Edit! McKenzie is back on a 2 year deal worth 4.4 million

[RocCityRoller]

On 5/5/2022 at 9:54 PM, Mister Defense said:

 

A little, but I am still concerned.

 

And maybe even a little more soon after this post, as I found out that Beasley had broken ribs last year.

 

The first time I began to consistently realize Allen was going to be a super star was when he started finding Beasley, effortlessly, in stride, in the slot. It was when Allen started to look like the other HOF quarterbacks I have seen play in the Ralph: Bradshaw,  Warner, Montana...

 

Pretty shocked that Beasley has not signed somewhere else by now.  May be because of the vaccination controversy.  But I am glad that, so far, he is not a weapon for one of the other young guns, like Herbert, Burrow, Watson, and even Tua.

 

I understand that. I am a Beasley fan. Beasley was a bit of a security blanket for JA for a year or two. When all else failed on the offense they would work Bease in or run a gadget play with Lil Dirty to get a spark. I think Crowder is a fine addition, but we need to see that chemistry form in the offseason. Having McKenzie and now Shakir as other options makes me feel good that there are solid options.

 

Surprised he is not with Green Bay. It seems a logical fit on a lot of levels.

[NewEra]

39 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

 

I understand that. I am a Beasley fan. Beasley was a bit of a security blanket for JA for a year or two. When all else failed on the offense they would work Bease in or run a gadget play with Lil Dirty to get a spark. I think Crowder is a fine addition, but we need to see that chemistry form in the offseason. Having McKenzie and now Shakir as other options makes me feel good that there are solid options.

 

Surprised he is not with Green Bay. It seems a logical fit on a lot of levels.

Slot is probably our deepest position on the team atm with Crowder, Mckenzie, Shakir (and Hodgins).  Replacing either Diggs or Davis for a span will be much more difficult.  I think Shakir would probably take the role.  I don’t think he’s ideal on the outside, but is smart and savvy enough to make it work. 

[RocCityRoller]

34 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Slot is probably our deepest position on the team atm with Crowder, Mckenzie, Shakir (and Hodgins).  Replacing either Diggs or Davis for a span will be much more difficult.  I think Shakir would probably take the role.  I don’t think he’s ideal on the outside, but is smart and savvy enough to make it work. 

 

Agree on most counts. Shakir has the size to play outside 6'0" 190 ish?

 

As for Hodgins I don't count on him for anything. He is the new Da'Rick Rodgers/ Duke Williams of the board 🤣

 

Crowder is an obvious fit at slot, and McKenzie has produced when put in the position. I think the concern is the ability for Crowder and Allen, or McKenzie and Allen to get in that rhythm Bease and Allen could get into and take over a game. Replacing Cole's big 3rd down awareness is another concern, he had a knack of coming up big on 3rd downs his first two seasons. Last year Bease made a lot of 3rd down catches, but a much lower percentage went for 1st downs than before. I think that was due to a mix of injury and age.

 

I always liked Crowder as a pro. Steady Eddy type on some bad teams. His profile is similar to Beasley before Buffalo.

Beasley had a better catch % and better 1st down conversion % before Buffalo. So those are legit concerns.

 

Before Buffalo

Crowder 409 C/ 611 T (66.9% Catch rate) - 4607 - 11.9 per - 28 TD / 218 1D (53% 1st Dwn Conv)

Beasley 319 C/ 450 T (70.8% Catch rate) - 3271 - 10.4 per - 23 TD/ 199 1D (62% 1st Dwn Conv)

 

Crowder has more bulk production, but Beasley was more efficient. Bease had a higher catch%/ TD per Catch % and 1 down conversion % before joining Buffalo. Some of that could be QB play.

 

Crowder - 5'9" 177 - will be 29 at season start

Beasley - 5'8" 174 - was 30 at 1st season start in Buffalo

McKenzie - 5'8" 173 - will be 27 at season start

[NewEra]

14 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

 

Agree on most counts. Shakir has the size to play outside 6'0" 190 ish?

 

As for Hodgins I don't count on him for anything. He is the new Da'Rick Rodgers/ Duke Williams of the board 🤣

 

Crowder is an obvious fit at slot, and McKenzie has produced when put in the position. I think the concern is the ability for Crowder and Allen, or McKenzie and Allen to get in that rhythm Bease and Allen could get into and take over a game. Replacing Cole's big 3rd down awareness is another concern, he had a knack of coming up big on 3rd downs his first two seasons. Last year Bease made a lot of 3rd down catches, but a much lower percentage went for 1st downs than before. I think that was due to a mix of injury and age.

 

I always liked Crowder as a pro. Steady Eddy type on some bad teams. His profile is similar to Beasley before Buffalo.

