Let's create TSW Bills draft big board - Final Conclusion: Kaiir Elam was the 5th option in TSW eyes when the Bills were picking.

[No_Matter_What]

14 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

@No_Matter_What - Lloyd has 20

Done.

 

Just curious - is there any chance that Linderbaum can (temporarily) play guard?

[Motor26]

51 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

If Dawkins is sliding anywhere it would be to RT if they got a true stalwart LT 

 

They aren't moving their LT they just paid to Guard... Besides you don't move a top 10 LT to guard

 

 

While I agree I don’t think they would move Dawkins from LT to guard, I think people are using that line of thought since they couldn’t move Brown inside to guard. I mean I guess they could, I’ve never seen a 6-7 guard, but that would be a massive oline. Josh wouldn’t  have much trouble throwing over them either since he is 6-5 at least.

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, Hermes said:

I really like the idea of sliding Dawkins over to LG and having Penning start on the left side. You then have a solid battle at RG with Saffold and Bates. So long as Brown gets better, that line is much improved from last season. Then every year add high ceiling prospects to fill out depth and push starters

Unfortunately, there’s very little to no chance (imo) of this coming to fruition.  Penning lasting til 25 is super unlikely 

[Hermes]

1 hour ago, Motor26 said:

While I agree I don’t think they would move Dawkins from LT to guard, I think people are using that line of thought since they couldn’t move Brown inside to guard. I mean I guess they could, I’ve never seen a 6-7 guard, but that would be a massive oline. Josh wouldn’t  have much trouble throwing over them either since he is 6-5 at least.

 

2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

If Dawkins is sliding anywhere it would be to RT if they got a true stalwart LT 

 

They aren't moving their LT they just paid to Guard... Besides you don't move a top 10 LT to guard

 

 

What they just paid him is irrelevant if it makes the team better. Dawkins slides inside and finishes his career as the Bills franchise LG. His student Penning learns the ropes from a solid vet and develops into a better LT than Dawkins could ever be. Nothing against him either. To paraphrase Dawkins here, they're looking to make that mac n cheese just right. I think it would help Spencer Brown's development too having his old teammate to add to the chemistry. Morse in turn gets better guard play of both sides and has a late career surge and plays out his final downs as a Bill.

Edited April 17, 2022 by Hermes
*their, they're

[JaCrispy]

Gotta say, I’m liking the big board so far...Overall, Bills fans seem to be pretty rational about value...👍

[Buffalo716]

57 minutes ago, Hermes said:

 

What they just paid him is irrelevant if it makes the team better. Dawkins slides inside and finishes his career as the Bills franchise LG. His student Penning learns the ropes from a solid vet and develops into a better LT than Dawkins could ever be. Nothing against him either. To paraphrase Dawkins here, they're looking to make that mac n cheese just right. I think it would help Spencer Brown's development too having his old teammate to add to the chemistry. Morse in turn gets better guard play of both sides and has a late career surge and plays out his final downs as a Bill.

Spencer Brown would be relegated to swing tackle before they would move Dawkins to guard 

 

They're not moving their left tackle who just pro bowled to guard 

 

If they want to improve the guard play they'll just draft a guard

Edited April 17, 2022 by Buffalo716

[NastyNateSoldiers]

15 hours ago, No_Matter_What said:

Interesting. I didn't include him so far since he is lower on "consensus" boards and I don't remember him being discussed on TSW in relation to our first round pick at all.

 

Once next player is is chosen I will try to expand list and may include him.

Jalen Pitre is an absolute stud reminds me of Earl Thomas or Honey Badger I realize he hasn’t been spoken about much on this board or even in general on other draft sites but watch the film he’s got instincts, physicality a nose for the ball seems to never be out of position the kid plays fast and hits like a bag of bricks . I won’t mind him being the pick at #25 or if we trade back a little and grab him in the 2nd rd.

[Hermes]

48 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Spencer Brown would be relegated to swing tackle before they would move Dawkins to guard 

 

They're not moving their left tackle who just pro bowled to guard 

 

If they want to improve the guard play they'll just draft a guard

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-pff-scouting-report-dion-dawkins-g-temple

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/dion-dawkins/32004441-5705-6236-cf99-fd4dcf52774c

 

Maybe they already did?

