we all have been listening to & seeing mocks that all the so called "Experts" put down who the Bills can pick at 25 but if there is one position group that could instantly upgrade the Bills that is in need of reinforcement which group do you think that is on the team ?

 

With the WR every one thinks that this could be or should be the pick at 25 but if it wasn't i think they could get a pick later in the draft that would have a good value & be able to pick up a good player Like Gabe was later that could help but that group is pretty strong now as it is  .

 

The O line i feel given who they have brought with as far as players & coaches will be better, the LB ing corp I think is still a strong group but could get a pick later, safety's i think can be as good as last year & could again get a good pick later too .

 

DL with who they had & who they have brought in i this is still a strong group & could be if some of the players produce like they have in the past & of course don't forget what Von will bring can be even better this year .

 

The CB position mainly because we don't know how Tre will be coming back & with Levi gone could be a strong consideration at 25 but they still have some good players there & could find another good player in the second or later like they did with D J .

 

I have heard one person put it this way .

 

Given the strengths of the Bills what would be the one position that could be a luxury pick  this year that would immediately make the team better & being a first round pick they could have this player for 5 yrs with the 5th year option & maybe even 2 more if they decided he was worth franchising or they could let him go after the 5th year .

 

I know some of you will be NO WAY but this made pretty good sense to me when he explained the Running Back position . He said the run game as far as running backs  now on the Bills roster is the weakest area of the Bills over all & if they got a back like Breece Hall , Kenneth Walker, Isaiah Spiller, Brian Robison or fill in the blank _____________ it could be a instant upgrade to strengthen the run game .

 

It would 1 take some of the beating off of Josh & be a immediate upgrade to the running back room plus they would have a good contract/player for 4 or 5 yrs then they could get another. I think Motor is a good back but a stud young RB with good speed - good hands - & a bit bigger for some short yardage work would make a ton of sense .

 

Moss just isn't that guy they thought he would be use him as trade bait if need be to move up in the second to get a WR, CB, or who ever else . I know they brought in the other fella which could be a good back if he plays like he has in the past but he's been around for a bit & hasn't been the player he once was so it's a chance & if he does good he will want a bigger contract next year .

 

When that guy (can't remember his name) said that i thought it makes so much sense for now & the future ! 

 

The Bills running game suffered for most for the year until late then it helped but maybe not as much as it could have with such a back - so that's my pick at 25 Hall may not be there but because every one thinks RB is a none essential position now he could fall to us .

 

Or they could get another really good back that could be there at 25 or who knows Beane isn't afraid to go get the guy he wants that he feels could be that big of a difference maker to put the team in the Super Bowl & have him for quite a while .

 

What do you all think make sense to me ...

T Man, are you bored as you know CB is the biggest need.  Cmon brother.

[TFBillsfan]

The more direct question is what position player is starting with the 25th pick on this roster? IMO, that clearly narrows it down to CB or RB barring a trade or something unexpected. This years draft should have a few impact players and strengthening depth behind the starters. 

[ganesh]

6 hours ago, SCBills said:

I wouldn’t say CB, because Tre will be back. 
 

Tre, Dane and Taron is a pretty solid trio and while someone like Booth (if available) might take it to another level, it seems the staff is high on Dane, and for good reason. 
 

Probably RB.  Not saying we should draft one at 25, but Breece Hall’s potential dwarfs anyone we have on the roster. 

We allowed the chiefs to score 42 points on us.  I don't think Dane Jackson is the answer at CB

18 minutes ago, TFBillsfan said:

The more direct question is what position player is starting with the 25th pick on this roster? IMO, that clearly narrows it down to CB or RB barring a trade or something unexpected. This years draft should have a few impact players and strengthening depth behind the starters. 

An IOL also could start if he has an excellent camp

[ndirish1978]

1 - To me, Punter is the answer. Our punter stinks. If we could draft Araiza, or better yet, Trout and they are solid holders, draft away in the 4th. 

