Ryan "Rick" Bates Watch Thread

[Simon]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I mean I reported this two days ago 👀

 

 

 

 

Congrats and sorry I mentioned it

[YoloinOhio]

Really hoping for a return of Darryl Williams at RG instead for the money. Especially next to Spencer brown. And a day 2 draft pick for the love of god please.

 

I’m so glad the bears are at least trying to protect Fields after last year.

Edited March 25, 2022 by YoloinOhio

[longtimebillsfan]

6 hours ago, Locomark said:

It is on Thursday’s NFL transaction list that Bates signed the Bears offer sheet. So the ball is our court to match or punt. I expect a match with a 2 year deal unless the Beats offer is silly and front loaded. 

I wouldn't be surprised if the Bears structure the offer in a way that prevents the Bills from matching the offer.  This has happened frequently in the past.

 

I think Bates is gone.

[JohnnyBuffalo]

Let’s go sign every shiny thing under the sun and forget the foundation that holds the most important shiny thing in place….I’m concerned.

 

QB check

Next most important spot…o line….no improvement as far as I can tell.   But then again I have not read everything available as I have been working too much.   
 

GO BILLS!

 

[MAJBobby]

 

here is the deadline. And the fact we haven’t even heard of the numbers yet makes me lean to not a bad offer sheet in terms of the Bills. 

[MrEpsYtown]

17 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

here is the deadline. And the fact we haven’t even heard of the numbers yet makes me lean to not a bad offer sheet in terms of the Bills. 

 

I agree. If the offer sheet was ridiculous the Bills would have leaked it to show that the Bears overpaid and justify them not matching. 

[YoloinOhio]

1 hour ago, JohnnyBuffalo said:

Let’s go sign every shiny thing under the sun and forget the foundation that holds the most important shiny thing in place….I’m concerned.

 

QB check

Next most important spot…o line….no improvement as far as I can tell.   But then again I have not read everything available as I have been working too much.   
 

GO BILLS!

 

Rodger Saffold was signed to play LG prior to signing anything “shiny”. It was literally the first thing they did along with extending Mitch Morse.

Edited March 25, 2022 by YoloinOhio

[DrPJax]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The problem is we have such a small sample size to really evaluate Bates on. He is a risk to commit a serious chunk of change to. A team like the Bears, miles away from anything can afford to take that risk more than a team like the Bills loading up for a run where every penny counts. I am a bit disappointed with what they have done at guard in FA though. Got to believe we will see an interior OL in the meat and potatoes rounds of this draft (2 through 4).

I understand your great point; however it’s not like he was just on the roster for a few games or just one season.  They have had plenty of time to evaluate him, and after he performed well, it looks like they underestimated his talent and continually over valued Ford ( Fina , who Rarely is critical of guys on the roster , said Ford has heavy feet and has not lived up to what you expect at this point) and they may have under valued Bates again with the lower tender.  So they got rid of Williams, Feliciano , and now will probably lose Bates’ and so far just brought in a guy for a year in Safford.  What happened to all the talk by Beane of protecting Josh,  as you stated?  This looks like a mess to me. Hard to believe they plan on drafting a rookie at guard to plug and play ; just look at Brown as it took several games of horrible line play before they stuck with him , mostly forced to because of injuries.  So do you think Beane meant we needed to protect Josh and he was depending on grabbing a starting guard in the draft ; just seems unlikely to me, and depth is still a major concern as we witnessed many injuries on the O line in the reg season last year. 
 

I think Beane made an error, as  Bates’ stabilized the line going into the playoffs and the line play unquestionably got better after he was inserted. With the low tender and losing Bates’ , you essentially lose three starters and gained one guard.  So at a minimum we are really questionable with depth now and it’s looking like because of the cap , they may go back to Ford at RG, and imo  that’s a disaster waiting to happen. I hate to see them going thru what they did last year with all the numerous changes in the line , when all this could have been ( and maybe still could be ) avoided by sticking with Bates’.  Yes, it was a limited STARTING sample, yet he gave them nothing to really be critical of or to base speculation that if paid he suddenly would get worse.  He is definitely safer than trying one more time with Ford.  If they lose him , I think it was an avoidable mistake on Beanes part and we are back to always working on the D line , but never doing enough with the o line to have a consistent starting group heading into the season opener. I don’t know enough about the FA from the dolphins but just judging their line play , I find it hard to believe they let some great talent walk , and I thought he was to take Bates’ place for depth purposes.  So it would seem like going in circles with the O line and it is forcing a need that Beane can’t ignore in the draft and goes against his preaching of taking BPA. 
 

