Reportedly Brian Flores admitted to Tua that they were pursuing Watson after the pre season finale

[HomeTeam]

Maybe the NFL is trying to do everything in their power to discredit Brian Flores. 

 

They are a powerful player with a large influence. They will do everything in their power to make this go away. 

[FireChans]

Flores should write a book.

 

”How to lose friends and alienate people.” I wouldn’t hire this dude ever, even without the lawsuit.

[Richard Noggin]

It's also possible that Flores knows honesty (even when it's unwelcome) is the only way to cultivate trust within an organization, and that made him a bad fit for a Dolphins org with a meddling owner and dysfunctional flow chart (GM and HC BOTH reported directly to Ross...which I want to say is begging for discord*). He apparently preferred a different QB prospect in the draft (which we all know is the most impactful decision ANY NFL org makes), was overruled by management/ownership, and seemingly did not fall in line with messaging/player management. I suspect the clown-show Fitz/Tua flip-flopping in 2020 involved some "intervention" from above. No coach can thrive under such mismanagement. 

 

Or, I'm totally wrong and Flores is solely responsible for his own undoing (which seems somewhat unlikely, given all we know). 

 

Or, Ross is a meddling, incompetent tool AND Flores dealt with that dysfunction in turn with his own dysfunctional reactions. That seems plausible, don't it?

 

*do the Bills technically have both McD and Beane reporting directly to the Pegulas? That would be ironically hilarious, as the Bills seem concretely functional.

[DrPJax]

8 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I won't be surprised if Brian Flores sues Brian Flores before this is all over with. 

The guy is intense and I can see how he could be a good coordinator. However, he committed career suicide regarding the NFL ( you’re not in good company when Hugh Jackson is trying to jump in a class action suit with you. That guy is the best example of a clueless idiot I can think of ) and getting another HC shot. The level of naïveté to think you could benefit going to court just based on your opinion against bottomless tanks of money available to those named franchises is a sign of terrible judgement and shows he has no idea how the real world functions and always will continue doing so as far as the monolithic NFL.  He sees everything in absolutes , right or wrongs , and real life doesn’t work like that; certainly the judicial system doesn’t because money is power in that realm. Going to be a rough , expensive life lesson and it’s a little insight how he is not equipped to handle all the nuances of being the lead man of a large company like an NFL club. He could not see the big picture regarding his suit , and that was his downfall an HC as well. 

[JoPoy88]

11 hours ago, MJS said:

Yes!

Dude, it was being reported EVERYWHERE. If no one was on to their efforts to land Watson then yes, I’d agree with you. 

[3rdand12]

19 hours ago, Richard Noggin said:

It's also possible that Flores knows honesty (even when it's unwelcome) is the only way to cultivate trust within an organization, and that made him a bad fit for a Dolphins org with a meddling owner and dysfunctional flow chart (GM and HC BOTH reported directly to Ross...which I want to say is begging for discord*). He apparently preferred a different QB prospect in the draft (which we all know is the most impactful decision ANY NFL org makes), was overruled by management/ownership, and seemingly did not fall in line with messaging/player management. I suspect the clown-show Fitz/Tua flip-flopping in 2020 involved some "intervention" from above. No coach can thrive under such mismanagement. 

 

Or, I'm totally wrong and Flores is solely responsible for his own undoing (which seems somewhat unlikely, given all we know). 

 

Or, Ross is a meddling, incompetent tool AND Flores dealt with that dysfunction in turn with his own dysfunctional reactions. That seems plausible, don't it?

 

*do the Bills technically have both McD and Beane reporting directly to the Pegulas? That would be ironically hilarious, as the Bills seem concretely functional.

it was the General manager in the parlor with poking stick

Not Ross

Ross is an absentee owner of sorts

 agree there was meddling a plenties. just not from Ross directly so much

[Hapless Bills Fan]

21 hours ago, HomeTeam said:

Maybe the NFL is trying to do everything in their power to discredit Brian Flores. 

 

They are a powerful player with a large influence. They will do everything in their power to make this go away. 

