Tom Brady tweets at Josh Allen [Edit: QBs will face off at golf in June]

[Buffalo716]

13 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Actually I’m pretty sure the vast majority of every coach and player would name Brady as the GOAT, and it might even be close to unanimous.  
 

Like it or not, Poll any group of people…players…coaches…fans…media…doesn’t matter.  Brady will be overwhelmingly chosen as the GOAT in that poll.

 

Bills fan can’t always separate personal bias from these discussions, and I get that, but the reality is Brady is without question the GOAT in the eyes of the majority.  And while there is never going to be any way to prove who the GOAT is in any sport, he definitely has one of the best resumes for it in NFL history, but he has one of the best resumes of any sport in history.  

I'm willing to bet Brady has a lot but guaranteed it's not unanimous .. they're still lot of old timers who swear by Montana and Golden arms Johnny U

 

Tom Brady is a three-time 1st team All-Pro, Peyton Manning is a seven-time  1st team All pro

 

It is absolutely not unanimous who the better quarterback was.. Tom Brady's been more clutch on better teams, for sure

 

That does not equate to being a better pure quarterback to which Peyton Manning has a claim to being the best ever 

 

Tom Brady is the most clutch playoff quarterback absolutely... But he has had great teams and the greatest coaching around him... Everybody recognizes belichick's greatness as one of the goats too 

Edited April 18, 2022 by Buffalo716

[K D]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I'm willing to bet Brady has a lot but guaranteed it's not unanimous .. they're still lot of old timers who swear by Montana and Golden arms Johnny U

 

Tom Brady is a three-time 1st team All-Pro, Peyton Manning is a seven-time  1st team All pro

 

It is absolutely not unanimous who the better quarterback was.. Tom Brady's been more clutch on better teams, for sure

 

That does not equate to being a better pure quarterback to which Peyton Manning has a claim to being the best ever 

 

Tom Brady is the most clutch playoff quarterback absolutely... But if only playoffs mattered then Big Ben's better than Aaron Rodgers and he's not

It's unanimous. If Tom retired 5 years ago he would still be considered the best ever. Now he's mid 40's putting up better numbers than pretty much everyone in the league and no signs of slowing down. He could probably play until 50 (if he gets his wife to sign the permission slip). He already owns every record, what more is there to prove to anyone?

[Buffalo716]

35 minutes ago, KDIGGZ said:

It's unanimous. If Tom retired 5 years ago he would still be considered the best ever. Now he's mid 40's putting up better numbers than pretty much everyone in the league and no signs of slowing down. He could probably play until 50 (if he gets his wife to sign the permission slip). He already owns every record, what more is there to prove to anyone?

It's not unanimous that's your opinion

 

There's absolutely people in the NFL who don't think Tom Brady is the best quarterback ever

 

Peyton Manning at his best is better than Tom Brady at his best... That's why 1 is a seven-time first team All pro and Brady 3 

 

Brady has had top 10 defenses and teams had to go through foxboro for most of his career.. not to mention Bill belichick defenses.. that's the difference in the postseason 

 

This is exactly why I want to keep open air in orchard Park.. because it was an advantage for belichick and Brady in foxboro... And it's an advantage for us

 

Lots of teams were able to go into Indianapolis in the dome and play great offensive games.. it's very hard to do in Buffalo in the winter , we have Josh Allen

 

Edited April 18, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Alphadawg7]

23 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I'm willing to bet Brady has a lot but guaranteed it's not unanimous .. they're still lot of old timers who swear by Montana and Golden arms Johnny U

 

Tom Brady is a three-time 1st team All-Pro, Peyton Manning is a seven-time  1st team All pro

 

It is absolutely not unanimous who the better quarterback was.. Tom Brady's been more clutch on better teams, for sure

 

That does not equate to being a better pure quarterback to which Peyton Manning has a claim to being the best ever 

 

Tom Brady is the most clutch playoff quarterback absolutely... But he has had great teams and the greatest coaching around him... Everybody recognizes belichick's greatness as one of the goats too 

No offense but Manning In this convo is comical.  He’s Aaron Rodgers 1.0…the super human regular season guy who chokes in the playoffs.

