Rise of the Contrarian Teams?

[BullBuchanan]

20 hours ago, Governor said:

I wonder how many of today’s QB’s would be great in the old league with the old rules.

 

Probably 2 or 3.

The top 5 in the AFC would be great in any time period. Guys put up better stats now, and the league has a lot more parity, but I don't think there is a marked difference in top-end QBs now than there was in the 90s. or the late 00's. You're just seeing a new generation get started, so it always looks like that.

It wasn't that long ago we had Brady, Manning, Manning, Rivers, Brees, Ryan, Wilson, Rodgers, Warner, Favre all slinging the rock around at a high level at the same time (besides Wilson who would come a couple years later)

In the early 90s you had Kelly, Marino, Favre, Elway, Simms, Aikman, Young, Montana, Moon, Cunningham etc

[Apocalypse Nuts]

22 hours ago, KzooMike said:

With QB/WR/CB contracts making up such large % of the cap. That's if you're even lucky enough to be in that position with a QB. Now put yourselves in the shoes of teams that don't have a clear QB. Do you really try and model teams like Buffalo? It took us 20 years to find a QB and plenty of wasted draft capital in the process. The league is always evolving and I can't help but think we are at a crossroads with the way teams go about building.

 

We saw Baltimore take Lamar with this type of mindset.  They had no intention of running a traditional NFL offense. Ironically, they very well could end up paying a traditional franchise QB price tag. Then New England last year. Both franchises really did not place a big focus on the traditional passing game. Spend resources in areas other teams aren't. Run the football and play great defense. This has been enough to allow playoff appearances by both teams but that is as far as it's gotten. Perhaps that's as far as it can go.

 

All I know is if I'm in the AFC right now I'm looking at about a dozen teams that have a nuclear bomb and I don't know if my goal is to keep up with that arms race. I think I have a better chance fighting this battle differently.  

 

Is this something you expect we will see championed by more teams in the coming years? More teams essentially reverting back to more of a traditional football strategy? 

Huh?

[Mikie2times]

14 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

I think you mis-state how the Ravens approached Jackson. There's no particular reason to think they weren't intending to run a traditional NFL offense with a bit more running. Not that year, of course, but they have moved in that general direction ever since, towards developing Lamar as a guy with more and more traditional pocket abilities and chances every year. 

 

Using a baby-friendly QB system the QB's rookie year and working him towards a full pocket system is nothing new. Balt and NE both are working their QBs towards a full traditional system with a few twists and bells and whistles. It's not all that new. More QB runs is a newer development, and we've done it ourselves, but it works incredibly well with a functional and dangerous pocket pass game but not quite so well without it.

 

Lamar Jackson only had eleven more runs than Josh did last year.

 

I don't think there's ever been a guy not using primarily a pocket passing system who's won a Super Bowl. Plenty have tried. A few have come pretty close, not least Jackson and the Ravens in 2019, but also Slash with the Steelers, Mike Vick, and I think a few others qualify depending on what you mean by "close". But none have managed it. 

 

We've seen some QBs who weren't very good win Lombardis. After Simms' injury, Hostetler managed to get the Giants a trophy. But Hostetler was working a traditional system. Same with guys like Doug Williams, Dilfer, etc. All were running from traditional systems.

 

We'll see teams try alternative ways when they can't get a guy who can succeed in a pocket passing system. You can't just give up. But if those same teams get  a chance to bring in a guy with the ability to operate from the pocket, IMO they'll do it in a second once they decide their athletic guy can't develop into efficient use of pocket passing.

 

 

I'm basing my thoughts on reading articles about the Ravens when they drafted Jackson. Most focusing on his athleticism more than anything else. Baltimore knew he was not conventional. When you combine those articles with Roman, a guy who is one of the more successful coaches in the QB run game as an OC in the last 20-30 years relative to his peers. The lack of resources Baltimore added at WR early on. Bulking up the RB positions, OL, and defense. Looking at what Lamar did in college. It seems obvious to me they did not expect to field what most would view as a conventional offensive attack. Only as teams figured them out in time have they looked to evolve into a more balanced approach which has yet to really take shape. 

[machine gun kelly]

It’s all about the QB, and those who don’t have one, try and do anything to get one.  
 

Belichick is living in the past.  As Sal says in the mornings, he counted up BB’s record with no Brady starting and was 71-79.  He was making a point and that the whole play defense and run the ball is antiquated.  They may get a wildcard,  it will get crushed against playoff caliber teams.

 

Not with Herbert, Mahomes, Wilson, Allen, Ryan, Lamar, Burrow, Watson (even if he is suspended for 6 games), and even year 2 with Lawrence.  That’s 9 QB’s in the AFC alone.

 

What does the NFC have besides and aging Brady and Rodgers.

 

The only AFC QB who is just serviceable, but has an excellent team is TN.  They just have that description referenced by the OP.

[mabden]

On 3/30/2022 at 11:19 AM, FireChans said:

Lol the Pats drafted a QB in the first round and spent the most money ever on receiving targets. 
 

How are people so wrong

 

They drafted the weakest arm in the draft in the 1st round (waste of a pick if you want a pass first offence)   Most of the "receiving" money went to two tight ends, not really a pass first duo.  Their "identity" from the start of the season to the playoffs was, run first, run heavy, control the tempo, pay great defense to keep the score low.  Why? Because their weak armed QB with no deep threat receiver could not be counted on to get them out of a hole.

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, mabden said:

 

They drafted the weakest arm in the draft in the 1st round (waste of a pick if you want a pass first offence)   Most of the "receiving" money went to two tight ends, not really a pass first duo.  Their "identity" from the start of the season to the playoffs was, run first, run heavy, control the tempo, pay great defense to keep the score low.  Why? Because their weak armed QB with no deep threat receiver could not be counted on to get them out of a hole.

They made the playoffs. Mostly because they drafted an upgrade at QB.

 

Mac may never be elite. But by drafting ANY QB in the first round, and spending a ton of money on recieving threats in FA, how can anyone say they aren’t prioritizing the passing game? 
 

You can argue it won’t work, but you can’t argue that they aren’t trying.

[Mr. WEO]

Won’t win with that strategy.