 

Seems to me Brian Flores is trying to discredit Brian Flores, with assistance from Wigdor (his law firm)

 

He didn't have to have his law firm state that the Broncos staff was drunk when they interviewed him - potentially defamatory and hard to prove at this distance.  He could have kept to things he personally could observe and attest to

 

He didn't have to have his law firm issue a statement that took a dump on Lovie Smith while implying that he's such an outstanding HC candidate that no organization could prefer another candidate for legitimate Football reasons

 

etc

[HomeTeam]

11 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Seems to me Brian Flores is trying to discredit Brian Flores, with assistance from Wigdor (his law firm)

 

He didn't have to have his law firm state that the Broncos staff was drunk when they interviewed him - potentially defamatory and hard to prove at this distance.  He could have kept to things he personally could observe and attest to

 

He didn't have to have his law firm issue a statement that took a dump on Lovie Smith while implying that he's such an outstanding HC candidate that no organization could prefer another candidate for legitimate Football reasons

 

etc

I'm not sure about the details of the case in all honesty. All those seem rather damming.

 

I have a bone to pick with the NFL. I won't let fact and reason convince me otherwise.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 minutes ago, HomeTeam said:

I'm not sure about the details of the case in all honesty. All those seem rather damming.

 

I have a bone to pick with the NFL. I won't let fact and reason convince me otherwise.

 

More than one thing can be true

 

Brian Flores can be discrediting Brian Flores

 

AND

 

NFL teams can be acting in poor faith with regard to minority hiring

 

AND

 

The Shield can do everything it can to protect itself and discredit those who it seems as threatening

 

[HomeTeam]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

More than one thing can be true

 

Brian Flores can be discrediting Brian Flores

 

AND

 

NFL teams can be acting in poor faith with regard to minority hiring

 

AND

 

The Shield can do everything it can to protect itself and discredit those who it seems as threatening

 

I concur : )

[Malazan]

I'm confused.. do people think the better alternative was to lie to Tua and not tell him? 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, Malazan said:

I'm confused.. do people think the better alternative was to lie to Tua and not tell him? 

 

I think the point might be that reportedly Flores lied to Tua as well as the press, during the season - and is now admitting the previous lie along with the truth

But, I'm not sure

[eball]

While a lot of Flores ball-washing was going on around here regarding what an “awesome” job he was doing in Miami, I think I pretty much nailed it with my assessment at the time of how he was butchering the QB situation in 2020.  It was insane the way he benched Fitz, then played Tua, then brought in Fitz as his “relief pitcher,” then went back to Tua.  It was negligence bordering on incompetence in the midst of what could have been a playoff season.

 

Now, it looks like there was a whole heluva lot that was going on behind the scenes in Miami, but at some point Flores has to take responsibility for his own actions as well.

 

That said, Ross is clearly just another uber-rich prick in the old boys club that is NFL ownership who believes nothing and nobody can touch him.

 

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, eball said:

While a lot of Flores ball-washing was going on around here regarding what an “awesome” job he was doing in Miami, I think I pretty much nailed it with my assessment at the time of how he was butchering the QB situation in 2020.  It was insane the way he benched Fitz, then played Tua, then brought in Fitz as his “relief pitcher,” then went back to Tua.  It was negligence bordering on incompetence in the midst of what could have been a playoff season.

 

Now, it looks like there was a whole heluva lot that was going on behind the scenes in Miami, but at some point Flores has to take responsibility for his own actions as well.

 

That said, Ross is clearly just another uber-rich prick in the old boys club that is NFL ownership who believes nothing and nobody can touch him.

 

He definitely did make some strange decisions around the handling of the Quarterback situation, but I think the thing with Flores is that he won more games in Miami than he was entitled to for the talent available to him. That is why he was praised. He won 10 and 9 games with a roster that is more a .500 roster (I get in 2021 there is no such thing as a .500 football team with the 17th game). If anyone deserved to lose his job in Miami it was Chris Grier. He was the GM who built the Gase roster, he was the GM who ripped it apart for picks, then he was the GM who largely wasted those picks. Now he gets another go around with a 3rd Head Coach. What has he done to deserve that?

[eball]

21 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He definitely did make some strange decisions around the handling of the Quarterback situation, but I think the thing with Flores is that he won more games in Miami than he was entitled to for the talent available to him. That is why he was praised. He won 10 and 9 games with a roster that is more a .500 roster (I get in 2021 there is no such thing as a .500 football team with the 17th game). If anyone deserved to lose his job in Miami it was Chris Grier. He was the GM who built the Gase roster, he was the GM who ripped it apart for picks, then he was the GM who largely wasted those picks. Now he gets another go around with a 3rd Head Coach. What has he done to deserve that?