 

Brady won several of his rings with scrubs as weapons.  Go look at his offensive supporting cast his first 3 SBs, its a joke compared to what Manning had his whole career.  Yet Brady won SBs while Manning set a dubious NFL record (while loaded with HOF weapons) for one and done in the playoffs 9 times just with the Colts alone.  Many of which he was the number 1 seed too.

 

Manning only has a second SB ring because a dominant defense and dominant run game carried him when he was shot and the lowest rated passer in the nfl that year and had the worst SB game for a winning QB in SB history.  Otherwise, he would still have his one ring against Rex Grossman.  
 

Manning is footballs equivalent of ARod in baseball (minus the doochey-ness)

Edited April 18, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[TampaBillsJunkie]

4 hours ago, Batman1876 said:

I’ll say it, I like Tampa Tom dude has a personality and seems like a fun dude. I now blame the hoodie for 100% of New England being so darn obnoxious. 

I live in Tampa now and Tom's latched on pretty good to the local fare. People love him here and there's no hoodie stigma stench on him. As much as I hated Tommy Patriot, I've gained some respect for his accomplishments, especially how good he has stayed in his 40's. It's unreal. There's never been a QB with his longevity and excellence over such a long period of time. Dude is the GOAT.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

You’d think Tampon Tom Brady could afford  a graphics designer to make a good photo shopped picture!!!!

[Buffalo716]

28 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

No offense but Manning In this convo is comical.  He’s Aaron Rodgers 1.0…the super human regular season guy who chokes in the playoffs.

 

Brady won several of his rings with scrubs as weapons.  Go look at his offensive supporting cast his first 3 SBs, its a joke compared to what Manning had his whole career.  Yet Brady won SBs while Manning set a dubious NFL record (while loaded with HOF weapons) for one and done in the playoffs 9 times just with the Colts alone.  Many of which he was the number 1 seed too.

 

Manning only has a second SB ring because a dominant defense and dominant run game carried him when he was shot and the lowest rated passer in the nfl that year and had the worst SB game for a winning QB in SB history.  Otherwise, he would still have his one ring against Rex Grossman.  
 

Manning is the ARod of football.  

People make fun of Aaron Rodgers for choking but his stats in the playoffs are stupid good .. he hasn't had the quality of defenses Brady has had in the playoffs

 

 Rodgers has a passer rating of 100.1 with 5,894 yards, 45 touchdowns and 13 interceptions in 22 games in the playoffs in his career. 

 

Brady has a passer rating of 90.4 with 13,049 yards, 86 touchdowns and 39 interceptions in 47 games in the playoffs in his career. 

 

I don't doubt Tom Brady's greatness but he's not a clear-cut greatest of all time... If you want a clear-cut goat it's babe Ruth.. babe Ruth had more home runs by himself in 1920.. then like 12-16 major league teams ... Slugging percentage record still stands.. OBPS still stands.. took the game out of the dead ball era by himself... Records standing 100 years later.. that's a goat

 

Tom Brady's never been that dominant to where he statistically completely set himself away from his peers, except for longevity and rings

 

Like I said Johnny Unitas Joe Montana Manning Aaron Rodgers brees all have a claim...heck Marino was considered the best quarterback ever and he never had a ring

 

Tom Brady's play is not Head and shoulders above his other HoF peers except for the championships and footballs the ultimate team game

Edited April 18, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Alphadawg7]

24 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

People make fun of Aaron Rodgers for choking but his stats in the playoffs are stupid good .. he hasn't had the quality of defenses Brady has had in the playoffs

 

 Rodgers has a passer rating of 100.1 with 5,894 yards, 45 touchdowns and 13 interceptions in 22 games in the playoffs in his career. 

 

Brady has a passer rating of 90.4 with 13,049 yards, 86 touchdowns and 39 interceptions in 47 games in the playoffs in his career. 

 

I don't doubt Tom Brady's greatness but he's not a clear-cut greatest of all time... If you want a clear-cut goat it's babe Ruth.. babe Ruth had more home runs by himself in 1920.. then like 25 major league teams ... Slugging percentage record still stands.. took the game out of the dead ball era by himself... Records standing 100 years later.. that's a goat

 

Tom Brady's never been that dominant to where he statistically completely set himself away from his peers, except for longevity and rings

 

Like I said Johnny Unitas Joe Montana Manning Aaron Rodgers brees all have a claim...heck Marino was considered the best quarterback ever and he never had a ring

 

Tom Brady's play is not Head and shoulders above his other HoF peers except for the championships and footballs the ultimate team game

Honestly I can’t take your reply seriously when you are suggesting Manning, Brees, Marino, etc are better than Brady was/is.  
 

