Chad Hall at Ohio State pro day

[mrags]

1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

I know. 😔

This is exactly the reason we should be thinking WR in the first round btw. Going with Williams, Olave, or Dotson would help fill that loss if we were to lose Diggs. All of them could be available at 25. Dotson being the most likely. 

[John from Riverside]

6 hours ago, whorlnut said:

The plan?  Take one in the second, third or fourth. Someone like Taylor-Britt, Woolen, McCreary, heck maybe even Gordon will be there.

 

Ive been saying for a while that it’s lunacy to draft a corner to get over the hump with the chiefs. Now we have to play hill twice regardless. Load up on inexpensive receivers on cheap deals and let them turn into our next offensive star. 
 

We have Davis for two more years before he wants more money. We will have to extend Diggs to keep him here. The rest are on short deals and are not part of the future except for maybe Knox. 
 

Crowder?  One year deal…

Howard?  One year deal…

Johnson?  One year deal…

Singletary?  Last year of his rookie deal…

McKenzie?  One year deal with the chance to be two…

 

Its time to face reality that this teams identity is the passing game. We need to make sure we are looking out for the health of the roster after more than this year.

You know this all works until we see teams just passing down the field nonstop and scoring on us I don’t want to have to outscore a team every single week by four touchdowns in order to win a game and it doesn’t work in the playoffs we are only as good as the worst corner we have on the field

[SCBills]

4 hours ago, TheBrownBear said:

I agree and we are clearly in "win now" mode with the Miller signing, so I don't see anything like this happening.  But it's a fun exercise to consider a shorter sure-fire window now vs. a potentially longer window albeit with the risk of the unknown attached to it.  

Beane has done a tremendous job keeping the long term window open.  
 

We have one massive “go for it” investment.  Von Miller.  That’s it.  We even have an out in the contract after Year 3.   
 

No future draft picks given up.  Nothing.  
 

If Diggs plays out his career here, or at least his prime, we will replace him with a pick or FA.   As long as Allen is here, and Beane keeps the philosophy he has, our window is open.  
 

I get why the Chiefs did what they did, but losing Hill for a 1 & 2 plus some mid-late picks only works if they hit on their draft capital. 
 

Im just interested to see what Mahomes looks like without the most dynamic WR/TE duo of my lifetime. 
 

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by SCBills

[mrags]

1 minute ago, John from Riverside said:

You know this all works until we see teams just passing down the field nonstop and scoring on us I don’t want to have to outscore a team every single week by four touchdowns in order to win a game and it doesn’t work in the playoffs we are only as good as the worst corner we have on the field

Except we were the best defense in the league last year and only really lost Wallace, who everyone complains about anyway. Upgraded at every spot on the DL. Jackson comes in to play right away. And you still draft a CB in the 2-3rd round to come in as well. Probably pick up a vet before the draft or at June 1st cuts also. There’s plenty of vets out there now just waiting for the draft to happen to get scooped up. 

[bobobonators]

5 hours ago, SCBills said:

Building for the future means noticing top end WR’s are going for mid-tier QB money.   You better keep the refrigerator full.  
 

We can find corners in Rounds 2 & 3.  How big of a difference do you believe CB25 is over CB57 in the grand scheme of our future?  
 

It’s all about pass rush.  You need solid corner play, but we’ve been smoked by top offenses with healthy Tre.   We can find solid corner play deeper into the draft than RD1. 

i keep going back and forth on this. I see absolutely nothing wrong with CB in RD1. If Dane gets injured before Tre bets back our CBs will be a disaster. 
 

If we draft a CB at 25 hes an instant day 1 starter on this roster. 
 

Id we draft a WR at 25, with Diggs, Davis and Crowder/McKenzie all ahead of him, how much are we going to actually use this guy this season? Maybe 300 receiving? MAYBE

 

Thats a lot to invest in a player who could very well contribute little to a season where the Bills are going all-in to win. 

 

But if Diggs goes down…or Davis..yeh it would be nice to have another weapon to plug in. I dont think there is a wrong answer per se.