[intimidatortj]

9 hours ago, No_Matter_What said:

What's wrong with Burks? I think there are better options right now but I for one am surprised that he gets so few votes. But I do think that at the end of the day he will be voted to the board (if we get that far) sooner than some guys who have more votes now.

 

Anyway, really interesting how the votes are spread. Yesterday we added two players to the board, hopefully we can make the same today. But there are lots of votes spread around.

 

Thanks everyone, keep them votes coming!

IMO, and I have never seen him play in person, Burks has some that...I am not sure about his play.   I think Williams, Garrett, Olave, and London are ahead of him.

 

On the other hand, he could be the next AJ Brown.  

On 4/16/2022 at 12:46 PM, GunnerBill said:

 

Maybe. I think you work that out later. If he is there you pick him you don't worry about who lines up where. Long term I think he is your left tackle and Dion slides inside to left guard. But maybe you do that after 2022 when Saffold moves on.

I had never thought of moving Dawkins to LG.   Hmmm.    Interesting.

 

It would be tough to pass up on Trevor Conrad Dobler Penning.   Although I doubt he could play left tackle at the NFL level right away.  He needs some of his rough edges coached out of him.  But he sure looks promising.

[Buffalo716]

39 minutes ago, Hermes said:

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-pff-scouting-report-dion-dawkins-g-temple

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/dion-dawkins/32004441-5705-6236-cf99-fd4dcf52774c

 

Maybe they already did?

Those are scouting reports from years and years ago.. he just pro bowled at left tackle... Kiper also called him the best tackle in the class

 

He's a tackle who can play guard, not a guard who can play tackle

 

They're not flipping him to guard .. anything they're getting another right tackle to battle brown

 

Edited April 18, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Hermes]

43 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Those are scouting reports from years and years ago.. he just pro bowled at left tackle... Kiper also called him the best tackle in the class

 

He's a tackle who can play guard, not a guard who can play tackle

 

They're not flipping him to guard .. anything they're getting another right tackle to battle brown

 

I personally think he would excel as a guard and probowl =/= all pro. He's a definitely a good player and a leader on the team. He can still be both of those things as a guard. It seems like the transition from tackle to guard isn't a hugely prohibitive factor. I.e. tackles can be guards, but guards can't be tackles, so to speak. Also if they draft him he could be the swing tackle and learn the ropes while Dion holds down the fort at LT until he's ready to take the reins

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, intimidatortj said:

 

I had never thought of moving Dawkins to LG.   Hmmm.    Interesting.

 

It would be tough to pass up on Trevor Conrad Dobler Penning.   Although I doubt he could play left tackle at the NFL level right away.  He needs some of his rough edges coached out of him.  But he sure looks promising.

 

Yea I don't think I'd do it day 1. I'd find another way to get them on the field. But I have always believed Dion Dawkins is a good left tackle but would have been a perennial all pro type left guard. He has been superb for the Bills at tackle but if he is struggling as he gets older to manage his weight then he will get away with that more inside. Let Penning learn the NFL for a year at guard or right tackle as a rookie and then switch it up. 

[No_Matter_What]

Good morning and happy Easter Monday everyone.

 

We have added 3 players to the board yesterday, hopefully we will keep the pace today!

[No_Matter_What]

Kyler Gordon selected.

[NewEra]

Can’t believe there are so many votes for Jordan Davis with some of the names on the board still available.  👎🏻 

[glazeduck]

Though this is kind of a fun exercise, there's certainly some vote splitting going on here... Drake London may end up being a top 10 overall pick, and somehow he's on the outside looking in for what would ultimately be our "top 20"...

 

I know ordering by position can also be messy and isn't as much fun as players, but if we're looking at WR in the first, I have to imagine a guy like London -- even if he's not the #1 or 2 WR on our board, probably would absolutely be the priority over a guy like McDuffie or Gordon.