Beasley had a better catch % and better 1st down conversion % before Buffalo. So those are legit concerns.

 

Before Buffalo

Crowder 409 C/ 611 T (66.9% Catch rate) - 4607 - 11.9 per - 28 TD / 218 1D (53% 1st Dwn Conv)

Beasley 319 C/ 450 T (70.8% Catch rate) - 3271 - 10.4 per - 23 TD/ 199 1D (62% 1st Dwn Conv)

 

Crowder has more bulk production, but Beasley was more efficient. Bease had a higher catch%/ TD per Catch % and 1 down conversion % before joining Buffalo. Some of that could be QB play.

 

Crowder - 5'9" 177 - will be 29 at season start

Beasley - 5'8" 174 - was 30 at 1st season start in Buffalo

McKenzie - 5'8" 173 - will be 27 at season start

Yeah, I think Shakir can play outside.  He played around 70% of his snaps from the slot but has shown to have a decent release on the outside despite his short arms.  That said, I think he’s most likely our starting slot wr for 23,24 and 25.  He’s a versatile player and can also take hand offs and returns.  
 

Great point regarding josh and Jamison getting on the right page.  If they don’t, Isaiah and Shakir will be waiting for the opportunity.  The competition will be fierce.  
 

i also, don’t count on anything from Hodgins…..but he brings something different to the table and I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt.  Dude has been in the meetings and working out with Diggs and Davis.  If there’s anything that can get a man motivated, watching a 5th rd pick and a 4th round pick blossom right in front of a man can be that motivation.  I doubt he makes the team, but you can’t measure a man’s heart and determination.  Ask Josh Rosen.  😉 

i would attribute some of Beasley and Crowders pre Buffalo stats to qb play and situation.  Crowder had 2 rookie bums without any viable outside wr help.  Beasley had Romo and Dak.  

 

[RocCityRoller]

30 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Yeah, I think Shakir can play outside.  He played around 70% of his snaps from the slot but has shown to have a decent release on the outside despite his short arms.  That said, I think he’s most likely our starting slot wr for 23,24 and 25.  He’s a versatile player and can also take hand offs and returns.  
 

Great point regarding josh and Jamison getting on the right page.  If they don’t, Isaiah and Shakir will be waiting for the opportunity.  The competition will be fierce.  
 

i also, don’t count on anything from Hodgins…..but he brings something different to the table and I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt.  Dude has been in the meetings and working out with Diggs and Davis.  If there’s anything that can get a man motivated, watching a 5th rd pick and a 4th round pick blossom right in front of a man can be that motivation.  I doubt he makes the team, but you can’t measure a man’s heart and determination.  Ask Josh Rosen.  😉 

i would attribute some of Beasley and Crowders pre Buffalo stats to qb play and situation.  Crowder had 2 rookie bums without any viable outside wr help.  Beasley had Romo and Dak.  

 

 

Nice to have an agreeable discussion! Slot is very deep. I could see some 4 WR sets, or empty backfields being used to take advantage of that.

 

I keep forgetting Crowder is only on a 1 yr contract. If the plan is Crowder to Shakir, that is good planning for the slot, which is a critical piece to the offense.

Size/ depth outside is a bit of a concern, but it's hard to fix everything. I was surprised to find out Shakir only played outside 30% of the time. Your stat matches what I have seen elsewhere. He does remind me a bit of Robert Woods. Hoping we can red shirt Shakir a bit this year and give him a camp or two with Allen.

 

As for outside depth I understand why some on the board would like Sanders back or take a shot on Julio. Not sure either of those guys wants to be a depth player or sign for a year.

 

Sanders was good early on but really fell off a cliff in the second half of the season. He registered 0 catches in 3 of the last 4 regular season games. His last regular season TD came on October 10th! Not sure many here realize that. 3 catches on 4 targets 52 yard and a TD in the playoffs, was not that productive, though his TD was a veteran beauty. I just don't think Sanders has much left in the tank. I do think if Jones or Sanders remain unsigned they are a 'break glass in event of emergency' type sign, and could be a reason Buffalo keeps the cap space they have.

 

Hodgins has to show up or be shown the door. 6'4" 210 could be a big help outside if needed. He is a Bill and I hope he shows out this preseason, but I don't count on much from him. I think Stevenson has a better chance.

 

[NewEra]

5 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

 

Nice to have an agreeable discussion! Slot is very deep. I could see some 4 WR sets, or empty backfields being used to take advantage of that.

 

I keep forgetting Crowder is only on a 1 yr contract. If the plan is Crowder to Shakir, that is good planning for the slot, which is a critical piece to the offense.

Size/ depth outside is a bit of a concern, but it's hard to fix everything. I was surprised to find out Shakir only played outside 30% of the time. Your stat matches what I have seen elsewhere. He does remind me a bit of Robert Woods. Hoping we can red shirt Shakir a bit this year and give him a camp or two with Allen.

