Taiwan Jones on About The Game Pod (Squib related)

[LABILLBACKER]

3 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

How does McD not walk over to Bass, grab him by the facemask, and tell him exactly what he wants? There was sooooo much time to get the call right.

That's exactly what I've been screaming for a month. McDermott is the frickin HC. Stop being a little p ussy and gather your ST. Tell Farwell to go away. Then scream at the top of your lungs exactly what you want done. Stare down Bass if you have to.  He butchered that kick so bad, he had no clue what defense to use.

[BrooklynBills]

3 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I'm still wondering why a Kicker doesn't wonder if they might want him to squib it in that scenario.  It's not like the Kicker has to have a lot of plays in his head....

He's only in his 2nd year in the NFL. Maybe a veteran K would know or have more confidence to speak up about it. For all we know, Bass could've been thinking it but was unsure if he should speak up and just thought "hey - games over probably" 

[Shaw66]

3 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

 

That was the single most important play of McDermott's career and the Bills' season.  

 

 

 

This is completely wrong.   It was a friggin kickoff that the kickoff team had practiced probably 100 times.   It was a completely ordinary play.   McDermott had no reason whatsoever to believe that on this simple, ordinary play, someone wasn't going tell the kicker what the play was.  McDermott's not running down the sideline to talk to the punter on every fourth quarter punt.  He's not going to Josh with a fourth quarter lead and telling him not to fumble.  

 

EVERY play is potentially the most important play of the game and his career.  EVERY play.  How is he supposed to know which one someone is not going to do his job?   He can't be chasing players the entire game reminding them what they're supposed to be doing. 

 

And beyond that, even in retrospect, it wasn't the most important play.  The next two plays were the most important.  Which one of the 11 defenders was he supposed to seek out and talk to?   Each one?  Jerry, you do this, Addison, you do that, Tremaine, don't forget about Kelce, Levi, nobody deep, etc.    How many guys is he supposed to talk to?

 

It simply is not his job.   His job is to make decisions and relay them to the coordinators.  He was doing his job.   Other people weren't doing their jobs.  

Edited February 16, 2022 by Shaw66

[MJS]

3 hours ago, letsgoteam said:

I've been surprised that he didnt have the kickoff team huddle up on the sideline to confirm everyone is on the same page about the squib, and a quick reminder to watch for tricks (homerun throwbacks,etc). He doesnt need to be in every huddle, but huge moments like that are an exception. Even if its the ST coach telling all the info, I'm atleast standing their making sure everything is covered

They did huddle, but Bass was not in the huddle because he was practicing kicks away from the rest of the special teamers. The Special Teams coordinator needs to ensure that Bass knows what to do. Maybe he said to relay the message to him and that didn't get done. Who knows? But that responsibility is on the coordinator.

32 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

That's exactly what I've been screaming for a month. McDermott is the frickin HC. Stop being a little p ussy and gather your ST. Tell Farwell to go away. Then scream at the top of your lungs exactly what you want done. Stare down Bass if you have to.  He butchered that kick so bad, he had no clue what defense to use.

It's not a movie. Everyone on the sideline has a job to do, including the head coach. His job is not to go do another person's job. That creates chaos and confusion.

[Saint Doug]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I'm still wondering why a Kicker doesn't wonder if they might want him to squib it in that scenario.  It's not like the Kicker has to have a lot of plays in his head....

I have to agree here. I don’t care how many plays were in his head or not, but didn’t it occur to him that a squib might be in order? He probably knows the most about kicking techniques then any other individual on the team. Why didn’t he speak up and say, what about a squib? Or maybe he did and he wasn’t listened to (hence the “communication issue”). 

46 minutes ago, BrooklynBills said:

He's only in his 2nd year in the NFL. Maybe a veteran K would know or have more confidence to speak up about it. For all we know, Bass could've been thinking it but was unsure if he should speak up and just thought "hey - games over probably" 

He’s a grown man. If players (at any level of experience) can’t talk things through with their coaches, the team has much bigger problems. 

[JGMcD2]

4 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

 

I agree with Dr. D.  That was the single most important play of McDermott's career and the Bills' season.  Goddamn right he should have taken it upon himself - as the LEADER of the team - to ensure everyone was on the same page.

 

Yes - leaders need to rely on their directs to do their jobs.  But there is a thing called, "trust, but verify," which many leaders employ when something is incredibly important.  And McDermott should have employed it.

 

This is a failure on multiple parts. But the biggest fault lies at the feet of Sean McDermott.

 

Dude… how do you know he didn’t verify? 
 

You’re speculating. 

[Gugny]

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

This is completely wrong. 

 

How very badol of you to say.  I stopped reading your novella after this sentence.  Plus, I disagree.

[GunnerBill]

I do think the kick was the biggest play. But that is because people are obsessed on the time. When really they should have been obsessed by the number of plays because Kansas City had their timeouts.