 

I lean towards the everyday starter at CB being picked Rd 1. And drafting a WR in the 2nd round who can be integrated into the offensive juggernaut as the season progresses. 

[SCBills]

3 minutes ago, bobobonators said:

i keep going back and forth on this. I see absolutely nothing wrong with CB in RD1. If Dane gets injured before Tre bets back our CBs will be a disaster. 
 

If we draft a CB at 25 hes an instant day 1 starter on this roster. 
 

Id we draft a WR at 25, with Diggs, Davis and Crowder/McKenzie all ahead of him, how much are we going to actually use this guy this season? Maybe 300 receiving? MAYBE

 

Thats a lot to invest in a player who could very well contribute little to a season where the Bills are going all-in to win. 

 

But if Diggs goes down…or Davis..yeh it would be nice to have another weapon to plug in. I dont think there is a wrong answer per se.

 

I lean towards the everyday starter at CB being picked Rd 1. And drafting a WR in the 2nd round who can be integrated into the offensive juggernaut as the season progresses. 

I don’t think Crowder and McKenzie would be ahead of certain WR’s.  
 

And in Jameson Williams case, we get a top 10 talent who were perfectly positioned to absorb the half season he may miss due to our existing WR depth.  

I simply don’t see Booth or Elam types moving the needle in the way a high profile WR would.   McDermott is great with developing the secondary guys, and modern day pass defenses are more predicated upon pressure rate/sacks than they are elite secondary players (See Dolphins/Bills lately)

 

[bobobonators]

6 minutes ago, SCBills said:

I don’t think Crowder and McKenzie would be ahead of certain WR’s.  
 

And in Jameson Williams case, we get a top 10 talent who were perfectly positioned to absorb the half season he may miss due to our existing WR depth.  

I simply don’t see Booth or Elam types moving the needle in the way a high profile WR would.   McDermott is great with developing the secondary guys, and modern day pass defenses are more predicated upon pressure rate/sacks than they are elite secondary players (See Dolphins/Bills lately)

 

I dont necessarily disagree with you but im having a hard time seeing the production coming from a rookie WR in this offense, barring any major injury at WR

 

Take last season, Cole Beasley, who was well integrated into this offense had less than 700yds receiving at WR3. 
 

Do you think a rookie is going to come in and beat out Davis? Maybe, but Davis has earned his shot at WR2 and will likely get it. 
 

Crowder is a really damn good slot receiver. Hes 100% going to start if hes healthy. 
 

And we havent even touched on Knox and McKenzie. But this second any WR we draft is going to battling for WR4/WR5 spot on this offense. I think youre being a bit unrealistic if you expect something different (again barring injury). And how much production is there to spread around to your WR4/WR5 to justify a 1st rd pick? 
 

But again, if we do go WR i get it. Im aware our bread and butter is the passing game. Cant hurt to load up
 

 

[Tanoros]

6 hours ago, SCBills said:

Good. 
 

While the knee jerk reaction to the Hill trade and our CB depth is to take a Cornerback at 25, I think all this WR movement tells us that the pick needs to be a Wide Receiver. 
 

Taking McDuffie, Booth etc at 25 isn’t stopping Tyreek Hill.   We can’t even single cover him with a healthy Tre White.  He’s just not that type of WR… you have to bracket.  
 

25-30M going rate for elite WR’s now… Draft one and hope Diggs loves Buffalo enough to take a “discount” when the time comes. 

After seeing Hills contract, this is what I’m stating to think too. I don’t think we can afford to pay Diggs 30 mil per season and we need leverage/insurance. 

Edited March 24, 2022 by Tanoros

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, mrags said:

Except we were the best defense in the league last year and only really lost Wallace, who everyone complains about anyway. Upgraded at every spot on the DL. Jackson comes in to play right away. And you still draft a CB in the 2-3rd round to come in as well. Probably pick up a vet before the draft or at June 1st cuts also. There’s plenty of vets out there now just waiting for the draft to happen to get scooped up. 

