Breece Hall Please!!

[NewEra]

22 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Kamara’s numbers are an outlier. The vast majority of the top RBs in the league routinely have great college resumes. Go ahead and post the numbers. Taylor, Henry, Barkley, Harris, Cook, CMC, Jones, Hunt, Chubb, Mixon, EIliott, Dobbins, Swift, etc. They all had great numbers. The larger the numbers, the better the player it seems like. Look at Henry’s 2000 season and Taylor’s big numbers. Even Dalvin Cook had large numbers. 

Swift- started 8 games in his first 2 season.

Missed the playoffs 

dobbins- committee back for one year, torn acl the next.  Missed the playoffs 

 

Elliott-  no one wants zeke Elliot or his contract. He’s a committee back- didn’t win a playoff game.

 

chubb + hunt-  in the same committee- hunt missed half the year.  Chubb has missed 8 games in 2 years. Both missed the playoffs 
 

barkley and CMC - Broken- terrible draft picks.- both missed the playoffs 

 

henry- beast, but he broke last year- 

 

harris was a 3rd rd pick.  Didn’t win a playoff game 
 

cook- hurt the last 2 seasons.  Missed the playoffs both years.  

mixon- good back- made the super bowl.  Punched a girl in the face.  
 

taylor- beast- plays behind a top 3 line- maybe the best line-  missed the playoffs. 
 

jones- great back-  didn’t win a playoff game as the #1 seed.  
 

Great running backs mean nothing in the landscape of winning in the NFL.  

 

[OldTimer1960]

12 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Like I said, im not opposed to drafting a RD1 CB.  It would have to be RD1 also, otherwise there’s no point on taking one until the middle rounds as elite trait guys will be gone by 57.  
 

Im also not opposed to going all offense RD1,2,3.  WR, RB, OG.  Sign a cheap FA vet and then draft two corners in RD4-6. 
 

While we’re a team building to win a Super Bowl, getting the 1 seed in the AFC will be massive moving forward, so I get the fear of entering the season without any above average talent at outside-corner… I’m just saying I think we can get by until Tre comes back with the upgraded DL and defensive scheme.  Just hope we don’t get LA & KC early in the season.  

I agree that CB in round 1 is best shot to get a good one.  I don’t agree that if you don’t take one until pick 57, then you might as well wait until the 4th or later.  
 

Regarding no above average talent at outside corner, they don’t currently even have average talent there.  Maybe Dane Jackson is OK, but he is very unproven and there is zero beyond him.  Neal is ok in the slot, but will be a constant target for opposing offenses.

 

What if teams go 4 wide and you have to play Jackson, Neal, Johnson and Cam Lewis?  That doesn’t sound good to me…

[NewEra]

3 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

I agree that CB in round 1 is best shot to get a good one.  I don’t agree that if you don’t take one until pick 57, then you might as well wait until the 4th or later.  
 

Regarding no above average talent at outside corner, they don’t currently even have average talent there.  Maybe Dane Jackson is OK, but he is very unproven and there is zero beyond him.  Neal is ok in the slot, but will be a constant target for opposing offenses.

 

What if teams go 4 wide and you have to play Jackson, Neal, Johnson and Cam Lewis?  That doesn’t sound good to me…

And what happens when one of them gets hurt?  

[OldTimer1960]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

And what happens when one of them gets hurt?  

If they don’t shore up corner, it erodes the gains they added to the pass rush.  
 

I am not crazy about it being basically mandatory to draft a corner first, because it is possible that the good ones will be gone by 25 and then what?  But that is how it shapes up as of today.  Got to get another receiver somewhere as well unless you want to be the offense on McKenzie being a good slot guy

[NewEra]

6 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

If they don’t shore up corner, it erodes the gains they added to the pass rush.  
 

I am not crazy about it being basically mandatory to draft a corner first, because it is possible that the good ones will be gone by 25 and then what?  But that is how it shapes up as of today.  Got to get another receiver somewhere as well unless you want to be the offense on McKenzie being a good slot guy

I don’t think we should draft a CB unless that corner is the #1 player on our board.  If a WR, OL, DL is the #1, we should take that player.  I wouldn’t want to take a safety.   A LB, TE or a RB @ 25, I prefer not, but if they love the player, so be it.  
 

If we don’t add a vet corner in FA, I really hope we take one in rd 1-3.  