 

2 - CB2 is an immediate upgrade if Tre is out for any amount of time. Right now Dane Jackson and Cam Lewis are our two starters. Sauce and Stingley are day 1 starters. I like Booth, but he has the same injury that basically kept Listenbee from ever really playing for us so that makes me wary of him. Elam has issues being a willing tackler, McDuffie and McCreary are short with shorter arms. Tariq Woolen is super raw, but toolsy. I could see Kyler Gordon being a decent fit for us, but not an automatic starter, same for Cam Taylor-Britt. So absent a trade up, you're looking at players with more physical gifts than what we have, but no experience in the D so I'd call it a wash. 

 

3 - WR we're talking about getting the 5-7th best player on the board at our pick and we have #1 and #2 locked up so they would be competing for a backup/slot role as I see McKenzie taking more WR3 duties. Christian Watson is raw and has had issues with drops and George Pickens has all kinds of red flags for starting fights and getting benched for violating team rules and these seem to be the best available guys when we pick. I's probably still take a flyer on Watson though, I like him. Unfortunately I could see GB taking him at 22.

 

4 - I'd suggest TE might be even more of an early round need than WR because we don't have any signed beyond this year. If Likely is available in the 3rd I think he could be a difference-maker. 

 

4 - Yes, a stud RB could help upgrade our offense but is there a legit stud RB in this draft, like a Zeke Elliot/ Chris McCaffrey type of player? I don't believe so. The top 3 RBs are all supposed to go late 20s - 2nd rd, which means teams don't even have them listed as 1st rd talent. Breece Hall has questions about his initial cut, Isaiah Spiller isn't super fast and Kenneth Walker is a 1 year starter who doesn't pass block - saying these three are instant upgrades over Motor is, in my eyes, more a wish than a fact.

 

 

 

 

[OldTimer1960]

1 hour ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

Actually Sal has said it on more than one occasion and when he had Parrino or Jon Scott on the other day - they said the same thing.  
 

They both said everything they have heard was he was ahead of schedule and they were hoping to find out more with him at OTAs, but the Bills did not make him available so far.

 

Players come back all the time now and are playing by 6 to 9 months.  The timeline projected was the one Sal talked about as unlike normal people - Tre has access to 0 stress workout like underwater treadmills where they can regain strength without putting weight on the knee.  They begin working out now much sooner than they could do in the past.

 

They also have increased access to flexibility experts to ensure they have flexibility to regain motion as they are in constant physical therapy.  More and more players are coming back like Amari Rodgers at 6-8 months after surgery.  As long as they are well managed.

 

We will see where it ends up, but unless he has a set back the guys covering the team seem to think he would not hit the IR and would be able to do limited snaps early in the season.

 

Did you read the Buffalo Rumblings article - they put him as back at the end of the Pre-season.  Not starting practice, but that would be his optimal return date.

Even if White is 100% to start the season (I still think that is pretty optimistic), I question Dane Jackson at the other CB spot.   He is not a premier athlete for that position (far from it) and it is a position that is easy to attack for opposition.  He played some important minutes after White was injured, but that is no guarantee that he is fit to start for a team that fancies itself as a serious Super Bowl contender.

[freddyjj]

6 hours ago, T master said:

As the draft gets closer we all have been listening to & seeing mocks that all the so called "Experts" put down who the Bills can pick at 25 but if there is one position group that could instantly upgrade the Bills that is in need of reinforcement which group do you think that is on the team ?

 

With the WR every one thinks that this could be or should be the pick at 25 but if it wasn't i think they could get a pick later in the draft that would have a good value & be able to pick up a good player Like Gabe was later that could help but that group is pretty strong now as it is  .

 

The O line i feel given who they have brought with as far as players & coaches will be better, the LB ing corp I think is still a strong group but could get a pick later, safety's i think can be as good as last year & could again get a good pick later too .

 

DL with who they had & who they have brought in i this is still a strong group & could be if some of the players produce like they have in the past & of course don't forget what Von will bring can be even better this year .

