How will Trump’s tax INCREASE affect you?

[Westside]

7 minutes ago, ALF said:

 

No , but no state income tax like Florida and Texas should pick up more of the cost of hurricane damage . The rest of the country subsidizes them plus all there military bases.

I don’t know how much the state pays for clean up of natural disasters, but I’m sure the high tax states receive plenty of disaster funds for flooding, storms and such. The military bases are placed strategically for defense of the country, not by tax rates. So I’m not sure what that has to do with anything.

 

I keep hearing about how blue states carry the load for most of the US economy, why would people leaving for warmer lower taxed states be a problem for the economically advantaged blue states?

[ALF]

2 minutes ago, Westside said:

I don’t know how much the state pays for clean up of natural disasters, but I’m sure the high tax states receive plenty of disaster funds for flooding, storms and such. The military bases are placed strategically for defense of the country, not by tax rates. So I’m not sure what that has to do with anything.

 

I keep hearing about how blue states carry the load for most of the US economy, why would people leaving for warmer lower taxed states be a problem for the economically advantaged blue states?

 

 

They can go wherever they want , no problem at all. 

[SoCal Deek]

40 minutes ago, ALF said:

 

No , but no state income tax like Florida and Texas should pick up more of the cost of hurricane damage . The rest of the country subsidizes them plus all there military bases.

A military base, like a post office, is on federal land and staffed with federal employees. The rest of the country isn’t subsidizing anything. (Not a good example.)

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

8 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

Because eventually when wealthy people leave for red states the poor and middle class in blue states are left holding the bag.

Thanks. 
 

In the case of property taxes, I think for many it ultimately boils down to a few questions:

 

1.  Is there sufficient value received for the cost incurred?   
2. Projecting forward, what’s the tax situation going to look like in those golden retirement years? 
3.  What is the trend as it relates to population growth or decline with respect to the tax burden? 
4. Access to medical care an individual feels most comfortable with, most particularly later in life;
4.  Given questions 1, 2, and 3, 4, is there a place that offers a better, more equitable option? 
 

One thing I found particularly frustrating occurred during the pandemic.   There was quite a bit of pressure on business to shut down/close and/or give back to the community.   Late fees were eliminated, an eviction moratorium was set in place, banks, cable companies, credit card companies all called upon to do the right thing. 
 

However, when it came to property/school tax….nothing.   No temporary waiver of late fees.  No payment plans to help the people.  In my case, for the property I own, the bills arrived quite promptly with insets telling the consumer that regular bill pay options were suspended because the town offices were closed.  The bills also prominently indicated the substantial extra charges due if payment was one or more days late.   That’s more serf-king relationship than anything else in context, and an important consideration for me.  

 

When I consider my future in this particular blue state, and consider my 5 bullet points, the only real consideration is option 1.  That’s all about access to family and has very little to do with the state, high tax rate and deductions to make me feel like I’m getting a good deal. 
 

I appreciate the reply.  
 

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

We definitely need a class on taxes in this country. Maybe continuing education credit for taxpayers…and/or voters. In general:

 

Federal income tax is supposed to pay for the military to defend us all. 

 

State income tax is supposed to pay for education.

 

Sales and property taxes are supposed to pay for police and fire. 
 

Those simple principles have been virtually destroyed by our elected officials who knowingly co-mingle funds in the hopes of wooing votes.

[OrangeBills]

8 hours ago, Chef Jim said:

How will SALT have wealthy people leaving for red states?  It’s part of the federal tax code. Are you thinking wealthy people stayed in typically higher taxed blue states for the tax deduction?  

 

Um, really?  It costs a LOT of money that one could keep just by shifting from place to place

 

7% State Income Tax, obviously that's $7,000 per $100,000, and really kicks in for those over $500,000, so that's $35,000 minimum that you have to pay AND don't get back in Federal.