We have no idea what tree is going to look back when he comes back off that injury

[mrags]

4 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

We have no idea what tree is going to look back when he comes back off that injury

That’s correct. But I have a feeling Beane and McDermott have an idea. Or they would have picked up a vet CB already. Even if they were to grab one in rounds 1-3. 

[hondo in seattle]

 

8 hours ago, whorlnut said:

The plan?  Take one in the second, third or fourth. Someone like Taylor-Britt, Woolen, McCreary, heck maybe even Gordon will be there.

 

Ive been saying for a while that it’s lunacy to draft a corner to get over the hump with the chiefs. Now we have to play hill twice regardless. Load up on inexpensive receivers on cheap deals and let them turn into our next offensive star. 
 

...

 

Its time to face reality that this teams identity is the passing game. We need to make sure we are looking out for the health of the roster after more than this year.

 

I don't disagree about the need for receivers.   But it's lunacy to say drafting a corner is lunacy.   Today's game, not just in Buffalo, is a passing game.  That's where most of the yards are gained and most of the points are scored.  So we have to be good at both the pass and stopping the pass.   

 

We didn't lose to the Chiefs because we couldn't score.  We lost because we couldn't stop them from scoring.  

 

We're a nickel defense.  We need 3 good corners.  Depending on Tre's recovery, it's questionable if we even have one right now.  

 

 

8 hours ago, whorlnut said:

No offense, but I can sort of expect a response like this from someone a little longer in the tooth. This isn’t the old days anymore. This is a passing league and we need to make sure we continue to have that as a strength going forward. We have a ton of one year deals on offense and need to develop and build some continuity to make sure this is sustainable...

 

Not sure why you are taking shots at us older fans.  You should be on your knees, genuflecting in respect for our superior experience and wisdom.  

[John from Riverside]

3 hours ago, mrags said:

He’s probably going to be gone at the end of this season. Hopefully after we hoist them Lombardi trophy. But you could see a decent extension at the end of his deal with guaranteed money. This way it doesn’t take effect until his current contract is up. At the same time it buys a little time for the cap to go up. Which I’m 100% sure the owners will be pushing for. The Jerry Joneses of the NFL find it unfair that they are handcuffed by the same cap issues as the poorest teams. Just like everything else in society today, inflation is making things crazy. I completely believe the cap numbers will increase significantly in the near future. 

Diggs is not going anywhere anytime soon I have no idea why you would think that he has two years left on his deal and we’re probably going to give him a new contract before then you don’t take a number one receiver and move him on

[OldTimer1960]

10 hours ago, LEBills said:

you realize we played several weeks including the playoffs last year with Dane Jackson and a player we didn’t feel was worth $4 million/ year starting right?

 

Poyer and Hyde help a lot in making things easier for cornerbacks in our system. 

And the D wasn’t good enough to hold a lead for 13 seconds.

[whorlnut]

8 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

You know this all works until we see teams just passing down the field nonstop and scoring on us I don’t want to have to outscore a team every single week by four touchdowns in order to win a game and it doesn’t work in the playoffs we are only as good as the worst corner we have on the field

Pretty sure we gave up the least amount of touchdowns as any team last year. Also pretty sure we did it with an undrafted free agent and a 7th round pick played opposite one another since thanksgiving. We aren’t as bad at that position as you think and we don’t NEED to take a corner in the first round. We will draft one at some point and FA isn’t over yet. 

5 hours ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

 

I don't disagree about the need for receivers.   But it's lunacy to say drafting a corner is lunacy.   Today's game, not just in Buffalo, is a passing game.  That's where most of the yards are gained and most of the points are scored.  So we have to be good at both the pass and stopping the pass.   

 

We didn't lose to the Chiefs because we couldn't score.  We lost because we couldn't stop them from scoring.  

 

We're a nickel defense.  We need 3 good corners.  Depending on Tre's recovery, it's questionable if we even have one right now.  

 

 

 

Not sure why you are taking shots at us older fans.  You should be on your knees, genuflecting in respect for our superior experience and wisdom.  

First of all…I meant a first round corner. I think we can and should wait until rounds 2-4. 
 