[OldTimer1960]

8 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I don’t think we should draft a CB unless that corner is the #1 player on our board.  If a WR, OL, DL is the #1, we should take that player.  I wouldn’t want to take a safety.   A LB, TE or a RB @ 25, I prefer not, but if they love the player, so be it.  
 

If we don’t add a vet corner in FA, I really hope we take one in rd 1-3.  

Who do you see available at corner after the first that could play meaningful snaps this year?  Guys that are predominantly slot corners won't be of much help to the Bills in filling their outside corner need.  

 

On the flip side, I think there will be one or more WRs at 57 who could help the Bills replace Beasley in the slot.

 

Interior OL is going to be a problem to fill with a draft choice.  It doesn't look like a really good year to find a G.

Edited March 20, 2022 by OldTimer1960

[mrags]

36 minutes ago, NewEra said:

 

Great running backs mean nothing in the landscape of winning in the NFL.  

 

The problem with this argument is that none of those backs are on teams that are serious contenders and favorites to win the Super Bowl. You can argue that Zeke and the Cowboys are close, but that’s about it for that list.
 

Nobody ever really believed Tennessee was with Tannehill at QB. Just like nobody ever believed the Colts were with Wentz. Those teams were only in the conversations throughout the year because of their incredible Running Backs. without Taylor the Colts would have been a 5 win team. The Titans somehow managed but I don’t think that was expected, and definitely don’t think it’s repeatable. 

[NewEra]

4 minutes ago, mrags said:

The problem with this argument is that none of those backs are on teams that are serious contenders and favorites to win the Super Bowl. You can argue that Zeke and the Cowboys are close, but that’s about it for that list.
 

Nobody ever really believed Tennessee was with Tannehill at QB. Just like nobody ever believed the Colts were with Wentz. Those teams were only in the conversations throughout the year because of their incredible Running Backs. without Taylor the Colts would have been a 5 win team. The Titans somehow managed but I don’t think that was expected, and definitely don’t think it’s repeatable. 

It’s an easily replaceable position and having and elite RB means very little in the NFL.  There’s a reason RBs are paid so little and their draft value is so low.  

[mrags]

11 minutes ago, NewEra said:

It’s an easily replaceable position and having and elite RB means very little in the NFL.  There’s a reason RBs are paid so little and their draft value is so low.  

Easily replaceable…. Yes. Replaceable with elite talent… no. Nobody is replacing Taylor or Henry right now. And those teams wouldn’t give them up for anything. 
 

one could argue that getting a young RB that can do it all on a rookie contract is extremely important to an offense and makes all the difference in the world. 
 

I HATED CJ Spiller. But imagining what this offense could be with someone like Spiller I’m his prime would make it unstoppable. If Hall isn’t the answer, that’s fine. But the fact is Beane agrees with this more than you do apparently. He tried for a fast, receiving RB in FA and apparently got pretty upset when we were screwed by Washington. And they were reportedly interested in Ettiene in last years draft only to lose out on him a few picks before us. 
 

this team is missing a dynamic RB. That can do it all and take it to the end zone on any given play. 

[NewEra]

33 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

Who do you see available at corner after the first that could play meaningful snaps this year?  Guys that are predominantly slot corners won't be of much help to the Bills in filling their outside corner need.  

 

On the flip side, I think there will be one or more WRs at 57 who could help the Bills replace Beasley in the slot.

 

Interior OL is going to be a problem to fill with a draft choice.  It doesn't look like a really good year to find a G.

Agreed. Boundary corners only-  

 

Outside corners that could be available rd2-4:  Emerson, Bryant, woolen, akayleb Evans, Goodrich, josh Williams, jobe, Alontae Taylor, Waller.  

 

5 minutes ago, mrags said:

Easily replaceable…. Yes. Replaceable with elite talent… no. Nobody is replacing Taylor or Henry right now. And those teams wouldn’t give them up for anything. 
 

one could argue that getting a young RB that can do it all on a rookie contract is extremely important to an offense and makes all the difference in the world. 
 

I HATED CJ Spiller. But imagining what this offense could be with someone like Spiller I’m his prime would make it unstoppable. If Hall isn’t the answer, that’s fine. But the fact is Beane agrees with this more than you do apparently. He tried for a fast, receiving RB in FA and apparently got pretty upset when we were screwed by Washington. And they were reportedly interested in Ettiene in last years draft only to lose out on him a few picks before us. 
 

this team is missing a dynamic RB. That can do it all and take it to the end zone on any given play. 