[NewEra]

25 minutes ago, glazeduck said:

Though this is kind of a fun exercise, there's certainly some vote splitting going on here... Drake London may end up being a top 10 overall pick, and somehow he's on the outside looking in for what would ultimately be our "top 20"...

 

I know ordering by position can also be messy and isn't as much fun as players, but if we're looking at WR in the first, I have to imagine a guy like London -- even if he's not the #1 or 2 WR on our board, probably would absolutely be the priority over a guy like McDuffie or Gordon.

Agreed. If we took Jordan Davis with London on the board…. 

i voted for Burks over london due to him being a RAC beast

[GunnerBill]

33 minutes ago, glazeduck said:

Though this is kind of a fun exercise, there's certainly some vote splitting going on here... Drake London may end up being a top 10 overall pick, and somehow he's on the outside looking in for what would ultimately be our "top 20"...

 

I know ordering by position can also be messy and isn't as much fun as players, but if we're looking at WR in the first, I have to imagine a guy like London -- even if he's not the #1 or 2 WR on our board, probably would absolutely be the priority over a guy like McDuffie or Gordon.

 

I am not sure the Bills would fancy either London or McDuffie in round 1. They just don't fit their profile at the positions as I see it. Both are fine players. Not sure I expect either to end up a Bill even if they are on the board at #25. 

[glazeduck]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not sure the Bills would fancy either London or McDuffie in round 1. They just don't fit their profile at the positions as I see it. Both are fine players. Not sure I expect either to end up a Bill even if they are on the board at #25. 

Agree with you there, my point was more that when there's 5 or 6 wrs to be voted on (vs., say, 2 cbs) , everyone is going to have their favorites when it's not the actual Bills making the decisions... So if "WR" got 35 votes spread out over 4 or 5 guys in this exercise, vs. say Gordon and McDuffie splitting, say 25, in the real world, you would hope/think that the Bills would be taking WR (such that the right one is there/makes sense) over the CB.

 

It's never as easy as "swap 'player X' in with 'player y', if X goes first" but the splitting of votes feels worth noting...

[No_Matter_What]

1 hour ago, glazeduck said:

Agree with you there, my point was more that when there's 5 or 6 wrs to be voted on (vs., say, 2 cbs) , everyone is going to have their favorites when it's not the actual Bills making the decisions... So if "WR" got 35 votes spread out over 4 or 5 guys in this exercise, vs. say Gordon and McDuffie splitting, say 25, in the real world, you would hope/think that the Bills would be taking WR (such that the right one is there/makes sense) over the CB.

 

It's never as easy as "swap 'player X' in with 'player y', if X goes first" but the splitting of votes feels worth noting...

In general, I agree with you, there is always going to be some votes splitting in this kind of exercise. But I thought about it a lot and imo what we are doing here is the most objective way how to create the board (within some reasonable time). I really think that votes splitting factor is very limited.

 

Williams, Wilson and Booth were clear choices. When Booth was selected, there were 7 votes for WRs (London 3+Olave 4) and 10 votes for other CBs (McD 8 + Elam 2). When McDuffie was selected with 20 votes, there were 26 CB votes (Elam 4, Gordon 2) and 23 WR votes (17 Olave, 3 London, 2 Watson, 1 Burks). So maybe in heads up Olave would beat McDuffie (in TSW vote), but otherwise it was not a matter of vote splitting - McDuffie and Olave were clearly above the rest.

 

I think you are mostly underestimating how relatively lukewarm Bills fans on this board are towards London. If there was any major interest, he would've been chosen by now. London is 12th on consensus big board I just created for myself (ESPN, PFF, Tankathon, PFN) and Elam is 32nd (!). Elam has no business having same number of votes no matter how many more WRs are available. Same with Zion Johnson, who is 28th on consensus board. Most of people on this board think that you don't draft OG in the first, yet Johnson has as many votes as London and Burks combined. If London was viewed as top WR, he would've gone shortly after Williams, Wilson and Olave. They had no problem getting votes.

 

Also, I think there are lot of people like @GunnerBill. He voted for Watson, but I don't think his mentality at this stage is "WR" - he is not choosing London if Watson wasn't available.

Edited April 18, 2022 by No_Matter_What