 

Then absurd property taxes, say $25,000 per year...so that's $60,000 per year which would probably cost you ~$10,000 in Florida or Texas, and before you were able to offset Federal Income but no more.  Yes, Trump really screwed the Blue States, but they're in a bind because to unwind it they'd be "lowering taxes on the Wealthy and raising them on the unwealthy"

 

Of course, all this does is highlight that many, many of Trump's programs were actually some of the better Democrat ideas just actually executed.  But he sent mean Tweets so Dems are upside-down on themselves

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, OrangeBills said:

 

Um, really?  It costs a LOT of money that one could keep just by shifting from place to place

 

7% State Income Tax, obviously that's $7,000 per $100,000, and really kicks in for those over $500,000, so that's $35,000 minimum that you have to pay AND don't get back in Federal.

 

Then absurd property taxes, say $25,000 per year...so that's $60,000 per year which would probably cost you ~$10,000 in Florida or Texas, and before you were able to offset Federal Income but no more.  Yes, Trump really screwed the Blue States, but they're in a bind because to unwind it they'd be "lowering taxes on the Wealthy and raising them on the unwealthy"

 

Of course, all this does is highlight that many, many of Trump's programs were actually some of the better Democrat ideas just actually executed.  But he sent mean Tweets so Dems are upside-down on themselves

See my post above and you’ll understand how this got so screwed up. If the various levels of government would stick to those basic principles and priorities we wouldn’t be bouncing back and forth with tax policy changes every time the White House changes hands. 

[Chef Jim]

19 minutes ago, OrangeBills said:

 

Um, really?  It costs a LOT of money that one could keep just by shifting from place to place

 

7% State Income Tax, obviously that's $7,000 per $100,000, and really kicks in for those over $500,000, so that's $35,000 minimum that you have to pay AND don't get back in Federal.

 

Then absurd property taxes, say $25,000 per year...so that's $60,000 per year which would probably cost you ~$10,000 in Florida or Texas, and before you were able to offset Federal Income but no more.  Yes, Trump really screwed the Blue States, but they're in a bind because to unwind it they'd be "lowering taxes on the Wealthy and raising them on the unwealthy"

 

Of course, all this does is highlight that many, many of Trump's programs were actually some of the better Democrat ideas just actually executed.  But he sent mean Tweets so Dems are upside-down on themselves

 

You lumped in a lot of taxes there.  We're only talking about SALT.  So for someone making $500,000 now they lose a $35k tax deduction.  if they are married they gained $12k via the doubling of the standard deduction.  So it's actually only a $23k reduction in fed deductions.  At that income they are in the 35% marginal rate.  That is about an $8,000 in additional taxes.  It could cost double that to move and there is no guarantee that property taxes will be lower to wherever they are moving.  So this is my point when I say SALT pisses wealthy people off but will most likely not prompt them to pack up and move. 

[ALF]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

A military base, like a post office, is on federal land and staffed with federal employees. The rest of the country isn’t subsidizing anything. (Not a good example.)

 

Do military bases employ off base civilians and buy goods and services from each community?  Do the military stationed there patronize off base locations ? Bases are indeed a benefit to where they are located .

[OrangeBills]

47 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

 

You lumped in a lot of taxes there.  We're only talking about SALT.  So for someone making $500,000 now they lose a $35k tax deduction.  if they are married they gained $12k via the doubling of the standard deduction.  So it's actually only a $23k reduction in fed deductions.  At that income they are in the 35% marginal rate.  That is about an $8,000 in additional taxes.  It could cost double that to move and there is no guarantee that property taxes will be lower to wherever they are moving.  So this is my point when I say SALT pisses wealthy people off but will most likely not prompt them to pack up and move. 

 

Yeah, but I was using $500,000 income to be diplomatic...that's barely middle class in many areas of Northeast Blue States.

 

It's a much bigger impact than that, ESPECIALLY in a virtual work-from-anywhere world

 

The Northeast is doomed long-term I think

[Chef Jim]

14 minutes ago, OrangeBills said:

 

Yeah, but I was using $500,000 income to be diplomatic...that's barely middle class in many areas of Northeast Blue States.