I agree with you that they now can’t avoid addressing guard in the draft , and they are also almost forced into addressing CB as well.   That may take away from their ability to get an offensive playmaker to keep giving Josh , who you live and die with, some Stability at  wr / rb who he he could develop chemistry with for years to come. So far he has benefitted with Gabe and Knox ( took awhile to have that happen as they were projects in later rounds),  but everything else has been by grabbing Free agents and who knows how that will go. We hit with Smoke ( for a year of production only really) Beasley ( couple of good years ) , Sanders imo was a disappointment, tight ends have been disappointing ( let’s see If Howard bucks that trend ), Running backs have been very average so far ( this year again going with our second choice of FA rb who had productive years at least a couple of years back, so that’s another ?) , and our one big hit has been Diggs. Crowder could be good , but has developed injury issues and chemistry with Josh has to be developed again , which gives me ptsd after Sanders.
 

  My point is you have your franchise qb after 20 years of crap , and he is here 5 years now , and we have drafted 1 starting caliber  WR, 1 starting caliber TE,  1 possible starting Rb ( and I think we could do much better than motor ) 2 starting O linemen ( Dawkins / Brown)  as guys that can grow with Josh.  We have thrown a ton of FA money at the d line and used multiple high picks there and spent more money on special teams / Punter, various Cbs , various LBs  without hesitation, yet we are losing a starting guard because of a lack of foresight EVEN AFTER BEANE SAID IT WAS SUCH A PRIORITY!  When will they get serious about providing Josh with tools that will be here for more than a season , and use the draft to help with the cap and stop only helping the O by throwing new FA’s as stop gaps that require adjustment year after year.  Josh is how you win the SB ; look at how Burrows thrived with the right WR who has speed!  We don’t have that and now we may be forced to go CB , possibly guard o-line , early as we have no depth there.  You have a superstar qb , and the best you can do is keep throwing FA’s at the O ( wr , o line , rb) and I think you could argue they are placing him at risk of injury,  and not fully helping him become even better than he is now because they only look at tools for him AFTER  filling holes on the d and now they potentially have lost a starting guard unnecessarily.
 

 Maybe I will be wrong , and they match Bates’ offer and draft a talented Wr/ or Rb ( only the one rb is worth a 1 st imo) and go cb in the 4 th or later ( they have a track record of successfully developing cbs in later rounds , more so than success at developing wrs / rbs with later picks as for every Gabe there is hodgins ,foster, Zay jones, sweeny , Stevenson so far , moss, etc) and plan for the future by maximizing talent around Josh !  I hope so because we have done a ton for the defense ( whose limiting factor MAY be Frazier ), while every year Josh has been required to deal with a lot of variables , including a ROOKIE OC  this year and now again new o line men and a new slot receiver.  Focusing so much on the d got us a “#1” D , but we see where that facade has gotten us In the playoffs so far , early trips home ( but adding Miller is finally a great move defensively and no one could argue against that as a legit addition).    However, Beane , I hope does what he  promised , protect and give Josh all the support he deserves and that’s our  road to a Lombardi. The Bates’ issue and draft time will tell if it’s same old thing , or will we finally give Josh weapons to keep growing with !? 🙂

[Rico]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

Rodger Saffold was signed to play LG prior to signing anything “shiny”. It was literally the first thing they did along with extending Mitch Morse.

Major upgrade over Bates.