 

13 seconds meant 3 plays. 1 of them has to be a FG try. So it is 2 plays to get the yardage. 

 

In a world where the Bills squib and Kansas City are down to 9 seconds that is probably 2 plays. 1 to get the yardage. 

 

That is why the squib mattered. It reduced their shots by 1. 

 

And I normally disagree with @Gugny on McDermott. He has a tendnency to blame coaching for player failures. But on the squib he is right. If I am the Head Coach I am making absolutely certain everyone knows the plan there. It clear Bass didn't. The reaction of the gunners when they realise that ball is going for a touchback tells you all you need to know. 

[Gugny]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

I do think the kick was the biggest play. But that is because people are obsessed on the time. When really they should have been obsessed by the number of plays because Kansas City had their timeouts.

 

13 seconds meant 3 plays. 1 of them has to be a FG try. So it is 2 plays to get the yardage. 

 

In a world where the Bills squib and Kansas City are down to 9 seconds that is probably 2 plays. 1 to get the yardage. 

 

That is why the squib mattered. It reduced their shots by 1. 

 

And I normally disagree with @Gugny on McDermott. He has a tendnency to blame coaching for player failures. But on the squib he is right. If I am the Head Coach I am making absolutely certain everyone knows the plan there. It clear Bass didn't. The reaction of the gunners when they realise that ball is going for a touchback tells you all you need to know. 

 

I've eased up on that and much is thanks to you.  I was primarily complimentary of McD AND Daboll last season.  I do, however, admit that I put a lot of onus on the coaching staff.

[wppete]

Love what he said about Josh. Everyone loves him and follows him.

[Shaw66]

10 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I do think the kick was the biggest play. But that is because people are obsessed on the time. When really they should have been obsessed by the number of plays because Kansas City had their timeouts.

 

13 seconds meant 3 plays. 1 of them has to be a FG try. So it is 2 plays to get the yardage. 

 

In a world where the Bills squib and Kansas City are down to 9 seconds that is probably 2 plays. 1 to get the yardage. 

 

That is why the squib mattered. It reduced their shots by 1. 

 

And I normally disagree with @Gugny on McDermott. He has a tendnency to blame coaching for player failures. But on the squib he is right. If I am the Head Coach I am making absolutely certain everyone knows the plan there. It clear Bass didn't. The reaction of the gunners when they realise that ball is going for a touchback tells you all you need to know. 

But they wouldn't have been down to 9.   KC would not have returned the squib quick.  The kick returner catches the ball and takes a knee, or recovers it on the ground.   No time goes off the clock, or if he catches it and drops, a second goes off.   No matter where he is, he gives himself up immediately.  

15 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

How very badol of you to say.  I stopped reading your novella after this sentence.  Plus, I disagree.

I know it was blunt, but what you said was in fact completely wrong.  We only know which plays were the most important in the game AFTER the game.   Before the kickoff, no one was thinking the kickoff was the most important play.   The most important play was the play before, the touchdown pass.  Did McDermott go to Davis before that play and be sure he knew his assignment?  Of course not.  How is McDermott supposed which play is the most important, and how he is supposed to know which player he should talk to before each play he thinks is the most important.   It's absurd to expect the head coach to be doing that. 

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

But they wouldn't have been down to 9.   KC would not have returned the squib quick.  The kick returner catches the ball and takes a knee, or recovers it on the ground.   No time goes off the clock, or if he catches it and drops, a second goes off.   No matter where he is, he gives himself up immediately.  

 

In that case they have 3 plays but they have an extra 10 to 15 yards to make up. 

[Shaw66]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

In that case they have 3 plays but they have an extra 10 to 15 yards to make up. 

Yes, but the ball is bouncing along the ground, and there are a lot of different possible outcomes.   It also could have been recovered at the 30 or 35, depending on where people are lined up, where the kick goes, lots of things.   IT's also possible, of course, that KC screws up somehow and the Bills recover. 

 

But generally, the likely possible outcomes of the squib kick are the ball on the 20 to 30, or 15 to 35, with 12 or 13 seconds left.  With the ball going into the end zone, it was on the 25 with 13 seconds.   It's pretty hard for me to see how that difference was the most important play in the game.   If the Chiefs start on the 20 instead of the 25, Buttker's kicking a 54-yard field goal instead of 49, still within his range.  

 

The kickoff didn't decide the game, and people saying McDermott needed to talk to Bass particularly on that play are wrong. 

 

 

[Turf Toejam 34]

My thoughts on the kick is that Bass was asked to pooch it numerous times during the Tennessee game and executed it flawlessly.   I was there, they were trying to take advantage of a perceived weakness in the TN return game.  If Bass is a professional, he should be able to execute that play to an acceptable level every single time that it is asked of him.   End of story.    If executed correctly, it would have put KC in a pressure situation trying to return it "enough" and not burn substantial clock. It was interesting that they did not put Tyreek out on that return, signaling that they were not explicitly trying to get any sort of substantial return.   