 

The CB position mainly because we don't know how Tre will be coming back & with Levi gone could be a strong consideration at 25 but they still have some good players there & could find another good player in the second or later like they did with D J .

 

I have heard one person put it this way .

 

Given the strengths of the Bills what would be the one position that could be a luxury pick  this year that would immediately make the team better & being a first round pick they could have this player for 5 yrs with the 5th year option & maybe even 2 more if they decided he was worth franchising or they could let him go after the 5th year .

 

I know some of you will be NO WAY but this made pretty good sense to me when he explained the Running Back position . He said the run game as far as running backs  now on the Bills roster is the weakest area of the Bills over all & if they got a back like Breece Hall , Kenneth Walker, Isaiah Spiller, Brian Robison or fill in the blank _____________ it could be a instant upgrade to strengthen the run game .

 

It would 1 take some of the beating off of Josh & be a immediate upgrade to the running back room plus they would have a good contract/player for 4 or 5 yrs then they could get another. I think Motor is a good back but a stud young RB with good speed - good hands - & a bit bigger for some short yardage work would make a ton of sense .

 

Moss just isn't that guy they thought he would be use him as trade bait if need be to move up in the second to get a WR, CB, or who ever else . I know they brought in the other fella which could be a good back if he plays like he has in the past but he's been around for a bit & hasn't been the player he once was so it's a chance & if he does good he will want a bigger contract next year .

 

When that guy (can't remember his name) said that i thought it makes so much sense for now & the future ! 

 

The Bills running game suffered for most for the year until late then it helped but maybe not as much as it could have with such a back - so that's my pick at 25 Hall may not be there but because every one thinks RB is a none essential position now he could fall to us .

 

Or they could get another really good back that could be there at 25 or who knows Beane isn't afraid to go get the guy he wants that he feels could be that big of a difference maker to put the team in the Super Bowl & have him for quite a while .

 

What do you all think make sense to me ...

Makes no sense to me. For starters each of your paragraphs are actually run on sentences.  I stopped reading after opening line. 

[TFBillsfan]

8 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

Even if White is 100% to start the season (I still think that is pretty optimistic), I question Dane Jackson at the other CB spot.   He is not a premier athlete for that position (far from it) and it is a position that is easy to attack for opposition.  He played some important minutes after White was injured, but that is no guarantee that he is fit to start for a team that fancies itself as a serious Super Bowl contender.

Plus the schedule ratchets up this season vs some very strong passing teams. The secondary needs to be ready to go week 1. 

[papazoid]

weakest position

 

#1- CB

#2- RB

#3- TE

 

[TBBills]

5 hours ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Neither will Jameson Williams, but many still want to draft him

I don't care what people here want to draft. 

[BillsShredder83]

6 hours ago, Bleedbuffaloblue said:

CB is clearly a high priority need IMO given the uncertainty to Tre’s situation early in the season, but doesn’t need to be filled at #25 unless a real stud falls that far.

Personally I think the need for more speed at RB or WR trumps CB for that first pick. Speed is such a lethal weapon and you can’t teach it. Lord knows our recent losses to KC are more than adequate evidence for Beane or any other FO personnel. I hope they go in that direction in Round 1 and address the CB situation on day two.

Jeez, if only we had some friends willing to deal the most athletic freak of the last 5 years, for pennies on the dollar. God forbid McD has to deal with a single strong personality.  If Marv could handle Bruce and Talley and Jimbo, ssssssssurely McD can handle a 190lb WR

[GreggTX]

We simply must add a couple outside CB's, but I'd still be OK with a G or OT for the right side of the OL at 25. A better OL would be the 1 thing that would help Josh the most given last year's performance. Josh in a clean pocket gives us our best shot at the Lombardi Trophy.CB or OL. Last year our biggest need was DE and we took DE's with our top 2 picks. Somehow that was twisted into proof that Beane doesn't draft for need.