 

There can be plenty of blame to go around and still come to the conclusion Flores isn’t “all that.”  They beat one team with a winning record in 2020, and the disaster of their final win-and-you’re-in game vs. the Bills was telling.  Then in 2021 their season was in the tank immediately…I’m not putting any stock in their “run to mediocrity” beating terrible teams.  Again, they faced a huge test late against Tennessee and completely crapped themselves.

 

Add the fact that Flores has been absolutely owned and embarrassed by a division rival (0-6 vs. Buffalo with a -110 point differential) and I’m still not buying it.

 

[GunnerBill]

9 minutes ago, eball said:

 

There can be plenty of blame to go around and still come to the conclusion Flores isn’t “all that.”  They beat one team with a winning record in 2020, and the disaster of their final win-and-you’re-in game vs. the Bills was telling.  Then in 2021 their season was in the tank immediately…I’m not putting any stock in their “run to mediocrity” beating terrible teams.  Again, they faced a huge test late against Tennessee and completely crapped themselves.

 

Add the fact that Flores has been absolutely owned and embarrassed by a division rival (0-6 vs. Buffalo with a -110 point differential) and I’m still not buying it.

 

 

Beating good teams regularly requires good players. He didn't have many of those. He won 5 games with a roster the first year that could very conceivably have gone winless (appears Stephen Ross rather hoped they would go winless) then he won 10 games with a team that most thought was a 6 or 7 win team. I can take an argument that the 2021 record was more of an accurate representation of what that roster was. I think Flores can coach. I'm not holding him up as the second coming of Bill Belichick but I think he can coach. I would not have fired him and he has been fired to prop up the real failure in that organisation - Chris Grier. 

[Bill from NYC]

On 2/13/2022 at 5:59 PM, Big Turk said:

 

How could it not? Everyone knows their QB is a dead man walking in the locker room and that's who they are supposed to be led by?

 

C'mon man...I think you are just looking for something that isn't there and making up fantasy land situations in your mind.

Maybe not everyone. Jaylen Waddle set some sort of record for receptions by a rookie. 

https://www.nfl.com/news/dolphins-wr-jaylen-waddle-breaks-rookie-receptions-record

 

That said, I'm pretty sure that there are ways to rarionalize around this. 

[eball]

7 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Beating good teams regularly requires good players. He didn't have many of those. He won 5 games with a roster the first year that could very conceivably have gone winless (appears Stephen Ross rather hoped they would go winless) then he won 10 games with a team that most thought was a 6 or 7 win team. I can take an argument that the 2021 record was more of an accurate representation of what that roster was. I think Flores can coach. I'm not holding him up as the second coming of Bill Belichick but I think he can coach. I would not have fired him and he has been fired to prop up the real failure in that organisation - Chris Grier. 

 

Yeah, here’s the thing — I wouldn’t have fired him either.  I just think the “legend” of Brian Flores the HC is overblown.  His best coaching job by far was 2019, and he has regressed since.  Still, he got them to winning records the last two seasons and it’s pretty unheard of to show a coach the door under those circumstances — which goes to show what a mess that organization is from top to bottom.

 

[Bill from NYC]

On 2/13/2022 at 11:07 PM, HomeTeam said:

Maybe the NFL is trying to do everything in their power to discredit Brian Flores. 

 

They are a powerful player with a large influence. They will do everything in their power to make this go away. 

What should they do? Plead guilty in court and pay him hundreds of millions of dollars to validate his allegations, some of which the veracity is doubtful? 

If someone was suing you, would you try to defend yourself or just lay down and willingly lose?

Geez! 

[GunnerBill]

11 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

What should they do? Plead guilty in court and pay him hundreds of millions of dollars to validate his allegations, some of which the veracity is doubtful? 

If someone was suing you, would you try to defend yourself or just lay down and willingly lose?

Geez! 

 

Depends if I am actually liable for the things I'm being accused of (and it is liable, not guilty, you are not guilty of civil offences). If you are liable (i.e. the allegations are true) your best bet is almost always to settle. The one exception is if you think you can just out spend your opponent and run up costs to the extent that they can't afford the risk of losing. But given this issue I strongly suspect that Flores will have attorneys working pro bono, so that probably isn't advisable. 

 

EDIT: Florio on the Superbowl pre-game did suggest that the NFL would be likely to try and take out of the courts and settle in private arbitration. 

Edited February 15, 2022 by GunnerBill