[Mr. WEO]

3 hours ago, BrooklynBills said:

He's only in his 2nd year in the NFL. Maybe a veteran K would know or have more confidence to speak up about it. For all we know, Bass could've been thinking it but was unsure if he should speak up and just thought "hey - games over probably" 

 

He's a professional football player.  His only thoughts at that moment need to be "squibbing or kicking?".    He should have been certain which.  Are 2nd year players not allowed to speak up in the huddle either?  wtf.

 

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

How is McDermott supposed which play is the most important, and how he is supposed to know which player he should talk to before each play he thinks is the most important.   It's absurd to expect the head coach to be doing that. 

 

 

Really not sure about that one?  He calls for squib kick.....and he's not sure which player he should talk to before the squib kick?  

 

McD:  "Let's see....who would be the one most important guy who I should absolutely talk to about this?  Eh, how am I supped stop know?!  There's just too damn many of them!"

 

That's completely absurd.

[Buffalo ill]

So many sour grapes in this forum.  FIRE EVERYONE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!

[Tanoros]

8 hours ago, JayBaller10 said:

Biggest problem was the defensive plan got caught flat-footed. Seems like they were working under the assumption the squib would take time off the clock, so the prevent D would’ve worked in that scenario. It’s like they didn’t have a backup plan for if no time came off the clock and doubled down by calling the same defensive alignment after both timeouts.

This is what confuses me the most. It seems more likely a squib was called, but didn’t happen (communication related to Heath), but then how do Frazier and McDermott not adjust the defense? There was two timeouts, 1 before each play, I mean what were they talking about? 
 

My hope is that this loss if even more fuel for Josh Allen and all the hurdles he’s overcome in his football career. 

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I do think the kick was the biggest play. But that is because people are obsessed on the time. When really they should have been obsessed by the number of plays because Kansas City had their timeouts.

 

13 seconds meant 3 plays. 1 of them has to be a FG try. So it is 2 plays to get the yardage. 

 

In a world where the Bills squib and Kansas City are down to 9 seconds that is probably 2 plays. 1 to get the yardage. 

 

That is why the squib mattered. It reduced their shots by 1. 

 

And I normally disagree with @Gugny on McDermott. He has a tendnency to blame coaching for player failures. But on the squib he is right. If I am the Head Coach I am making absolutely certain everyone knows the plan there. It clear Bass didn't. The reaction of the gunners when they realise that ball is going for a touchback tells you all you need to know. 

 

 

Honestly I can't get pulled either way on the kick choice.

 

I've lived thru a Bills team kicking the ball short and losing a playoff game on a kickoff return when they had a #1 ranked defense......a much more talented one than this 2021 version......... watching helplessly on the sideline.

 

That team was also probably the best team left in the playoffs that year.    Their defense was better than that of Tampa and the Bucs nearly took out TGSOT in St. Louis in the NFCCG with a scrub QB named Shawn King at the helm so Flutie or Johnson could have easily hoisted the Lombardi that year in the midst of an era where Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson would win SB's.

 

And as much as I feel the Bills were the best team left in the playoffs going into the divisional round this year............I think the Chiefs were clearly the NEXT best..........and I think the emotional drain from that Bills game put them in the dirt  the next week.    People neglect to mention that KC put up 40 the week before vs. Pitt.   It was the first ever playoff meeting of two teams who both scored 40+ the week prior.     And it's not like the Bills were in THEIR heads as much as KC was the Bills heads.   

 

Same let-down could have happened to Buffalo.

 

Beating KC in the playoffs had been job #1 for 12 months.   Presuming no let down is foolish.

 

The ultimate lesson from both seasons is simple...........get the #1 seed and home field advantage.

 

Both of those Bills teams had multiple inexplicable regular season losses Flutie at home to lousy NYG and Raiders teams..........the 2021 Bills to Jacksonville and Pittsburgh.

 

That combined with the chips falling in a certain way elsewhere,  lead to a long road to the SB for both teams.

 

 

Edited February 17, 2022 by BADOLBILZ

[Warcodered]

9 hours ago, essential said:

Good interview, some real good stuff about Josh and the Chiefs game.  They ask him directly why we didn't squib it (18:10) and he say's he doesn't want to get into it but it was because of "communication issues" which I think confirms it was a called Squib and Bass didn't know.

 

 

So according Taiwan Jones

 

Josh Allen before KC game: "Today I choose violence, who's behind me."

😱

[newcam2012]

9 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

 

I agree with Dr. D.  That was the single most important play of McDermott's career and the Bills' season.  Goddamn right he should have taken it upon himself - as the LEADER of the team - to ensure everyone was on the same page.

 

Yes - leaders need to rely on their directs to do their jobs.  But there is a thing called, "trust, but verify," which many leaders employ when something is incredibly important.  And McDermott should have employed it.

 

This is a failure on multiple parts. But the biggest fault lies at the feet of Sean McDermott.

 

Agree 100%. Well said.