With “elite talent”, who cares if your RB is elite??  Just about every team in the league would prefer to have an elite talent at WR, OL, DL, CB….even TE.

 

 What have elite talent rbs accomplished in the nfl in the last 20 years besides making the HoF?  Not winning Super Bowls.  
 

cj spiller didn’t know how to read running lanes.  He was a terrible rb that Chan Gailey knew how to use properly. Fred jackson was so much better than spiller.

Edited March 20, 2022 by NewEra

[OldTimer1960]

3 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Agreed. Boundary corners only-  

 

Outside corners that could be available rd2-4:  Emerson, Bryant, woolen, akayleb Evans, Goodrich, josh Williams, jobe, Alontae Taylor, Waller.  

 

Seems quite a drop.  If it were me, if they pass on CB in round 1, I would be looking to trade up in round 2 to try to get Kyler Gordan or Roger McCreary.  I haven't read a lot of flattering scouting reports on Emerson and I wouldn't want to count on small school guys having to play a lot of snaps this year.

 

The equation changes significantly (at least for me) if they sign a vet who can be a viable starter this season.  I think you have to assume that White will miss the first month or more of the season.  So, you really need to find to players to start at outside CB for at least that time - maybe one is Dane Jackson, but I would not count on that.

[NewEra]

Just now, OldTimer1960 said:

Seems quite a drop.  If it were me, if they pass on CB in round 1, I would be looking to trade up in round 2 to try to get Kyler Gordan or Roger McCreary.  I haven't read a lot of flattering scouting reports on Emerson and I wouldn't want to count on small school guys having to play a lot of snaps this year.

 

The equation changes significantly (at least for me) if they sign a vet who can be a viable starter this season.  I think you have to assume that White will miss the first month or more of the season.  So, you really need to find to players to start at outside CB for at least that time - maybe one is Dane Jackson, but I would not count on that.

Yeah it’s quite a drop for sure.  Just as there’s also a big drop from the top 6 WRs and the rest.  
 

Maybe we can get lucky and land Pickens or Watson in rd 2.  But the other WRs are way below the top 6 imo. 
 

either way….i hope they pick a player @ 25 instead of picking a position.  If all else is close to equal, take guy that plays the position of biggest need.  Most likely CB if we don’t sign someone 

[JaCrispy]

Wouldn’t mind at all if Breece Hall was BPA pick at 25!

 

Anytime you can add a game changing play maker like that, with the first pick, it’s a good thing...👍

Edited March 20, 2022 by JaCrispy

[Norcalbillsfan]

I think bills go pass catching specialist with pass blocking ability. Bills obviously wanted mckissic pretty bad, making me think mcD values pass blocking over speed. Though I would love the whole package.

[mrags]

37 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Agreed. Boundary corners only-  

 

Outside corners that could be available rd2-4:  Emerson, Bryant, woolen, akayleb Evans, Goodrich, josh Williams, jobe, Alontae Taylor, Waller.  

 

With “elite talent”, who cares if your RB is elite??  Just about every team in the league would prefer to have an elite talent at WR, OL, DL, CB….even TE.

 

 What have elite talent rbs accomplished in the nfl in the last 20 years besides making the HoF?  Not winning Super Bowls.  
 

cj spiller didn’t know how to read running lanes.  He was a terrible rb that Chan Gailey knew how to use properly. Fred jackson was so much better than spiller.

I just realized it. You are Mike Schoop. It’s also a realization why I stopped posting on this site about 4 years ago. Because people are more stubborn than I am and refuse to ever listen to another’s discussion. Your argument is only in absolutes and there’s obviously more ways to think about it. The fact is, that there will be team that takes Hall or another top RB earlier than later in the draft. Weather they will make an impact will be determined based on what team drafts them and if they are primed for a Super Bowl run like we are. 
 

Im not saying that RB is our only piece we are missing. I’m simply stating that a dynamic RB is a missing from this offense. And would help immensely. 
 

Have a good day 

[NewEra]

13 minutes ago, mrags said:

I just realized it. You are Mike Schoop. It’s also a realization why I stopped posting on this site about 4 years ago. Because people are more stubborn than I am and refuse to ever listen to another’s discussion. Your argument is only in absolutes and there’s obviously more ways to think about it. The fact is, that there will be team that takes Hall or another top RB earlier than later in the draft. Weather they will make an impact will be determined based on what team drafts them and if they are primed for a Super Bowl run like we are. 
 