 

As for outside depth I understand why some on the board would like Sanders back or take a shot on Julio. Not sure either of those guys wants to be a depth player or sign for a year.

 

Sanders was good early on but really fell off a cliff in the second half of the season. He registered 0 catches in 3 of the last 4 regular season games. His last regular season TD came on October 10th! Not sure many here realize that. 3 catches on 4 targets 52 yard and a TD in the playoffs, was not that productive, though his TD was a veteran beauty. I just don't think Sanders has much left in the tank. I do think if Jones or Sanders remain unsigned they are a 'break glass in event of emergency' type sign, and could be a reason Buffalo keeps the cap space they have.

 

Hodgins has to show up or be shown the door. 6'4" 210 could be a big help outside if needed. He is a Bill and I hope he shows out this preseason, but I don't count on much from him. I think Stevenson has a better chance.

 

👍🏻 an agreeable convo on tbd?  Say it ain’t so!?!

 

The woods comp stands out to me, more so for the way they run.  They have a very similar running style imo.  I definitely see woods running when I watch Shakir run, but Shakir is a bit better at making the defenders miss has a little more juice.  

[Mat68]

37 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

 

Nice to have an agreeable discussion! Slot is very deep. I could see some 4 WR sets, or empty backfields being used to take advantage of that.

 

I keep forgetting Crowder is only on a 1 yr contract. If the plan is Crowder to Shakir, that is good planning for the slot, which is a critical piece to the offense.

Size/ depth outside is a bit of a concern, but it's hard to fix everything. I was surprised to find out Shakir only played outside 30% of the time. Your stat matches what I have seen elsewhere. He does remind me a bit of Robert Woods. Hoping we can red shirt Shakir a bit this year and give him a camp or two with Allen.

 

As for outside depth I understand why some on the board would like Sanders back or take a shot on Julio. Not sure either of those guys wants to be a depth player or sign for a year.

 

Sanders was good early on but really fell off a cliff in the second half of the season. He registered 0 catches in 3 of the last 4 regular season games. His last regular season TD came on October 10th! Not sure many here realize that. 3 catches on 4 targets 52 yard and a TD in the playoffs, was not that productive, though his TD was a veteran beauty. I just don't think Sanders has much left in the tank. I do think if Jones or Sanders remain unsigned they are a 'break glass in event of emergency' type sign, and could be a reason Buffalo keeps the cap space they have.

 

Hodgins has to show up or be shown the door. 6'4" 210 could be a big help outside if needed. He is a Bill and I hope he shows out this preseason, but I don't count on much from him. I think Stevenson has a better chance.

 

I dont think Hodgins can play outside.  Imo he is more a slot only than Shakir.  I dont think he makes it.  I think they go Diggs, Davis, Crowder, Shakir, Mckenzie, Kumerow and Stevenson.  The amount of 3 and 4 wide sets I think they keep 7.  Stevenson will have to have a good camp and get the return gig.   

[RocCityRoller]

3 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

I dont think Hodgins can play outside.  Imo he is more a slot only than Shakir.  I dont think he makes it.  I think they go Diggs, Davis, Crowder, Shakir, Mckenzie, Kumerow and Stevenson.  The amount of 3 and 4 wide sets I think they keep 7.  Stevenson will have to have a good camp and get the return gig.   

 

Hey Matt, why can't Hodgins play outside? Was he a 6'4" slot? (I don't know about his college play TBH)

 

Also think Stevenson has a better shot. As for KR does Cook intrigue you?

I looked up Cook and he did some Kick Off Return duty early on at Georgia. Would love to find ways to get Cook on the field.

[Mat68]

On 5/7/2022 at 2:36 PM, RocCityRoller said:

 

Hey Matt, why can't Hodgins play outside? Was he a 6'4" slot? (I don't know about his college play TBH)

 

Also think Stevenson has a better shot. As for KR does Cook intrigue you?

I looked up Cook and he did some Kick Off Return duty early on at Georgia. Would love to find ways to get Cook on the field.

Imo, too slow to beat press coverage.  Struggled outside at Oregon St.  Tall and on the thin size.  I think his skills work in the slot.  Do they want to use that type?  They haven't recently.  A few years on the team not being able to earn a spot, Im not putting much faith he supplants one of the aforementioned.  
 

I would not use Cook on teams.  I think he will have a larger role on offense.  Now if his role isnt what Im imagining it to be I could see using him as a return man to get him on the field.  To me it is Stevenson, Mckenzie and Shakir.  One of them takes it.  I think if it Shakir Stevenson and Mckenzie will be on the bubble.

Edited May 9, 2022 by Mat68