The only player who has any leg in this discussion is Montana, but Brady still passed him too.

 

I would suggest watching his games rather than stat sheets.  Stat sheets don’t show the clutch, the greatness in the biggest moments.  
 

Brees missed the playoffs like half his career.  Marino never won anything and was a volume passer.  Manning and Rodgers dont win in the playoffs despite often having elite weapons and the number 1 seed.
 

You are coming from a jaded and biased perspective.  Brady did more while working with less than any QB you mentioned or in history.
 

I get it, he dominated us for so long that it’s hard to see it clearly without hate and bias perspectives.  But, objectively most the QBs you mentioned not only don’t have a case for GOAT, but some are not even considered in the top 5 all time.  

Edited April 18, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[GunnerBill]

I am with @Alphadawg7. Brady might not be the most naturally talented but he is the GOAT. What he did on the field was greater than the rest. It is about more than being clutch. 

[Buffalo716]

35 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Honestly I can’t take your reply seriously when you are suggesting Manning, Brees, Marino, etc are better than Brady was/is.  
 

The only player who has any leg in this discussion is Montana, but Brady still passed him too.

 

I would suggest watching his games rather than stat sheets.  Stat sheets don’t show the clutch, the greatness in the biggest moments.  
 

Brees missed the playoffs like half his career.  Marino never won anything and was a volume passer.  Manning and Rodgers dont win in the playoffs despite often having elite weapons.  
 

You are coming from a jaded and biased perspective.  Brady did more while working with less than any QB you mentioned.  
 

I get it, he dominated us for so long that it’s hard to see it clearly without hate and bias perspectives.  But, objectively most the QBs you mentioned not only don’t have a case for GOAT, but some are not even considered in the top 5 all time.  

 

I'm just throwing some Hall of famers out there who absolutely have the respect of a lot 

 

The media has anointed Tom Brady the goat

 

The media also anointed Dan Marino the best QB/passer before Manning and Brady played and he never won. I don't consider Marino best ever but at one point he absolutely was considered the best thrower of a football

 

You also tried coming at Aaron Rodgers stats and he's statistically better than Tom Brady

 

I'm not just using statistics either I've watched all these guys for 30 plus years.. I've said in this thread Tom Brady is the most clutch

 

I don't think that equates to best.. it's an ultimate team game

 

Again if you just want to use championships it's Tom Brady

 

If you want to use who day in and day out was consistently the best quarterback.. there's a handful of guys that all play quarterback as good if not better than Brady.. again Johnny Unitas Joe Montana Aaron Rodgers and yes seven time first team all pro Manning

 

There's a reason again why Manning is a seven-time first team All pro and Brady is a three-time first team All pro... Manning was consistently better during the regular season which still matters a lot 

 

Tom Brady has played on very good defensive teams and is very clutch I've never denied that..  again if you're just using the playoffs for the greatest.. then Bill Russell is the greatest 

 

And I don't know who you talk to for football.. but Montana Johnny Unitas and Manning are absolutely in lots of football historians top fives 

 

And when Marino retired he was considered the greatest passer by lots in the football community 

 

Aaron Rodgers statistically is going to go down per game the greatest quarterback statistically .. he's not on as good of teams

 

And yeah I do think Joe Cool or Golden arms is better than Brady .. I can't imagine what Johnny Unitas would do in today's NFL

 

 

 

Edited April 18, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Rocket94]

If the Bills had won that game (Which they should have) the conversations concerning QB's would be entirely different. Allen did everything he could against the Chiefs and he wasn't finished yet!

[Buffalo716]

34 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I am with @Alphadawg7. Brady might not be the most naturally talented but he is the GOAT. What he did on the field was greater than the rest. It is about more than being clutch. 