Im not saying that RB is our only piece we are missing. I’m simply stating that a dynamic RB is a missing from this offense. And would help immensely. 
 

Have a good day 

Bittersweet that I’ve had that kind of impact.  I haven’t missed you.  Stubborn can’t handle stubborn.  Ironic.  ✌️ 

 

Yes, this team is missing a dynamic running back.  I agree with you.  I’d love to have Kenneth Walker or Breece Hall.  But not at the expense of a 1st rd pick.  Sure, if we had a dynamic running back, our team would be better. It would also be better if we had a dynamic player at any position.  We’re missing dynamic players @ LG, C, RG, RT, WR2, WR3, RB.  Tight end is debatable but I like our TEs.  Adding a dynamic player at any of those positions makes us better.
 

if we draft a RB @ 25, I won’t be mad.  RBs are traditionally my favorite position/player.  My favorite players are growing up we’re Cribbs, Bell, thurman then Henry, Marshawn, Fred in adulthood.  I just don’t think taking one in rd 1 this year is a smart move.  I’d rather take a corner to pair with Tre, a WR to pair with Diggs or an OL to make offense easier and keep our QB healthy.  
 

 

[BillsFanForever19]

1 hour ago, JaCrispy said:

Wouldn’t mind at all if Breece Hall was BPA pick at 25!

 

Anytime you can add a game changing play maker like that, with the first pick, it’s a good thing...👍

 

Tre is coming off an ACL tear and we have a hole at the other starting Corner position. We lost Cole Beasley and Emmanuel Sanders at WR and haven't done anything to replace their roster spots. We only have 1 OG and one OT behind our Starting Line and may very well lose Ryan Bates, creating a hole at RG.

 

Given those facts, I would lose my mind if we took a RB with our 1st pick. Especially when Devin Singletary looked the best he ever has in the last quarter of our year using him as the primary ball carrier.

 

The signing of JD McKissic for 3.5 mil and them not being interested in bringing in anyone who wanted more speaks volumes. They're looking for a complimentary back that provides a little more speed, better blocking, and receiving ability when Singletary needs a breather and on occasional 3rd downs. You don't use a 1st for that. Especially not with the holes we have to fill. I don't even know if we could afford to even spend our 2nd there.

Edited March 20, 2022 by BillsFanForever19

[mrags]

57 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Bittersweet that I’ve had that kind of impact.  I haven’t missed you.  Stubborn can’t handle stubborn.  Ironic.  ✌️ 

 

Yes, this team is missing a dynamic running back.  I agree with you.  I’d love to have Kenneth Walker or Breece Hall.  But not at the expense of a 1st rd pick.  Sure, if we had a dynamic running back, our team would be better. It would also be better if we had a dynamic player at any position.  We’re missing dynamic players @ LG, C, RG, RT, WR2, WR3, RB.  Tight end is debatable but I like our TEs.  Adding a dynamic player at any of those positions makes us better.
 

if we draft a RB @ 25, I won’t be mad.  RBs are traditionally my favorite position/player.  My favorite players are growing up we’re Cribbs, Bell, thurman then Henry, Marshawn, Fred in adulthood.  I just don’t think taking one in rd 1 this year is a smart move.  I’d rather take a corner to pair with Tre, a WR to pair with Diggs or an OL to make offense easier and keep our QB healthy.  
 

 

Don’t flatter yourself. Your opinion is meaningless. 

[whorlnut]

2 hours ago, NewEra said:

I don’t think we should draft a CB unless that corner is the #1 player on our board.  If a WR, OL, DL is the #1, we should take that player.  I wouldn’t want to take a safety.   A LB, TE or a RB @ 25, I prefer not, but if they love the player, so be it.  
 

If we don’t add a vet corner in FA, I really hope we take one in rd 1-3.  

This is what I’ve been saying. You don’t take a corner in round one just to take one. It would depend on fit. 

[OldTimer1960]

4 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

This is what I’ve been saying. You don’t take a corner in round one just to take one. It would depend on fit. 

I agree it has to be a fit.  I probably should have said that “they will be in trouble if they miss out on the first round corners” instead of “they have to take a corner in round 1”.