[Golden]

There’s money to be “had” if they restructure Allen’s contract. Bates is reported to have elevated the communication on the O line as well as he is solid in pass pro.  Run blocking maybe not so much.  Now, we have Kromer on board.  You’ve got to believe without tendering any draft pick comp on Bates that the Bills FO has a plan B, C & D in place.  Right guard & CB are the 2 “red flags”  right now.  They let Wallace go, it does not appear that he “out priced” them.  I’m sure there’s a plan B, C & D in place there as well.  I always reserve the right to be wrong, however I’d find it hard to believe that Beane “throws mud at the wall & hopes that it sticks” when it comes to these areas of need.  I know he wants to go BPA in the upcoming draft. 

[CorkScrewHill]

Per Sports Illustrated the contract is heavily front-loaded to make it difficult for the Bills to match.  They also gave some ideas how they could get some additional cap.

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/bills/news/top-options-for-bills-now-that-ryan-bates-has-signed-bears-offer-sheet

[MAJBobby]

8 minutes ago, CorkScrewHill said:

Per Sports Illustrated the contract is heavily front-loaded to make it difficult for the Bills to match.  They also gave some ideas how they could get some additional cap.

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/bills/news/top-options-for-bills-now-that-ryan-bates-has-signed-bears-offer-sheet

All speculation.  "believed to be" front loaded.  Release the numbers or the "report" is not that hard to put together without knowing anything about the Deal.  A fan could have written this....  It doesnt take a rocket scientist to say well Bills are cap stropped at first look.  The way to make sure they cannot match is front load it.

Edited March 25, 2022 by MAJBobby

[Golden]

5 minutes ago, CorkScrewHill said:

Per Sports Illustrated the contract is heavily front-loaded to make it difficult for the Bills to match.  They also gave some ideas how they could get some additional cap.

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/bills/news/top-options-for-bills-now-that-ryan-bates-has-signed-bears-offer-sheet

I would be surprised if the Bills go higher than 5 or 5.5 million annually for Bates.  They knew all of this might occur (heavily front loaded offer/ contract from another team).  I doubt they are surprised.  

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Golden said:

I would be surprised if the Bills go higher than 5 or 5.5 million annually for Bates.  They knew all of this might occur (heavily front loaded offer/ contract from another team).  I doubt they are surprised.  

And to be honest I feel for the team that goes high on a Player that in  3 years has 6 games of meaningful production

[ALF]

If the Bills are longer term and more guaranteed money that could do it.

[Golden]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

And to be honest I feel for the team that goes high on a Player that in  3 years has 6 games of meaningful production

Right on👊  I think you just captured a good part of the Bills FO mind set right there.  

1 minute ago, ALF said:

If the Bills are longer term and more guaranteed money that could do it.

Yeah,

Well said, if they want Bates they will get creative.  

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, ALF said:

If the Bills are longer term and more guaranteed money that could do it.

That they cannot do.  Have to MATCH the offer.  meaning whatever Bears signed is Bates contract this year.  Can redo it if needed next year.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

40 minutes ago, DrPJax said:

 

I think Beane made an error, as  Bates’ stabilized the line going into the playoffs and the line play unquestionably got better after he was inserted. With the low tender and losing Bates’ , you essentially lose three starters and gained one guard.  So at a minimum we are really questionable with depth now and it’s looking like because of the cap , they may go back to Ford at RG, and imo  that’s a disaster waiting to happen. I hate to see them going thru what they did last year with all the numerous changes in the line

 

Last I counted there are 5 starters on the O-line, Morse, Dawkins, and Brown are back that makes three.  If Bates does leave they lost their two guards, but added one back in Stafford.  That places them one starter down and one sub Feliciano who by the end of last season contributed very little.  Starting a rookie on the O-line isn't that unheard of and they can still or sign someone still out there.

 

What is sounds like you're entire point is, Beane made a mistake by not over paying for Bates.  If that's his biggest mistake that's not a bad problem to have.  We also have no idea if the Bills tried to work out a long term deal with him prior to giving the tender but again Bates wanted much more than they valued him at.

[MrEpsYtown]

11 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

That they cannot do.  Have to MATCH the offer.  meaning whatever Bears signed is Bates contract this year.  Can redo it if needed next year.

The only other alternative is, I believe, they can work out some sort of trade with the Bears to not match. But yeah they have to match the offer once he signs it. 

[CincyBillsFan]

Can Tommy Doyle play guard?