You can argue this till the cows come home but I've played coach and scouted my entire life and in my opinion he's not the best I've ever seen

 

And it's not because I'm jaded  

 

He's the most decorated I absolutely don't think he is the best quarterback 

 

And again people take that all wrong on message boards.. I've never talked football with another coach and he got mad when I said Brady's the third or fourth best in my opinion.. message board you'll get crucified 

 

There's been a lot of good quarterbacks in this league going back to otto Graham.. I can't imagine what Johnny Unitas would do in today's NFL

Edited April 18, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

That is absolutely an opinion 

 

Not every coach and player and quarterback in the NFL will say he is the greatest

 

Is Bill Russell the greatest basketball player because he won 10 titles? No 

 

Peyton Manning, Joe Montana and Johnny Unitas have everything Brady has, besides playing till 45 and having the 7 super bowls  

 

There's nothing Brady can do that those guys can't 

 

Then throw in Brees and Rodgers.. how many super bowls does Manning or brees or Rogers win if they got to play within the Patriots organization and the teams Bill built? 

 

Lot more than they have

 

 

 

 

You've just described everyone on this board.

 

Manning was great, but he was on stacked Offenses in Indy with 1 ring to show.   His Colts made the playoffs 11 of his 12 seasons and had an unbelievable 7 (out of 11) one and done playoff years.   His second ring came with an awful performance--on another team.

 

Go look at the Offensive rosters Brady was winning Lombardi's with before  Gronk showed up.

 

Rodgers should have had the last 2 Packers teams in the SB.  Instead, 39 regular season wins over the last 3 seasons.....2 playoff wins.  

 

 

[Buffalo716]

11 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

You've just described everyone on this board.

 

Manning was great, but he was on stacked Offenses in Indy with 1 ring to show.   His Colts made the playoffs 11 of his 12 seasons and had an unbelievable 7 (out of 11) one and done playoff years.   His second ring came with an awful performance--on another team.

 

Go look at the Offensive rosters Brady was winning Lombardi's with before  Gronk showed up.

 

Rodgers should have had the last 2 Packers teams in the SB.  Instead, 39 regular season wins over the last 3 seasons.....2 playoff wins.  

 

 

Growing up the son of a coach

 

He always told me defense wins championships..  to this day I believe it.. Brady has had great defenses throughout his entirety in New England

 

The Colt had lackluster defenses for most of Manning's career, and a dome which allowed other teams to come in and play good offense

 

Brady had foxboro which hampered a lot of other quarterbacks

 

Which is why open air here is a good idea.. because our strong arm quarterbacks... Kemp Kelly Allen... Can cut the ball through wind most others can't...  

 

A dome just allows other quarterbacks to play the game of their life in the playoffs 

 

Give Peyton Manning Bill belichick and see how many super bowls he ends up with.. I believe it's a lot more than two

Edited April 18, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Mr. WEO]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Growing up the son of a coach

 

He always told me defense wins championships..  to this day I believe it.. Brady has had great defenses throughout his entirety in New England

 

The Colt had lackluster defenses for most of Manning's career, and a dome which allowed other teams to come in and play good offense

 

Brady had foxboro which hampered a lot of other quarterbacks

 

Which is why open air here is a good idea.. because our strong arm quarterbacks... Kemp Kelly Allen... Can cut the ball through wind most others can't...  

 

A dome just allows other quarterbacks to play the game of their life in the playoffs 

 

Give Peyton Manning Bill belichick and see how many super bowls he ends up with.. I believe it's a lot more than two

 

Colts only SB with Manning they were ranked 21 on D.  He only had 2 seasons where his D was worse than that.

 

In 2007, Colts D was #3 (#1 in yards).  One and done in beautiful San Diego.  In 5 of his Colts' playoff seasons,  the D was ranked #8, 7, 7, 1, 2, 1---and 4 times one and done, despite very good Defenses.

 

Brady had a lot of very good Defenses, not a lot of weapons on Offense (who's the best RB?  Best WR other than a bit of Moss?)---and he won 6 rings.   Headed home after 1 playoff game 7 times.

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

 

Betting aficionados take note

[MafiaMio]

3 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

I'm willing to bet Brady has a lot but guaranteed it's not unanimous .. they're still lot of old timers who swear by Montana and Golden arms Johnny U

 

Tom Brady is a three-time 1st team All-Pro, Peyton Manning is a seven-time  1st team All pro

 

It is absolutely not unanimous who the better quarterback was.. Tom Brady's been more clutch on better teams, for sure

 

That does not equate to being a better pure quarterback to which Peyton Manning has a claim to being the best ever 

 

Tom Brady is the most clutch playoff quarterback absolutely... But he has had great teams and the greatest coaching around him... Everybody recognizes belichick's greatness as one of the goats too 

The only people who hold off are those with personal biases against him, whether they believe their qb is better (Colts, Packers, 49ers), or fans of teams he owned in 20 years who just hate him no matter what he does (Bills are here). Whether you admit it or not, your personal bias is blinding you. Check out the unanimous selections for NFL 100, all decade teams etc. Brady has been unanimous many, many times. Don't say you know more about football than any of them.
 