Second…I’m an older fan too. But I’m not set in my ways to think defense is still the end all-be all in today’s game. There was a time where it reigned supreme, but in today’s game, top offenses are crushing top defenses at a higher rate. 

[JGMcD2]

9 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Seriously…. They’ve literally been loading up on defense since they’ve got here.… and seem to prioritize tweaking/fixing it every offseason at the expense of the offense… time to get with the times and load up the offensive playmakers and help for Allen(not that I don’t like the Crowder and OJ signings).

I don’t disagree we need to spend draft capital on the offense this year, and would like to see our RD1 pick on a WR if it’s the right fit. 
 

Although, I’m not sure how you can say they’re prioritizing the defense at the expense of the offense. They’ve been a top 3 offense two seasons straight… the offense hasn’t suffered… they’ve just acquired talent through other avenues. 

 

At least the way I’m reading what you wrote, you’re suggesting the offense has suffered because of their investment in the defense through the draft. It may not be your intention, but that’s how it seems to be written. 

Edited March 24, 2022 by JGMcD2

[whorlnut]

8 hours ago, mrags said:

This is exactly the reason we should be thinking WR in the first round btw. Going with Williams, Olave, or Dotson would help fill that loss if we were to lose Diggs. All of them could be available at 25. Dotson being the most likely. 

Exactly right. If we did lose Diggs, we would be in trouble. Davis might want big money in two years if he continues to ascend too. The point is, the passing game is our identity and we need to do all that we can to make sure that doesn’t go away. 

4 hours ago, OldTimer1960 said:

And the D wasn’t good enough to hold a lead for 13 seconds.

I just don’t know how to reason with you. It. Was. Coaching. 

[CorkScrewHill]

Lamb 1st rounder, Evans 1st rounder, Jefferson 1st rounder, M. Williams 1st round; Chase 1st rounder; Godwin 3rd rounder, Diggs 5th rounder; Hill 5th rounder; Davis 4th rounder; Adams 2nd rounder; Kupp 3rd rounder, Renfrow 5th rounder, D. Johnson undrafted. Obviously there are talented receivers in the first round, but WR tend to be a bit more hit and miss. The best CBs in the league (Ramsey, White, Gilmore, Lattimore, Ward) tend to be 1st rounders, some exceptions are X. Howard 2nd rounder, J.C. Jackson & Kenny Moore who were undrafted.

 

Therefore I would definitely target a Cornerback.

[CapeBreton]

I like the idea of drafting Olave at 25, more for the reason of blocking the Chiefs from getting one of the top WRs at 29/30.

[Hebert19]

15 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

I really want to hear the overall plan for those who dont want a corner at 25

 

I know ppl like their shiny new toys but this is not about that.....we have a 17 game schedule and NO starting corner at the moment

Remember.  Ej Gaines was good in this system.  We need a vet and a rookie regardless of round we take.  Maybe 2 rookies. 

[whorlnut]

58 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

I don’t disagree we need to spend draft capital on the offense this year, and would like to see our RD1 pick on a WR if it’s the right fit. 
 

Although, I’m not sure how you can say they’re prioritizing the defense at the expense of the offense. They’ve been a top 3 offense two seasons straight… the offense hasn’t suffered… they’ve just acquired talent through other avenues. 

 

At least the way I’m reading what you wrote, you’re suggesting the offense has suffered because of their investment in the defense through the draft. It may not be your intention, but that’s how it seems to be written. 

They were THE TOP defense last year. Good grief. 

33 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

There were certainly several times it suffered last season with piss poor blocking. They’ve still had a very functional offense though all because of Allen…. Don’t get me wrong, I love the move for Miller, but I’d like them to invest more offensively to give their QB some more help instead of consistently trying to fix the defense(defensive line in particular) while Allen has to find a way to will his team to victory as he’s done the past couple years… and while it’s still early, Im struggling to see where they’ve upgraded the offensive line outside of a once good, but now declining Saffold.

Exactly. Without Allen, that offense is mediocre at best. Get him more elite help and take the pressure off. 
 

Im not really overwhelmed by what they have added this year. They added some nice pieces, sure, but they are all on one year deals. There are no long term solutions.