 

It's a much bigger impact than that, ESPECIALLY in a virtual work-from-anywhere world

 

The Northeast is doomed long-term I think

Yes and double it for a million. Someone making a million is not moving from CA to TX to save $16k a year due to SALT. They are moving to TX to save $100k in state taxes. My whole point when I questioned @Doc Brown  
 

 

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, Chef Jim said:

Yes and double it for a million. Someone making a million is not moving from CA to TX to save $16k a year due to SALT. They are moving to TX to save $100k in state taxes. My whole point when I questioned @Doc Brown  
 

 

The vast vast majority of people are moving to get far away from the California politics. 

[OrangeBills]

3 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

Yes and double it for a million. Someone making a million is not moving from CA to TX to save $16k a year due to SALT. They are moving to TX to save $100k in state taxes. My whole point when I questioned @Doc Brown  
 

 

 

I don't know where you're getting that math, but it's way more than $16k a year.  I'll just leave it at that, we're all friends here

[Chef Jim]

10 minutes ago, OrangeBills said:

 

I don't know where you're getting that math, but it's way more than $16k a year.  I'll just leave it at that, we're all friends here

Math time!  
 

I just doubled my $500k calculation which is not exact but let’s go with that. 
 

$500k at a 7% state tax rate is $35,000 in state taxes that was a fed tax deduction.  I reduced that by the additional $12k they now get via the doubling of the standard deduction.  So it’s actually $23k fed tax deduction. If they are in 35% marginal rate that $23k becomes $8,000 less in federal taxes.  
 

😁

16 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

The vast vast majority of people are moving to get far away from the California politics. 

Not those that I know.  It’s both!  😁

[sherpa]

3 hours ago, Westside said:

 The military bases are placed strategically for defense of the country, not by tax rates. So I’m not sure what that has to do with anything.

 

 

Not to quibble, but that is absolutely not true.

Other than the need for major Naval bases to be located in deep water ports, the location of military bases is largely a jobs program to patronize senators in the states they are located.

They are often quid pro quo rewards for votes on various issues.

Obviously the availability of reasonably priced land is a consideration, but there is almost no strategic value in their location.

[Chef Jim]

40 minutes ago, OrangeBills said:

 

I don't know where you're getting that math, but it's way more than $16k a year.  I'll just leave it at that, we're all friends here

And you may be confusing a tax deduction which is a dollar for dollar reduction of your taxable income vs a tax credit which is a dollar for dollar reduction of the taxes owed. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, Westside said:

Do you think people should be punished for leaving a high tax rate blue state for a lower tax red state?

No.

2 hours ago, Chef Jim said:

Yes and double it for a million. Someone making a million is not moving from CA to TX to save $16k a year due to SALT. They are moving to TX to save $100k in state taxes. My whole point when I questioned @Doc Brown  

That's faulty logic because you were already paying that much in state taxes before the 2017 TCJA.

[Tiberius]

Thank you senator Scott for the much needed support. We Democrats thank you. 

 

 

[ALF]

39 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Thank you senator Scott for the much needed support. We Democrats thank you. 

 

 

 

Opinion | Rick Scott tax plan bad news for retirees

So imagine my surprise when I saw that Senator Rick Scott recently introduced a plan for the Republican Party that would raise taxes on nearly half of all Americans, forcing seniors and working class families to pay more when they file their taxes every year. His plan also includes provisions that could sunset Medicare and Social Security, jeopardizing the health care and retirement benefits that millions of Florida seniors have spent their entire lives earning.

 

https://www.palmbeachpost.com/story/opinion/2022/04/18/senator-rick-scott-plan-would-force-seniors-pay-more-taxes/7333900001/

[Chef Jim]

1 hour ago, Doc Brown said:

No.

That's faulty logic because you were already paying that much in state taxes before the 2017 TCJA.

Nope. TCLA has zero effect on your state tax bill. My point is elimination of the deductibility of your state tax will not affect your fed tax bill enough to consider a move.   Now the elimination of your state tax altogether would make a relocation sensible but SALT didn’t change that.