Honestly, it's just better for us as fans to respect what he's doing now because it ain't happening again. If there's a trajectory we would want Josh Allen to follow, it's Brady's - let's be real here.  

 

Edited April 19, 2022 by MafiaMio

[MafiaMio]

3 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

He has a longer longevity than most .. I'm not saying he's not in the conversation for greatest but

 

Peyton Manning at his best versus Tom Brady at his best.. Peyton Manning was a better quarterback and it's not cuz I hate Tom Brady 

 

Brady has played on much better teams and has been more clutch but I don't think he's better than Manning at his best

Manning had the 2013 Broncos and won a super bowl.... oh wait

[RyanC883]

2 hours ago, TampaBillsJunkie said:

I live in Tampa now and Tom's latched on pretty good to the local fare. People love him here and there's no hoodie stigma stench on him. As much as I hated Tommy Patriot, I've gained some respect for his accomplishments, especially how good he has stayed in his 40's. It's unreal. There's never been a QB with his longevity and excellence over such a long period of time. Dude is the GOAT.

 

Tampa is loaded at WR, TE and D.   Give Allen that WR cast and we’d have 2 SB’s.  I’m not overly impressed with Brady’s play lately.   Cupcake division and on a loaded team, just like when on Pats

11 minutes ago, MafiaMio said:

The only people who hold off are those with personal biases against him, whether they believe their qb is better (Colts, Packers, 49ers), or fans of teams he owned in 20 years who just hate him no matter what he does (Bills are here). Whether you admit it or not, your personal bias is blinding you. Check out the unanimous selections for NFL 100, all decade teams etc. Brady has been unanimous many, many times. Don't say you know more about football than any of them.
 

Honestly, it's just better for us as fans to respect what he's doing now because it ain't happening again. If there's a trajectory we would want Josh Allen to follow, it's Brady's - let's be real here.  

 

 

wouldn’t like Allen to leave Buffalo at the end of his career because the team he is on is falling apart.  

[Buffalo716]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Colts only SB with Manning they were ranked 21 on D.  He only had 2 seasons where his D was worse than that.

 

In 2007, Colts D was #3 (#1 in yards).  One and done in beautiful San Diego.  In 5 of his Colts' playoff seasons,  the D was ranked #8, 7, 7, 1, 2, 1---and 4 times one and done, despite very good Defenses.

 

Brady had a lot of very good Defenses, not a lot of weapons on Offense (who's the best RB?  Best WR other than a bit of Moss?)---and he won 6 rings.   Headed home after 1 playoff game 7 times.

 

 

I'm not going to argue that Brady hasn't had a lot All pro weapons in his career... But he's had a lot of guys that fit his system perfectly 

 

Antoine Smith was solid and paired with a great third down back in Kevin faulk... He had clock killin Corey Dillon for the third with faulk 

 

Deion Branch and Troy Brown weren't all pros but they were solid receivers 

 

He never even won a super bowl with the greatest offense with Randy Moss.. it got slowed down by a good Giants defense  

 

His super bowl teams were always very balanced with a good defense 

 

The colts defensive stats a lot of times were propped up by Peyton Manning's high flying offense and a weak AFC South.. getting up early and then letting them pin their ears back and pass rush

 

Outside of a few seasons with a healthy Bob Sanders they almost were never an actual top five unit through all three levels... Literal definitions of paper tigers

 

Belichick has been known as a defensive master for 30 years... And consistently Fields top defenses and schemes... Stops the run and usually takes away your best player 

 

I'll agree that Brady hasn't had a lot of superstars on offense.. but he has basically always had what he needs ... Hes always preferred precise route runners and reliable third down backs and he picks teams apart with that... He's never Been the greatest at throwing outside the numbers... He knows his strength and has played to it  

 

Tom Brady is absolutely an all-time great quarterback, I'm just not willing to 100% say he's the greatest quarterback to ever live

Edited April 19, 2022 by Buffalo716